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#129015 - 07/21/01 11:20 PM The search for the perfect sax
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
I have read Boo's topic and have to agree with him: I LOVE the sax solo on "Just the way you are".
I agree with Boo also on the lack of interesting topics recently (maybe because many of us are off for holidays) and so (taking inspiration from Fran Carango's topic about sax sounds) have thought to ask to all the people on this board, what -in their opinion- is the best tenor/alto/soprano sax sound in all the arranger keyboards.
I love the tenor sax of my VA7 (Blowed Sax), but they sampled it with vibrato inside, so if I play sustained notes that vibrato effect becomes quite annoying. I love the tenor sax of the X1 too (heard on Notlos' songs), but didn't like too much the SD1 tenor sax (not even the Pop tenor suggested by Dan O). So this could be the right time to compare the sounds from our keyboards and maybe even record something to let other people hear and judge.
What do you think, guys?
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Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#129016 - 07/22/01 04:29 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Gunnar Jonny Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 04/01/01
Posts: 4391
Loc: Norway
Hi Dreamer.
At first I read it totally wrong, and thought
it was the "perfect sex" ,
but when I found my glasses, I could see
that you talking about sax.
Well, only joking......
I guess except from the sax'es in the KN, there's
nothing like the original, the real thing!
GJ
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GJ
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but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)

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#129017 - 07/22/01 06:10 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Graham UK Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/20/01
Posts: 1925
Loc: Lincolnshire UK
Dreamer.......You are wasting your time asking Boo about the best SAX sample on a keyboard because he does not think any of them come near to the real thing..........obviously he plays the real thing and should know and he has stated before, nothing is going to compare...........possibly one day, we live in hope of a near perfect sample??

Graham UK

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#129018 - 07/22/01 07:11 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
brickboo Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 2071
Loc: Fruita, Colorado, USA
I have a Trombone sound on the i30 that I like. I guess Trombones are easier than Sax. The Technics has a few excellent Trumpets. The Sax sounds must be harder. I don't know why.

Trumpets and Trombones can bend a note naturally with the lip just as the Sax can. Maybe it will never happen.

The pianos, vibes and guitars to me are remarkable. And like I said before. I really like that no matter what the sound of any of the instruments are, you can't beat the fact that they are on pitch. In tune as one would say. I love it.
Boo
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I'm not prejudiced, I hate everybody!! Ha ha! My Sister-In-Law had this tee shirt. She was a riot!!!

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#129019 - 07/23/01 12:07 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Nobby Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/00
Posts: 707
Loc: Palmyra Mo. U.S.A.
Hey Boo,
I can still pound out a pretty mean Yak-a-tee-Sax (probably didn't spell that right) on my old 510 Yammy!
Cheers,
Nobby

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Nobby

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#129020 - 07/23/01 09:54 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
Nobby,
There is a style on the 510 with which I used to play "Bo Diddly", "Not Fade Away" and "Who Do You Love?". I think it was called Rock and Roll but I'm not certain. I've never heard this beat on any of the other keyboards. I would love to have it converted, but as far as I know, nobody has been able to convert 500 or 510 styles. They were made before Yamahas Stylefile format came along.
The 510 also has some other great styles that fit specific songs. I remember one for "Lyin' Eyes" by the Eagles, of course "My Way" and a few others. It's a great little keyboard that was ahead of it's time in many ways.
DonM
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#129021 - 07/23/01 09:57 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
danb Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/98
Posts: 306
Speaking of sax, what is the best value sax that I can buy? I have a passion for playing sax but I don't have one. Do you think a 40 year old guy will still have a chance to learn to play sax? I can play it with my keyboard although the sound doesn't 100% the same with the real thing. Should I buy sax or just stick to play keyboard for the rest of my life. I can play all kinds of instruments (keys, guitar, bass, drums, percussions, but not the reeds, horns and the like).

