OK, now you have done it. You have got my curiosity up enough to come out of the shadows to post and expose the whole forum to some really dumb questions. First, I am a very new Yamaha PSR 740 owner. My first portable keyboard and I am struggling through the initial 40 pages of the manual. As little as I know about keyboards, I know less about computers (even this message is testing my abilities). Need I go on.
The posts about the B4 native instruments program led me to their website. Now to the dumb questions. Simply put, can I play my PSR 740 keyboard and have it sound like a Hammond B-3? Is it an actual stand alone drawbar module that can be used as an attachment to my PSR? Or is it a program package that is installed in my computer? If so, can a disk be made to use in my Yamaha or does the computer need to be connected to the PSR 740. I am soooo confused. Although I am a senior in years, this is new to me and I am trying to learn, so bear with me. Getting a Hammond B-3 sound out of my PSR sounds to good to be true. So before I depart with my hard earned money to try something I know nothing about, could someone give me some very basic information in simple terms. See, I told you I had some really stupid questions, and just proved it.
BTW, in the winter I live in one of those "age restricted communities" that many of you have kindly noted you enjoy performing. Believe me, for many of us, it is the highlight of our week and is our pleasure.
Whew, it has taken me about 3 hours to construct this message. Better send it before I forget. I need a nap.
Thanks in advance for any comments.
Jack
P.S. Bought my PSR 740, because of this forum, from George Kaye (a frequent poster here) Music Scene. He is as sincere and helpful in person as he is on the message board. George, you ARE reading this aren't you?

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[This message has been edited by Jack Gittleson (edited 12-28-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Jack Gittleson (edited 12-28-2000).]

Hi Jack,
First of all, congratualations on successfully posting on this board. I am not a Yamaha PSR 740 owner (I play a Technics KN5000), so can't answer your PSR 740 questions but I know there are a number of Yamaha players on this board who will help you. Where is Banning, California? If it is'nt not too far away from where I live (San Francisco Bay area), I would enjoy performing for your retirement community.
Congratulations on your new PSR 740
- Scott

Hi Jack,
I've been so busy this holiday season at the store that I haven't read any postings in this group for several days. Your's is the first one I saw tonight and I'm just writing to say hello and welcome you back to sunny California for the long winter. I'm glad your enjoying the PSR 740 after trying some of those "big buck" keyboards you tried.
Regards to you and your wife,
George Kaye

Hi Scott

In answer to your question "Where is Banning, Ca", it is in Southern Ca. between Palm Springs and Riverside. Unfortunately, way too far for you to profitably do a one night gig. Too bad, it sounds like you would be ideal for the many groups that have monthly parties in our ballroom. Oh well.

My questions are not about the Yamaha keyboard, but the B-4 (software package I guess) from a manufacturer called Native Instruments. There have been two topics on this in the last few weeks. Where are you Fran Carango and Roel.

There is a glowing review in Keyboard Magazine I found on the internet under, strangely enough, Keyboard Magazine. Uncle Dave had written there was a review for keyboard amps in it, and while I didn't find that I did run across the B-4 review. I STILL do not know what the hell it is, strictly a software program or a hold in your hand object with metal,plastic drawbars , wood or whatever, that magically makes my measly PSR 740 sound like a $10,000 Hammond B-3 with a Leslie tone cabinet. That sound gets my juices going, throwing money all over the place, trying to recapture my youth. I need a drink.

Jack

1) The B4 is a software program that you install on your computer, you would use your 740 to control it. It would need a good sound card, and excellent speakers, maybe even a keybord amp setup to sound really great.
2) There is no way to make a disk from the B4 program that will run in your 740.
3) The good news is your 740 has a "Drawbar' mode that helps it recreate some of those Hammond sounds. I have a 730, the previous model, and it has some very usable Hammond sounds, especially if you play it thru a keyboard amp, or a really high power stereo system.
4) unless you want to invest in a fast computer, witha great sound card, and a really good speaker and amp system for it, plus be tied to your computer when you play, the best alternative for that "true B3 sound" is a hardware module that you connect to your 740's midi ports. VOCE makes one of the best, (VOCE V5) it sells for about a grand I think, and would require an amp, but it has real drawbars, and great Leslie simulation.
5) the other choice would be a dedicated B3 keyboard. Roland makes one, Hammond/Suzuki makes one, Oberhiem makes 2, one of them is a double manual model, that also has optional foot pedals. It is called the OB5, and retails for about $1600. I have heard that it is not quite as good as the VOCE module, but the idea of two manuals intrigues me.

