wondered into Best Buy to look at some of the New Consumer keyboards on the Market. Like Casio's new digital piano and Yamaha's DGX-500 and a smaller 76 note portable grand. I am amazed by how far consumer keyboards have come with in the last 10 years. Even as to use a famous pop artist's song for a demo. One of the Yamaha's I looked at had a demo of Nora Jones song "Don't Know". That was a pleasent suprise, becuase most demos on those keyboards are usually by lesser known or even unknow composers.

I went to Guitar Center and spent 4 hours or so trying out all the "cheapie keyboards" below $500.

There was really none better that would encourage me to play than the CASIO WK3000 or the WK3500. And I am a longtime owner of professional arrangers costing $1000 and up from Technics, Roland, Yamahas and KORGS. The WK can still give me joy. Great sounds for little dough!

I have just acquired a Yamaha DGX 505 88 note keyboard and it really is a remarkable bit of kit for the money. It is mainly a piano but still has many of the Tyros styles and sweet voices. I bought it mainly for practice at home to save setting up the Tyros but I shall be sorely tempted to use it on some gigs as well.

Trevor

Hi Trevor,
I've been thinking of getting an inexpensive psr type keyboard as a controller. Though I'm more inclined to go for the 76 note of the dgx for slightly more portability. Unfortunately I need a USB connection to my laptop and psr450/550 don't have that so that leaves them out.

Just out of interest how does it stack up against your Tyros soundwise? ie if you listened to it through the same set of speakers. Also from what I've read, the styles only have 1 intro/ending plus 2 variations & fills ( not a problem for me)

I actually sold all my expensive arrangers and decided to go the software route like (Frank, flr). So I've been using OMB software with the xg sounds in my Yamaha CLP170 Piano . Now I'm swapping my sound source for the styles to the Edirol Hypercanvas softsynth.

I've been thinking if I actually got something like the dgx, I may be able to use it for triggering the styles and use the
laptop/hypercanvas as a sound module.

best wishes
Rikki






[This message has been edited by rikkisbears (edited 10-12-2004).]

The DGX505 has great keys(better than CASIO) but I still think the voices pale compares to the CASIO WK3000 series. Right, George Kaye who is a respected dealer that sells and knows all those home keyboards quite well ?

Not only that but the CASIO can download NEW samples of voice. Totally new samples from the websites. You can basically create anything you wanted.

Before you buy it, play the casio for a good 20 minutes and compare the DGX and more than likely you will find the CASIO better by far. Especially the pianos, ep's and almost in every categories.

I have to agree with Lukitoh. I have a Casio WK-3500 myself. While the DGX will give you better keys, the Casio will still give you 76 keys and great voices. Plus the Casio gives you more control over voice parameters, and as Lukitoh stated you can download completely new samples (huge plus!) I also like that the WK-3500 has both floppy and Smart Media Card. If you like organs you also get digital drawbars with the Casio. Both models will have their good and bad sounds too. Oh yeah the Casio also has a digital EQ with preset and user settings as well. If you compare the WK-3500/3000 with the 76 key DGX I'd say the Casio is the winner there... Oh don't forget the Casio allows you to load new styles, and even though it does not record styles you can use the Casio software to convert SMF's into styles.

Squeak

Thank you Lukitoh,
no doubt the casio's sound great, but I'm a style nut, and what I'm actually after is an inexepensive keyboard that loads and plays psr styles.
Strange thing to say, but the sounds are actually irrelavent to me. If they're good, then great, if not, doesn't matter either.
The one thing I do need is for it to be able to load a psr style.
I'm not sure if what I'm planning to do will actually work but,
I want the keyboard to be able to load and play the style, but for the sound source I'll actually be using my laptop & Hypercanvas softsynth instead of the keyboards sounds ie keyboard will be midied to laptop.

I used to do this back in the early 90's when most of the arranger keyboards had pretty poor sounds, I used to midi keyboard up to an array of synthesizer & sampler sound modules. But this time round instead of sound modules, I'm hoping I can do it with my laptop and softsynths.

Reason for a psr style instead of korg or roland etc is that there are a number of freebie programs online to help with psr style creation, plus Jos's One Man Band program is really great for editing and creating psr styles from midifile etc, I'm even using it as my realtime arranger at the moment. So it doesn't really matter whether I can do any style editing in the keyboard itself.