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#129022 - 07/23/01 01:35 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Hmmm.... I guess we are drifting away a bit. Let me be more specific: I am so crazy about the sax sound that I could buy a new keyboard just to have that killer Stan Getz sound. I know that Yamaha has a tradition about woodwinds, and the X1 had an excellent sax (not so the SD1). So what I am asking is: what do Yamaha owners think of their sax sound? Anyone heard a Motif? What about the Motif sax? And how do SD1 owners (like Roel, Notlos, John Smies, etc) compare the X1 to the SD1, sax-wise?
Thanks
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Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#129023 - 07/23/01 02:30 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
notlos Offline
Member

Registered: 04/03/00
Posts: 353
Loc: Belgium
Hi dreamer,
on the x1 suplement disk's (super solo's vol.1) there is a ""GREAT"" sax called "NIGHTSAX" This is the sound that sound like the old days when Stan Getz plays his bossa-nova's. I made sometimes ago a arrangement on jobim's "vivo sohando" (strange the title in english is "DREAMER"!)
Here i used that sax for the Getz-sound, and i found it amazing good !!!

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Every time a tree is cut down here on earth, i believe it will grow again somewhere else-in some other world. So, when i die, it is to this place that i want to go, where forest live in peace... ACJ

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#129024 - 07/23/01 04:05 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Frank Bez Offline
Member

Registered: 12/11/99
Posts: 260
Loc: Avila Beach, CA, U.S.A.
Hi Dreamer,

This is by far the most difficulty question you have asked, for the proof is in the sound, not the talk. So, I have recorded my basic sax sound for you, which I feel can be achieved in any of the better keyboards. My favorite player was Paul Desmond, who played an even sweeter horn that Getz. The sound is in your face, but mellow. The reason I feel this sound can be produced by almost any keyboard is because of the processing.

In My KN6000 I start with the factory Soprano panned one third to the right and the same Soprano panned one third to the left. Each has a modest Reverb, which Technics calls Bright 1. In addition the Soprano on the right has DSP on it which Technics calls Space and it is set to 100. For the most part I play this set up in the alto or tenor ranges. In the demo song I do both. Even though I generally introduce a clarinet in a big band sax section sound, the two Soprano set up works fine for section playing too, which is what you hear in the demo.

To hear this little project click on Sax on the mp3 page of: www.Kool-Keys.com

Still hangin in, but pushing hard toward age 71,

Frank

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#129025 - 07/23/01 07:27 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Henry01 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 130
Loc: Dublin, California, USA
notlos,

'NightSax' is also on SD1's hard disk in folder 'Sound'. In fact, it has most of the Super Solo sounds plus a good Accordion sound.

Henry

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#129026 - 07/23/01 07:48 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
brickboo Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 2071
Loc: Fruita, Colorado, USA
Danb,
Go here http://www.geocities.com/saxontheweb/index.html

This is a Sax forum. I don't have any idea which is the best new low end sax. I still play a Buescher "400" that I bought in '63 or so to replace a Selmer MarkIV that was stolen out of the club I was playing in at the time.

Expect a lot of different suggestions just as on this forum.

If you can get a good Buescher "400" off of ebay for $1200 or so go for it. It cost me $475 new. Selmers at the time were going for $595. I got a store that was going out of business. Buschers were maybe $525 at the time. Selmer MarkIV from the 50's and 60's are going for $3500 and up if in good condition today.

There is a remodel contractor about 60 years old I know that bought a brand new Selmer Alto sax a year or so ago and started taking sax lessons. If you have the bucks, lessons will move you much faster.

Boo
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I'm not prejudiced, I hate everybody!! Ha ha! My Sister-In-Law had this tee shirt. She was a riot!!!