Play around with your 740, I am sure you will get some B3 sounds that will satify you for a while... then you can consider the alternatives...

hope this helps,
Dave (Can't get enough of that "Hammond" sound) Waldman

OK Jack - sit back and relax!
The B4 is ALL it is said to be. It's NOT a stand alone piece; it needs to be installed in a computer, and played from a midi interface TO the computer. It CANNOT be installed into any keyboard, but it sounds so good you may not mind having the PC close at hand. I took it out tonite for the first time and the crowd went nuts! I have a bartender that's really into jazz, and especially organ greats like Smith & McGriff - he was in heaven.(even with my chops!) I recommend a laptop for convienience but if you don't need portability - any 200Mx PII should do fine. The requirements say 266Mhz, but it runs great on my 200 PImmx machine.
Now details:
1)leslie simulation is FANTASTIC! the mod wheel controls the fast/slow change. You can also access it by clicking the mouse button on the icon with the "flip switch"
mic placement, speed etc - all programable.
2)program changes work like a charm
3)you can run it in "minimized" form and use the PC at the same time - I play sequences from the explorer window into a separate sound source, because the B4 uses the internal sound card for tone.
4)drawbars work sooooooo good
5)velocity can be turned on or off (cool)
6)graphics are sooooo hip - looks like the real thing - every detail is there
7) easy click switches for percussion, overdrive, etc.....anything! Chorus, vibrato - you name it.
* * * I give this product a hearty A+++++++
It's better than any other module I've played and I've had the Voce, Hammond, VK7 - I've had 'em all. This is a winner. If you have access to a PC while you play - you'll LOVE it ! I really had a ball tonite.

Welcome aboard Jack. As a new 740 owner, you should join the PSR groups run by Bob Gelman. There is much valuable information there and it is free. You can always get your PSR questions answered by someone.
Check it out: http://www.egroups.com/messages/yamaha-psr-styles
The 740 has some really good "drawbars" that can be customized and saved. They sound great through stereo amp.
DonM

Thanks for the replys.
That is quite an endorsement, Uncle Dave, and is similar to the other reviews I have read. I have just called Native Instruments, and they are sending me a flyer or brochure. I had it in my mind this was a module with drawbars I could play with, but that was just a picture of what is on the screen, I guess. My feeble mind can't comprehend how this operates. For example, changing the drawbar settings. Is this done only with a mouse on the screen or can it be operated through my Yamaha? Before I part with my $235.00, I will have to understand this a lot better. But I am sure it is something I am going to HAVE to have. By the way, my keyboard never leaves the house, so portability is not an issue. My musical abilities are greatly challenged and I have no pretense of any vast improvemnt. But I would sure like to capture that B-3 sound even if it is only on the simple songs I can play.
Any more comments on this subject? Would love to hear them. I have a lot more time than money.

Regards,
Jack

[This message has been edited by Jack Gittleson (edited 12-30-2000).]

Some of the questions on the B4 software might be cleared by first downloading a free demo version from the Native Instruments site. I am still not clear on what are the features removed on the free version. I am glad that the software has been found acceptable and may get it later. I personally favor a trend towards software arrangers and computer sound cards, using keyboard controllers that do not obsolete so often. That way we could have more real-time levers, sticks, pedals, eliminating many buttons that are not for realtime use, from the keyboards.

THe drawbars can be operated manually with an outboard device such as a JLCooper "Fadermaster" or the Peavey 16 ch CC box(NOT the name)
For everyday ease of use - you'd want to write custom drwbar settings into patches and change them from the keyboards buttons. I used it the other night with a live drummer, and was not able to take my left hand off the keys(I play manual bass lines)so working thje leslie F/S was a little tricky, but I had the laptop sitting right over the pitch bend wheel on my keyboard. I was able to "sneak" my pinky up and hit the mouse button to trigger the effect. It was pretty cool, but much easier to use with the arranger on - frees up my left hand a little.
***Also - the Guiter Center is selling that item for $150 or less, so don't order direct!

Uncle Dave,

I assume that item you are referring to is the B-4 Native Instruments software package. I called the closest Guitar Center to me, San Bernadino, and he didn't show it in inventory. I am not sure he knew what he was looking for. Anyway, which Guitar Center were you able to find this for less than $150.00?

Thanks,
Jack


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Fairless Hills / Oxford Vally Pa
on Business rt1 north of Langhorne Pa
about 5 miles north of exit 28 on the PA tpk.
Ask for Elliot, the mgr. and tell him you know he already sold one at that price.

