I think that Spalding is right on the button with his comments above.

I too am really interested in this concept for a future keyboard but until I can try or see more impressive demos I cant commit to such a large outlay of dosh.

I have done in the past with Yamaha and Roland instruments and even with Solton/Ketron (although I used to sell them so I did haver an idea about quality and support etc.)

I would dearly love this to be the next keyboard for me but I suspect like many others here we need more reassurance.

Regards - Keith

Hmmmmmm......... if Dominick sends one to ME to test drive, a glowing report from Uncle Dave will sell anything !
Dom?

Isn't weight going to be an issue for many. This build quality and robustness comes at a price.

Oh and no internal speakers

Certainly these are the charateristics of many popular arranger keyboards of the past (and of course the price).

I am not really sure exactly what market the MS is really trying to capture anyway. Those using a Korg OASYS who want arranger facilities or a more open system perhaps. Or perhaps those who are even more in the dark about what the Wersi is and what it can do.

Paul.

Isn't the Wersi a bit of a price issue too...I was looking at both an abacus duo pro and a MS 76Pro - opted for the MS and so far so good...Price of the MS siginificantly less than Wersi...
Mark



[This message has been edited by jonesyboy (edited 11-22-2006).]

The Abacus Duo Pro isn't a fair price comparison because it has two keyboard manuals instead of one. A standard Abacus is about $7,500.00 USD. The Abacus Duo Pro is significantly more expensive especially if you get the 25 note pedal board and expanded sound banks. The Wersi Ikarus is a better comparison, it has 76 keys and is around $5,500.00 USD.

The price of the Lionstracs is much less than the Wersi Abacus but there are some major differences in function and sound. Which one is best for you depends on your budget, needs, and technical ability.

The Mediastation X-76 has no equal in its price range because it's the only Open Ended arranger/workstation that's less than $5,000.00 USD.

Spalding, I have to agree with you. You have summed up very well what are the most likely reasons that are keeping the Mediastation from selling in high volumes. Lionstracs Marketing Department would do well to read your post in it’s entirety and make some adjustments to their marketing strategy. However, since they have no marketing department that I know of, this may, for now, fall on deaf ears.
Take a look at their staff by following this link: http://www.lionstracs.com/store/informat...32fee6d21ad294c
While I see no one assigned to Marketing, Analysis, Advertising or Distribution, I do see a very impressive list of engineers. It seems the whole company is geared towards creating and developing pro audio gear. While this may not be the most profitable design, it is rather beneficial to the end user such as myself. Lionstracs is developing what I believe to be the most advanced keyboard ever. If the Mediastation, with all of it’s amazing capabilities, was being developed by Korg, Roland, or Yamaha; with their multi-million dollar budgets; can you imagine the marketing effort that would be going on right now? Look at the one surrounding the Oasys. But for the moment Domenik and his entire staff seem emersed in the task of making all these features possible in a userfriendly GUI. I feel sure that after they have accomplished all that they currently have in mind, they will turn some of their efforts to target marketing and consumer education. Then, I believe, they will be able to recoup their research and development cost and much more.
I realize that it takes resources to fund these incredible advances in unchartered territory and I hope that a few dedicated users spreading news about what we have found will attract more of the same. As more profits are realized by the company more dollars will also go into development. I admit that I made a “leap of faith” by purchasing the Mediastation without some of the usual comforts that make a deciscion like this easier. Such as a large existing customer base and user groups, and the ability to demo in a local store.
But, I for one, am very glad that I discovered the music Industry’s “best kept secret” and didn’t hold out for a glossy full color brochure. Although that would have been nice. LOL
For anyone who feel’s they could never purchase a Mediastation until they can demo it in person, I certainly understand. We will try to continue providing info until you are able to do so. But for those who want to take advantage of this technology now, I think it is definitely worth it.

Remember inadequate marketing does not affect the product.