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#129027 - 07/23/01 11:43 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
ChicoBrasil Offline
Member

Registered: 06/09/01
Posts: 993
Loc: Belo Horizonte,Minas Gerais,Br...
Dom M.
I have still four Psr510's in my kb school.
Pls,give me the way to make use of this in
news yamis (9000 for ex.)
Mbr,ChicoBrasil

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ChicoBrasil

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#129028 - 07/24/01 02:15 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Frank,
I have downloaded your song labelled "Sax" (which was nothing else than the beautiful Georgia on my mind); thank you for your help. The KN 6500 has a great alto sax indeed and I like your expressive playing. You are a multitalented man indeed and it's too bad that we know each other just through the Internet (this applies to other members of this Forum as well; maybe we should really have some kind of annual Convention... who knows?)
Dirk, did you use the "Night sax" in any of your MP3s? I remember that John Smies mentioned a killer sax sound from the MS 100; does anyone know if those sounds (from the MS series) are to be found on the SD1 hard disk as well?
Henry01, since you look the most acknowledged among the SD1 owners, can you tell us if the SD1 accepts midi sample dump and, when sampling a new sound, does it allow (like a dedicate sampler) to layer a multi-sample throughout the keyboard with different split points? Did anyone have a chance to assess the SD1 sampling quality?
Thank you all and a long life to our beautiful Forum.
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#129029 - 07/24/01 02:26 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Joe,Joey,JoJo Offline
Member

Registered: 03/25/01
Posts: 33
Loc: Detroit USA
HEY GUYS

SAX HUH ?

HOW BOUT YAMAHA VL7 OR THE NEW MOTIF 6,8 ?

I THINK IT THE BEST
AND PLUS YOU HAVE BREATH CONTROLE ...


JOEY
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Joe,Joey,JoJo

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#129030 - 07/24/01 07:45 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
Chicobrasil,
I'm not sure how the 510's could be used with the newer gear, except as an extra keyboard. As I mentioned, some of the old styles are very useful, but are not compatible with the new keyboards. I was hoping somebody knew how to convert them.
I suppose someone could record sequences of the styles (song format), then convert the sequences into styles somehow. I know there is a program available for the Korg PA80 to convert midi to styles, but I haven't tried it.
DonM

[This message has been edited by DonM (edited 07-24-2001).]
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#129031 - 07/24/01 08:22 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Henry01 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 130
Loc: Dublin, California, USA
Dreamer,

MIDI sample dump is usually machine specific, I don't think SD1 supports it. SD1 can read/load .WAV, .MSP (multi-samples), and .INS (Ketron optimized wave format) files up to 16MB. You can layer up to 62 wave files across the keyboard and save it as a .MSP, multi-sample file. For a 61 keys keyboard, that's up to 1 wave sample per key! The sampling quality is very good. It supports a XLR input and a 1/4" input.

Henry

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#129032 - 07/24/01 01:37 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Leon Offline
Member

Registered: 04/14/99
Posts: 585
Loc: British Columbia
Good Sax huh?? I gotta go with my T3, along with the joystick I can get a true breathy sound. Just my thots!!
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#129033 - 07/24/01 02:43 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
Dreamer,

Every one to his taste ,but in all the keyboards I have had over the years , the best sax to me is the BLOWSAX from the Solton MS keyboards. I was shocked to find out it had been omitted from the SD-1 internal sounds, but as Henry already pointed out this sax, or virtually the same one, has been included on the harddisk soundfile. (as well as the outstanding musette/accordeon sound, also dating back to the years of the MS series).
However having said all that I seem to recall that the breathy sax on e.g. the PSR9000 is also very worthwhile, and ,like I mentioned before on so many occasions, there's nothing stopping anyone from running to the nearest sax player he knows and sampling the 'perfect' sax, THAT'S WHY THEY HAVE INCLUDED SAMPLING ON ALMOST EVERY TOPRANGE KEYBOARD these days. But like I said, the solton blowsax would be among the finest sax samples that I know of..........

saluti !!!!

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#129034 - 07/26/01 01:27 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Micco Offline
Member

Registered: 12/07/99
Posts: 177
Loc: Finland
I think that the PSR9000 has the best sax sounds. I have been comparing the sax sounds because I play tenor saxophone myself and next week I will start to play soprano sax also, but first I have to buy a good soprano sax. At the moment I have Yamaha YTS-62E tenor sax which has a great sound and I think the tenor sax sound on the PSR9000 is from this horn. At least they sound so similar and here it is amazing how close the keyboard can come to the real thing. It is like the piano sound on the Technics KN6000 and the real Steinway grand piano.