I just enjoy experimenting (haa haa)

thanks guys

best wishes
Rikki


[This message has been edited by rikkisbears (edited 10-12-2004).]

Hi Squeak,
no, I didn't realize Casio allowed one to create styles from midifiles. That's something I was totally unaware of. Is there somewhere I can get a bit more info on the software and how it works.


Must admit that's one reason I wouldn't have considered a casio, I always thought that one was stuck with the onboard styles, or the styles casio supplied online on their website.

Thanks for pointing that out.

best wishes
Rikki

Hi Rikki
As I said I bought the DGX primarily to use for practice at home as a piano so the limited style endings and variations are not a problem.
The keyboard has USB connection but not a standard midi connector. Certainly one can download from the laptop into the Smart Media card.
The sounds, to me, through my system are virtually indistinguishable from those of the Tyros but I have only tried it at "domestic" volume for obvious reasons.
Sounds, as we all know are subjective and I can only say that IMHO the Pianos on the DGX
knock the Casios into a cocked hat as we old Limeys say.
All the best
Trevor

Hi Trevor,
my stuff is all only for home use.
Actually the "no midi" might cause a problem. There again, if I can record a song to an external software sequencer, then it won't be a problem either.
I've downloaded the manual, so hopefully that will tell me.
Interesting that the sounds appear to be such good quality.
Must admit I'm a Yamaha piano fan. My CLP170 piano, sounds fantastic ( not terribly portable though (haahaa)
Can't personally compare Yamaha piano sound with the Casio as I've never heard one.

If I get the opportunity I'll check both, I know I can get the DGX at a really good price through my regular dealer, he's offered to get me one in, but he doesn't stock casio so that makes it a bit more difficult..

Ahh, you're from England, my son's favourite place in the world.

Thanks Trevor

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by trevorjohn:
[B]Hi Rikki

rikkisbears,
Go to music.casio.com The software for the Casio's is there

Squeak

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 10-13-2004).]

Rikki,
If you get an inexpensive arranger you will only have a couple of variations. Still not sure why you want to go down this road, except that you will have the arranger control buttons (sync start, stop,fill,variation,etc.). If you like OMB and going down the soft-arranger route, why not listen to Frank and get a controller keyboard? You can get a 76 note, great key feel, full size keys, MIDI control messages, I think it has sliders too,Includes 2 independent MIDI outputs, MIDI In and Thru, plus Hold and Foot Pedal inputs (Roland A37). You can use the lower notes for the sync start, fills, etc. I was thinking that if I purchased a 76 note keyboard, that I would label the bottom notes.
I'm a little jealous that you got your softsynth-arranger to work to your liking. I would use my aranger as a controller because I wouldn't have to go buy a controller, at least not immediately.
Will have to try OMB and see if I get better results. I also have to bring my PSR550 home, so I can A/B soft-aranger against the PSR550 XG to find out exactly what is missing.
Starkeeper

[This message has been edited by Starkeeper (edited 10-13-2004).]

Thank you Squeak.

best wishes
Rikki

Hi Starkeeper,
I moved my rather long winded answer to another post. It was heading a bit off topic http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/009105.html

best wishes
Rikki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Starkeeper:
[B]Rikki,

Hi Guys,
well, after a lot of to-ing and fro-ing I ended up ordering a dgx305 ( sight unseen ). It's mainly that it loads & plays a psr style, which is what I'm primarily after.
I had a listen to some of the casio demo's on site, and they sounded amazingly good, but the dgx fits in better with what I'm trying to do.
Really can't beleive the quality & features of the lower priced keyboards nowadays. Could have bought 6 dgx's for my 1 clp170 piano ( don't know where I would have put them all though (haahaa)

best wishes
Rikki

Glad you found one that works for you Give us a review after you've had some time on it....

Squeak

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 10-14-2004).]

Im also having great success with OMB 7.1 !!
Im using it with my Motif ES7.. and what I really love about it, is that im able to say record in realtime what I play into the Motif's internal SONG sequencer. Its really cool, cause all i do is set the sequencer filter to not let the sounds I choose on my motif change, then when I record the song, live playing all the backing tracks, then once its recorded in the motif, I play back the song on the motif and add all my melodies on the other available tracks.
Its really working out really awsome !!