Richard

Ok, I finally got the full scoop on the new Mediastation Vocalist. And here it is:

Ensnareyou, you will be pleased to know it is extremely similar to the software processing for the pitch shift and time stretching features of the Mediastation, it is actually designed by the same developers

The engine that drives the Vocalist is called meloscaline. It contains Elastique, the same engine that drives the pitch shift/time stretch function. Here is a quote from their website: http://www.zplane.de/showPage.php?SPRACHE=UK&PAGE=products17

description
meloscaline is the world's first intelligent harmonizer featuring integrated voice leading rules. The original key, tuning frequency and pitches of the input melody is detected automatically in order to generate harmony voices and/or map it to another scale.
Furthermore, meloscaline transforms any recorded melody from one scale into another.
In contrast to existing technologies meloscaline choiralizer does real voice leading. The intervals of the accompanying voices are not fixed but rather chosen according to voice leading rules and the underlying harmony. meloscaline allows high quality formant preserving transposition and scale conversion, i.e. the characteristics of the original singer or instrument are maintained

technology
meloscaline choiralizer integrates sophisticated harmonic modeling and voice leading technology to generate the optimal harmonization of the input. For each input pitch, the best harmony as well as the best progression of the synthesized voices is computed, resulting in a perfect sounding hamonization (see figure).



As a technology demonstration, meloscaline illustrates the musical possibilities of the combination of various musical analysis and synthesis technologies that are offered by zplane. For the detection of the key and the standard pitch [tONaRT] is being used, while élastique SOLOIST V2.0 executes the actual transformation and voice synthesis.

More info is available on their website: http://www.zplane.de/showPage.php?SPRACHE=UK&PAGE=products17

I've said this many times before and I can't stress this enough, the Mediastation does not require the user to buy additional sounds, styles, or software to make it "sound great." There are quite a number of GIGA samples, GM/GS, NI B4, Synthesizer sounds, and Styles included with the Mediastation. Being able to load additional VST's, samples, styles, etc., is just an added bonus. Once you do so the Mediastation has little competition except the Wersi, Neko, or Oasys for sound quality. No arranger made by Yamaha, Korg, Ketron, GEM, or Roland to date has the sound capabilities of either the Mediastation, Oasys, Neko, or the Wersi.

Service or repair is most likely not going to be an issue because the unit is built so well. In the event of a failure Lionstracs could source the problem to a particular board inside the unit, ship a new board out, and the user could easily install it in less than 30-60 minutes. If the user doesn't feel comfortable doing so any good tech can swap the boards out and I'm sure Lionstracs would cover the labor costs of the swap as long as the Mediastation was still under warranty. Lionstracs service with software support and user support has been nothing but stellar so far. I see no reason why that would change anytime soon.

I will agree that these units are complex but that doesn't mean they are hard to operate. Most people who buy an arranger or workstation rarely learn all of their features. If you are using the Mediastation like any other arranger, it will be a piece of cake. If you want to get really in depth and sample, create styles from scratch, load and sync MP3 and audio files, or record extensive sequences, then you will have a longer learning curve. That curve isn't any greater than any other comparable workstation though.

The Mediastation and Wersi are akin to high end automobiles by Lamborghini, Ferrari, Aston Martin, and Bentley. You can't just go down the street and find one of these high ticket items let alone test drive one. Does that make them less viable when considering purchasing a world class product? Not in my opinion. Those who want the best will buy one no matter what. Whether or not it fits your needs may be a gamble but I'd bet the chance of you buying a Mediastation and absolutely hating it would be minimal.

Lamborghini, Ferrari, Aston Martin, and Bentley are all household names. They have been well marketed and people come to expect a certain level of quality and customer service for these prestige established vehicles. The media staion is not such a product.

Thats not to say that it wont become a house hold name in the future but it has to gain a reputation first.

Other than the GM sounds on the MS ( that in my view are still not anywhere near as good as any of the top three brand name proprietory sounds) How many Giga samples does the MS come shipped with and what are they? What do the styles sound like ? Its hard to promote a product without decent demo's or a wide enough distribution for us to play ourselves.

Any manufacturer will struggle to sell a musical instrument on its "sound capabilities". What does it actually sound like in its OTB form???? I know that you are happy with your decision to purchase the instrument and i am sure that there wil be others but i suspect the real avalanche of customers wil happen after Dom has had sufficient return on his investment to put some money back into marketing the board.