Micco

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#129035 - 07/26/01 05:23 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
I wonder if the new Yamaha Motif has the same sax sounds as the PSR 9000; I know that many sounds (like the acoustic piano) are the same, so maybe this applies to the woodwinds too. By the way, the Motif should be less expensive than a PSR 9000 (and I hope Yamaha will come up with a Motif module soon).
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#129036 - 07/26/01 08:55 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
svpworld Offline
Member

Registered: 08/16/00
Posts: 442
Loc: UK
I've got a Yamaha TG500, and I have to say that it as one of the best most authentic sax solo sounds I've heard on anything. The Yamaha PSR740 soprano sax is nice if you set the modulation wheel to alter filter brightness and then set it to its minimum, aka Kenny G... and if you play solo, you can use the mod wheel to enhance the sound. You can hear a nice example of this if youve got a PSR keyboard by listening to my midifile BabyRest, an original composition at http://svpworld.com/svpmidifiles.htm

Regards
Simon
SVPworld



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Simon G.K. Williams
simon@svpworld.com
Creative Music & Multimedia
http://www.svpworld.com
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#129037 - 07/29/01 10:06 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
COMALite J Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/99
Posts: 86
Loc: Shreveport, LA, USA

No samp­led sax sound can ev­er sound quite like the Real Thing. Sax­es are among the most var­i­ab­le of in­stru­ments in their to­nal qual­ity and na­ture even dur­ing a sing­le note, and a samp­le can only cap­ture the par­tic­ul­ar var­i­a­tion(s) that the or­ig­in­al play­er of the real sax be­ing samp­led ac­tu­al­ly used. Once you have that dig­it­ized recording (which is all a samp­le is, after all), there’s not that much you can do to it (not in real-time, an­y­way) that would mim­ic what a real sax play­er could do.

Oh, you could va­ry the vi­bra­to depth with your Mod wheel, or set that or a foot ped­al or af­ter-touch to con­trol dig­it­al sub­trac­tive fil­ters to sim­u­late “bright­ness,” or even cross-fade be­tween mul­tip­le samp­les based on af­ter-touch pres­sure (per­haps the most re­al­is­tic thing you can do with samp­les but still not all that re­al­ist­ic: when a real sax player bright­ens his tone, he is not cross-fad­ing be­tween a mel­low sax sound and a bright one!), etc., but while all of those would give you some ex­pres­sive­ness above and be­yond a dry samp­le play­back, none of them would sound quite like what a real sax player does with his lips, tongue, throat, chest, etc.

No, the on­ly way at pres­ent to get tru­ly re­al­is­tic and nat­u­ral­ly ex­pres­sive sax sounds out of an el­ec­tron­ic in­stru­ment is with phys­ic­al mod­el­ling. The on­ly ar­ranger key­board that I know of that can do this for sure is Ya­ma­ha’s 9000Pro with one of its PLG slots filled with a PLG-150VL card, and also using a Breath Con­trol­ler or some oth­er means of send­ing the prop­er MIDI CCs. I’ve heard that the Tech­nics KN6000 (and pre­su­mab­ly 6500) can do some­thing sim­il­ar by track­ing a hu­man voice sing­ing into its mi­cro­phone, and using that to mod­u­late its brass and reed sounds, but I’ve nev­er heard this in action.