You know, I really loved the PSR8000 styles that Jos has on his website. Theyre so awsome and inspiring and are working so cool with the MOTIF ES7. Right now, im going thru them and havent even changed the default sounds, so im using the GM sounds of the motif, but they sound so AWSOME !! Even with the GM sounds and the onboard effects of the ES.

Now i cant wait till I full tweak the default sounds and select the onboard sounds of the ES.. wow...
Oh, and with this Mlan Option, it truly is giving me flexibility beyond anything I have ever dreamed.

I truly think One Man Band has saved me so much money and given me so much flexibility. The only thing I do no like is the extra work one has to do, to fix styles that you download that are not working fine righ off the bat..But then again, thats the beauty of OMB, you have all the fixing tools at your disposal.

Im even thinking of getting a touchSCreen from EBay. I say some LCD flatpanels for less than 300 bucks.. thats not bad.. I want to create my very own arranger.. I think my last piece of the puzzle is the Touchscreen.

I really like the way things are working right now. Really, I got used to using my Korg i30 in where I would record the Backing tracks in the backing sequencer, then move the song to the SONG sequencer, and edit some more and add my final melodies or leads..

Now im doing exactly that with the Motif ES and One Man Band !! I record my Backing sequence live as I play the song from my PC via OMB, and that gets recorded in realtime with fills, variation changes, etc etc.. into the Motif ES, I could also record the melodies into its own individual tracks if I wished, but I like to do that later. Everything coming from OMB from the PC into the ES sequencer gets recorded in one single pass into its own individual physical track in the Motif's sequencer. I have Eight insert effects to apply to the Backing tracks, plus two master Effects, and one System effects, plus individual EQ for each track !! This is a dream come true for me !!

Oh, and once I have the whole song done, I can just send the entire mix as a stereo output via Mlan16e to Cubase SX, do do a master track, or send everything via the 14 individual outputs of the mlan plus the two master outputs via mlan to cubase. There it is turned into Pure digital audio to be mixed with vocals, acoustic guitars, electric leads, etc etc.. and I can then resend all that stuff to the eight mlan inputs, mute my sequencer tracks, and have it all go throu the Motif effects again to finalize the mix and master the entire output in Cubase sx.

Its really intriguing to say the least, and mind boggling at first, but little by little im learning. But everything is falling into place now. Im really happy with this setup.

I still with it all was in one Keyboard like the Mediastation X-76, but I have to do with what i have right now.

The beauty of OMB is that you dont have to have a motif to do what im doing, you can have a very economical casio or lower model yammie or any keyboard with midi in and out, and have awsome styles to work with..

Peace to all........

------------------
Peace,

Musikman4Christ........

Hi Squeak,
Will do.

best wishes
Rikki

Hi Musikman,
great to see you're such a fan also of omb software.

I've saved myself a fortune too. Over the last year or so gone are my 9000pro, va7 & kn7000. Finally came to the realization after all these years , that as a hobbyist, what on earth am I doing with all this expensive equipment.

I can do most of the stuff I want ( I mainly fiddle round with styles) with an inexpensive piece of software, a laptop and a controller and a sound source.

OMB has given me similar style editing tools that I so much loved in my KN7000.
One just needs to have the spare time to tweak the styles. There again , most style conversions need tweaking anyway.

best wishes
Rikki

After playing the 505 at BJ's Whiolsesale Club for an hourr, I would have no reservations at all about setting up this board in a restaurant/nite-club setting and using it on a regular basis. It has lots of great features, the sounds are great, and if a drunk dumps a glass of beer on it, the loss is not nearly as substantial as loosing a Tyros. However, I'm no longer doing restaurants and bars, therefore, it's too much weight for an old man like me to lug around.

Gary

Awe Gary,
get a li'l DGX305 like me only 20lbs.
I think my KN7 was double that, one reason I didn't want to drag it round with me, I was worried one day I'd drop it, and it would have been pretty much irreplaceable.

Reasurring you guys think they sound so good.

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by travlin'easy:
[B]