After reading good reviews here on the B4 software, I uninstalled my demo version and downloaded a fresh copy. This new demo version works better. This one I can play in real time, the other one I never could. This one gets some notes stuck ocassionally, the other one could play 2 notes simultaneous max, probaly due to my older PC.

I am planning to set the full version on a better PC and would appreciate answers on on the following:

1. Appx Cost of physical modules to do as drawbars, suggestions, even if not verified.
How do they connect?

2. Looks like one can use two sets of keyboards, would probably get a MIDI controller board only, and would use it below the PSR-740. Suggestions, number of keys, real time controls? Programable MIDI command switches?

3. Pedals. Can they be used?

4. How to hook the second keyboard to the PC?

5. How to hook the pedals (I assume MIDI) to the PC?

6. Amplified instrument speakers hooked to the PC, a reasonable model? I think this is required since the amplified speakers I use don't seem to be good enough for the B4 sound.

7. Set up would be only for self use, not portable. Cost must be reasonable.

8. Uncle Dave: I figure if one gets software non-direct, one still is entitled to download upgrades? I saw they want a password. Were you OK'd to upgrade from their website? Are you using Windows98, Milenium? Or perhaps Mac?

Thanks for the replies.

YOU ASKED:
8. Uncle Dave: I figure if one gets software non-direct, one still is entitled to download upgrades? I saw they want a password. Were you OK'd to upgrade from their website? Are you using Windows98, Milenium? Or perhaps Mac?

***Yes, you are intitled to all factory befifits if you purchase for an authorised reseller. I haven't gone to the website yet - and i am using Win95 on a 200Mhz PC with 64Mb RAM. It's even below the recommendatins, and it works great.

I re-did my PC to Pentium II at 400MHZ, Win98, and the B4 demo works great.

I ordered the B4 from Musicians Friend last week for $150 from the web.

In reserching B3's etc., I found this VERY interesting site on the history of synths:
-------------------------------- http://www.newmusicbox.orgthird-person/oct99/keyboard.html
--------------------------------
Did you guys know that the first synth, the TELHARMONIUM was delivered to NYC in 30 railroad cars and it filled a building?

(talk about removing speakers for less weight? This one used no speakers, tube amps were not yet invented.)

Thanks to all.

mbl

The correct web address is:
http://www.newmusicbox.org/third-person/oct99/keyboard.html

Sorry, a slash is missing in above post.

mbl

I have a PSR740 and gig it together with a Hammond XM-1. I can't say how this compares to the B4, but it does give you a real box you can kick and drawbars you can pull, sound is pretty good too. I also have a Hammond T-500 which is their last tonewheel organ and the XM-1 compares favourably, but doesn't have that nice smell of warm oil after an hour or so!

The PSR740 isn't the ideal master keyboard because midi configuration data is not stored as part of the user presets. The best way I have found so far to have access to both PSR and Hammond sounds is to dedicate R2 setting to drive the external module and mute R2's sound in the PSR's mixer. Anyone have any thoughts on this?

The PSR's own drawbars are OK and an improvemnet over the PSR8000, but not in the top league. Sound 40 (electric organ) is also useful for some things.

Good luck

Paul

I am now VERY happy with the B4. I upgraded it at the Native Instruments site and MANY important functions can now be triggered with the computer keyboard. The spacebar, for instance, toggles F/S rotor speed.

Part of my computer upgrading was a MS 'internet' keyboard. Well, that keyboard has -/+ VOLUME control buttons, so I can now lower the sound-card volume from the computer keyboard (very nice).

In the 740, I set R1 to ORGAN FLUTES and lower the flutes to zero, effectively obtaining a SILENT VOICE (credit to Dr. Simon at PK forum). So now I can use autoac of the 740 piped INTO the computer, and the foot volume in control the SILENT voice.

In the B40, the modulation wheel toggles f/s rotor speed also.

The REGISTRATION buttons are recognized by the B4 but I am stil working on other things before I figure what the B4 wants and whether or not the PSR can send it, else I'll get a Peavy or something.

I find that MIDI cables, sound cables,MODEM, MONITOR, speaker cables, mouse, keyboard, printer, TV antenna, scussi scanner, mic, etc. are TOO MANY in 8"SQUARE, and a loose cable can cause noise at higher volume levels. So I am gradually going into universal bus which can now connect many MIDI ports and most newer pc stuff.

To me, the PSR-740 organ voices sound like TOY voices (through the same sound card and speakers), compared to the B4 sounds!