My $15 (not a typo!) YMF724-equip­ped PCI sound card in­cludes the equiv­al­ent of the PLG-150VL (sans ab­il­ity to pro­gram whole new al­go­rithms). I have just up­load­ed a samp­le to the Web space I got with my ISP but have never used for anything. It’s a MIDI file that I mod­if­ied from a demo I down­load­ed from NTon­yX’s web site to not use XG voi­ces past Level 1 (it was de­signed for the MU100R which is Lev­el 4 XG plus VL and VH, though of course the VH was­n’t used in this piece) that has an ab­so­lute­ly phe­nom­en­al, tru­ly ex­pres­sive ten­or jazz sax, and al­so a real­ly cool but short trum­pet part about 2¤3of the way through the song, both of which use VL. The back­ing mu­sic is en­tire­ly Lev­el 1 XG wave­ta­ble samp­led voi­ces, but even they sound better than usual due to full usage of the XG spec in­clu­ding use of MIDI Con­tin­u­ous Con­trol­lers (CCs). The MIDI file should the­o­ret­ic­al­ly play as-is on a 9000Pro with VL card installed (let me know if it doesn’t work right), as well as on any PC with a YMF7#4-based sound card or the S-YXG100plus 1.0 Soft Synth with SoftPLG-100VL module installed (this only gets in­stalled if you have a real In­tel Cel­er­on or Pen­ti­um II or ///, not an AMD). I will up­load an ASF (Win­dows Me­dia Au­dio) ver­sion as well so those of you with­out VL and Lev­el 1 XG (or better) equip­ment can still hear it the way it’s sup­posed to be. I ful­ly ex­pect that when you hear the .ASF, you will also want to down­load the .MIDi file (a much smal­ler file!) and load it in­to a se­quen­cer (even if you don’t have the MIDI gear need­ed to hear it in all its glo­ry), just to prove to your­self that this real­ly is MIDI that you’re hear­ing (off a $15 PC sound card’s in­ter­nal MIDI ca­pab­il­it­ies, no less)! It’s that good!

There are other as­pects to this song that dem­on­strate some other rath­er in­ter­est­ing tech­nol­o­gy. For one thing, none of the parts, neith­er XG samp­les nor VL, were gen­er­a­ted by re­cord­ing a live hu­man play­er’s play­ing. Nor were they man­u­al­ly tweaked with CC con­trol curves in an ad­vanced seq­uen­cer such as Cake­Walk, nor were the CC val­ues hand-en­tered in a less-so­phis­tic­a­ted MIDI ed­it­or (though I did do some hand-tweak­ing of the set­ups and a glo­bal re­place on which MIDI CC was being used in one case, I did not ad­just the val­ues them­selves). No, ev­ery nu­ance you hear, in VL and in wave­ta­bles (lis­ten es­pec­ial­ly to the bass, drums, and guit­ars), was gen­er­a­ted by NTon­yX’s in­cred­ible soft­ware, es­pec­ial­ly Style En­han­cer, which uses ar­tif­ic­ial in­tel­lig­ence to add hu­man-like nu­an­ces and warmth to dry hand-en­tered or key­board-played MIDI tracks! They now have a new, ea­si­er-to-use and more au­to­ma­ted pro­gram called Stylizer. I have long thought that Ya­ma­ha should li­cense their tech­nol­o­gies for use in the Sytles of a new se­ries of PSRs and Pro-line ar­ran­ger key­boards (the Mo­tif is a step in the right direction, as is the Korg KAR­MA, but neither is quite what NTon­yX is).


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#129038 - 07/30/01 05:03 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Hi Comalite J,
thank you for your exhaustive reply; I just wonder why are you always using in your threads this typo character which makes reading more difficult.
Thank you again
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#129039 - 07/30/01 09:36 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
Guys, I have a similar "cheap" Yamaha sound card (less than $20.) and I listened to Comalite's offerings several months ago. It is well worth the time and trouble to check it out. They are amazing, at least on a VL-capable card.
Eventually somebody, probably Yamaha, will fully integrate this technology into a keyboard that will capitalize on it.
DonM
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#129040 - 07/30/01 02:44 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
COMALite J Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/99
Posts: 86
Loc: Shreveport, LA, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Dreamer:
Hi Comalite J,
thank you for your exhaustive reply; I just wonder why are you always using in your threads this typo character which makes reading more difficult.
Thank you again

“Typo char­ac­ter”!? I have no idea what you’re talk­ing about. Are you see­ing some sort of gar­bage sym­bol char­ac­ter? If so, it’s not show­ing up on my screen and I have no idea why you’d be see­ing such a thing.

On the oth­er hand, if you’re re­fer­ring to the type­face (aka. “font”), i. e. a “type of” (“type o’” aka. “typo”?), well, that“s for a rea­son. I ab­so­lute­ly hate Ari­al and Hel­vet­ica and sim­il­ar sans-ser­if fonts be­cause they make the low­er-case “L” and the up­per-case “i” look iden­tic­al, or so close there­to that most people can’t tell the dif­fer­ence (see for yourself: “Rick Springfield, III lives in Springfield, Ill.vs. “Rick Springfield, III lives in Springfield, Ill.” >. On my screen, this For­um de­faults to Ver­da­na, which, despite be­ing sans-ser­if, does dis­ting­uish be­tween those two let­ters, but not ev­er­y­one has that font in­stalled (it does come with In­ter­net Ex­plor­er 4 or la­ter for both Win­dows and Mac) and if it isn’t it will like­ly be sub­sti­tu­ted with Ar­i­al or Hel­vet­ica. I did­n’t want to take that chance. In­stead, I sup­ply a list of fonts in order of pref­er­ence to in­sure that, no mat­ter what plat­form my posts are viewed un­der, they will al­ways show up in a good-look­ing font that does­n’t con­fuse the looks of those two let­ters.

DonM, while the MIDI ver­sion does in­deed re­quire VL hard­ware (note that this in­cludes a 9000­Pro equipped with a PLG-150VL card!) or soft­ware to sound its best, it is play­able on any XG de­vice (but the sax ef­fect, the point of this Topic, won’t be an­y­where near as good as it would be with VL). Still, though, since the sax sound is so im­por­tant and so few peo­ple here have VL equip­ment, I did a di­rect re­cord­ing right off the sound card’s MIDI using the sound card’s own au­dio (to do that, select “Ster­eo Out” as your Re­cord­ing source in the Vol­ume Con­trols DS-XG Mix­er that comes up if you right-click on the lit­tle yel­low speak­er icon over by the clock dis­play, usu­al­ly on the right side of your Win­dows task bar) and re­cord­ed the MIDI play­back di­rect­ly to a .WAVe au­dio file, and used the free Win­dows Me­dia En­co­der 4.2 to en­code that into a .ASF file using the Vox­Ware Mu­sic Co­dec which comes with it (and which is no long­er av­ail­ab­le in Win­dows Me­dia En­co­der 7 and up) for min­im­al loss of qual­i­ty. The re­sul­ting file will play on any Win­dows or Mac mach­ine equipped with Win­dows Me­dia Play­er 6.4 or lat­er. It is, how­ev­er, a much big­ger down­load than the MIDI file (3.9MB vs. 86kB), though not any­where near the size of the raw .WAVe file! Note also that I’ve im­proved the MIDI since you last heard it (some MIDI set­up in­struc­tions were not com­plete so that while it sound­ed okay on my sys­tem, it was not guar­an­teed to do so even on an­oth­er sim­il­ar­ly-equipped sys­tem), so check it out again!

[This message has been edited by COMALite J (edited 07-30-2001).]


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#129041 - 08/01/01 06:40 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
kaboombahchuck Offline
Member

Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 275
Loc: Arizona USA
hi i'm not really sure where the best sax sound can be found. but one thing i know for sure is i use a wind midi controller and nothing can compare. i'm corrently using a yamaha wx5 played through an alesis nanosynth. it's pretty cool,but i'm really starting to get wet for a yamaha vl70m virtual acustic sound generater, but i digress. if your interested in learning the sax, the wx5 is deffinatly an option. check it out.
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#129042 - 08/01/01 10:37 PM Re: The search for the perfect sax
COMALite J Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/99
Posts: 86
Loc: Shreveport, LA, USA

Ka­boom­ba­chuck, yes, a WX-style Wind Con­trol­ler is just about the best way to play a VL-cap­a­ble de­vice, if you or some­one who will be work­ing with you knows how to play a so­pra­no sax, clar­i­net, or other in­stru­ment with sim­il­ar key­ing but­ton sys­tems (the WX was spe­cif­ic­al­ly de­signed to be sim­il­ar, as you well know). And, yes, a VL will sound much bet­ter than a Nan­o­Synth or any oth­er wave­ta­ble sampler or any oth­er syn­thes­is method that isn’t gen­u­ine phys­ic­al mod­el­ling. Lis­ten to the sam­ple .ASF file I linked to in my above mes­sage for an ex­am­ple of what you could ex­pect out of your WX if you hooked it to a VL-ca­pa­ble de­vice!

Now con­sid­er that you can get VL for un­der $20 in the form of a YMF724-based sound card (or any of the YMF 7#4-series chips, though cards based on the 744 or 754 tend to cost more, up to twice as much [shyeah, roight! — like $40 is too much to spend to get real VL!] — check on PriceWatch and search for “YMF” to see some good prices on Acer/AO­pen’s var­i­ants).

Al­ter­nat­ive­ly, you can down­load the 90-day demo ver­sion of S-YXG100plus 1.0 for free, but the SoftPLG-VL portion will only in­stall if you have a gen­u­ine In­tel Pen­ti­um II, !!!, 4, or Cel­er­on (have not tried it on an Ath­lon, but it will not in­stall on an AMD K6 [any var­i­ant] nor a Pen­ti­um or Pen­ti­um MMX).

Eith­er way, the VL you get will em­u­late near­ly all of the sounds and most of the func­tion­al­ity of a gen­u­ine VL70m! Just hook your WX up to your PC using an or­din­ary Joy­stick-to-MIDI ad­ap­ter ca­ble, with the WX con­nect­ed to the MIDI In!


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#129043 - 08/02/01 06:03 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
kaboombahchuck Offline
Member

Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 275
Loc: Arizona USA
COMALite J Thanks for the conformation on the vl70m. Unfortunatly all the rest is of no use to me, as i use an apple. don't ask why, it's a political thing. it does, however, give me some insite and something else to look out for.
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#129044 - 08/04/01 11:39 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
COMALite J Offline
Member

Registered: 12/28/99
Posts: 86
Loc: Shreveport, LA, USA

There are options for the Macintosh (mostly involving making them act like PCs — SoftWindows, VirtualPC, etc.), but there’s no guarantee that either a DS-XG YMF7#4 PCI card or the S-YXG100plus Soft Synth would work on them, and even if it did, those programs are expensive enough that it’d be just as cost-effective to buy a PC, or, better yet, a genuine VL-70m.

However, once you do have the VL-70m, note that the best VL editors (including the free Expert Editor that lets you even design your own models from scratch, rather than just piecing together parts of existing ones [e. g. what would a Flute sound like if it had an Oboe double-reed mouthpiece?] like the Visual Editors [for both Windows and Mac] do) are only available for the Mac at present!

By the way, have you listened to my recording yet? Windows Media Player 7 is now available as a free download for the Mac and will play .ASF and .WMA files! It should play my .ASF just fine, so you can hear my Nigh-Perfect Sax done on cheap VL — and remember that the real VL-70m is even better! Also download Yamaha’s SoundVQ Player for the Macintosh to play the .VQF demos on the YamahaSynth site — play the demo for the PLG-150VL card, not just the ones for the VL-70m — the PLG-150VL, like the DS-XG and SoftSynth solutions for Windows, are stripped-down versions of the real VL-70m, so anything you hear on that demo can be done at least as well, if not better, on the Real McCoy!


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#129045 - 08/07/01 07:25 AM Re: The search for the perfect sax
kaboombahchuck Offline
Member

Registered: 07/19/01
Posts: 275
Loc: Arizona USA
COMALite J, i was unable to download your song. i downloaded media player for mac, but it don't seem to be working. i went to the yamaha site and downloaded what you sugested, but have not been able to use it yet. thanks for all the info . if you would like to check out what i've done there is a simple song at http://homepage.mac.com/kaboombahchuck/FileSharing.html . it is a mp3 useable on all players in any format. check it out and tell me what you think. if any one else wan's to check it out please free to. comments are welcome.

[This message has been edited by kaboombahchuck (edited 08-07-2001).]

[This message has been edited by kaboombahchuck (edited 08-07-2001).]
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