I just called a major music shop in Taipei, Taiwan.

I inquired about the Roland G70 and was told that they're out of stock. They said that it might take a long time before they will even get one and even then they can't be certain as the G70 has been discontinued. Anyway, price was around US$2500. It may be a bit more than last time I asked but that's due to the exchange rate.

The salesperson told me that the Roland e80 sells for about US$3000. Around that figure, could be less but definitely not more. Good to know but only 61 keys. Darn!

Now came another surprise. They apparently do have the Tyros 2 in Taiwan now. Last year I was told that it wasn't marketed in Taiwan. Price: US$3000. Could be less but not more, so I was told. That would be including the stand but not speakers.

Well, I was hoping for the Roland G70. Those 76 keys sure make a big difference. Coming from an organ background that little yet major difference does seem enormous. There's just so much more you can do with 76 keys then with 61 keys, whether it's for playing piano or having that extra voice (key split). Perfect for question/answer with different voices.

Oh, another thing that came as a surprise to me: was told that Roland (Taiwan) doesn't import Roland instruments from Japan but from the US. Now that's weird since Japan only a short flight away. Learned something new today.

Before I forget, when inquiring about the next G-series model...not likely. So that may mean NO G80. From what the dealer told me, Roland is more prone to further develop the E-series. True or false, I don't know. Just being the messenger, that's all.

Last month I checked out Tom Lee, the largest music shop in Hong Kong. They don't carry the G70 either. Neither does Tom Lee (Canada). I might try Roland Singapore and Roland China ...will see. Did call Roland Thailand but they charge list price only and has to be ordered through them as no Thai stores carry it. Now why pay double if I can get it for half the price.

So now I'm feeling kinda stuck. I'm thinking of getting an arranger around January (2008) but now I have no idea what to get. Preferably with the next best thing to physical drawbars. I can dig sliders. I don't think I can handle digital drawbars when playing. It's just too different.

Oh, well...still have a couple of months left. Still...

Taike

[This message has been edited by Taike (edited 10-04-2007).]

PA2X
http://www.korg.de/index.php?id=6725&popup=9692&no_cache=1

Taike, I wish the distance between you and I wasn't a problem. Have been to a shop with a staff member who knows the G-70 twice now for demonstrations and "face time", and just don't think it's for me. It's not the replacement for the Ketron I thought it would be. Mine is still in the box it arrived in from the dealer. The box was mangled pretty bad by the freight company (unit is OK), so shipment to Laos would probably be a problem.

Good luck finding something that works for you....I haven't.


Russ

[This message has been edited by captain Russ (edited 10-04-2007).]

Hi Russ,

Actually I'm still looking myself. Heck, I'll be happy with 61 keys if that's what it takes. Coming from a Technics KN5000 about every other newer keyboard sounds great.

Like I said, it won't be until January but nothing's set in stone. May be the first time for me to look forward to my b'day and actually remember it. I tend to remember my b'days like a month after.

You're right. S&H is a hassle but I'll have to deal with it whether I like it or not. Actually I've never had problems with goods shipped from Asian and European countries or even the US. Then again, I never had a keyboard shipped.

Keep on looking, Russ. You'll find something to your liking. You can always wait for the Ketron Audya and see what that's all about. Now, if I had a Hammond B3, all my needs would be fulfilled.

By the way, Russ, you'll be receiving an email either tomorrow or on Saturday. One of the topics concerns Novice Bounlath. So talk to you soon, my friend.

Taike
-----------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Frankie, but I'm not in the US. Also, I've never dealt with eBay and wouldn't know what to do. Oh, and I no longer use a credit card. Thank you for the nice gesture, though.

Taike

russ, you have mail..
dennis

Taike, I kinda figured you for a theatre organ kind of guy but if the above statement is true, you'd be happier with a Nord C1 than an arranger. Plus, you really don't need those Leslies. It really does sound great. You'd make peace with those digital drawbars once you hear how it sounds. Like Capt. Russ, I wish you were closer, as well. We'd find something for you, for sure.

chas

Hi Chas,

Correct assessment (theatre organ kind of guy) although I love Jazz as well (was very into Jazz while at the Academy).

Now, the B3 is such a versatile instrument that it can be used for about any kind of genre of music. In fact, a friend of mine has one and he plays nothing but theatre and the B3 does an outstanding job.

The Nord C does sound great but I'm worried about being left in the cold when something happens to it. In a way I am kinda forced to get whatever is represented in the Far East. So Roland would be a good bet as there's a Roland Music Instruments HQ in Bangkok which, once I am across the border, is only a 50-minute flight away.

Have you received yours yet? I don't think that I read on SZ that you have unless I missed that thread.

Distance has its advantages... and disadvantages. But, yeah, it'd be great to meet with some of you guys; you, Captain Russ, Richard, Squeak,... I think that you and Captain Russ should meet. Who knows, you two might even start a band. LOL

Taike

The most important decision?

Stick with what you have! If you don't know your keyboard inside out, if you've ever heard a factory demo that made you go WOW! (of your arranger), if SOME of your stuff makes you happy and some doesn't... It isn't the keyboard.

Familiarity, knowing the sounds, effects and OS like the back of your hand will go a LOT further than getting the latest, greatest, but only scratching the surface of what it can do. Dig deep, explore the WHY of why some things sound great and others don't, get to know your OS as well as you know the keys (or even better!).

You take ANY of the mid to upper level arrangers out there right now, and spend four or five YEARS on them learning them inside and out, I guarantee you'll blow anyone away with the 'latest greatest' that they've had for only a few months, no matter WHAT new features they have.

Just about ANY arranger in the $1500 and up range (S900, PA800, E60, etc.) can sound absolutely amazing. Those factory demos aren't made on Oasys's or FantomX8's. They are made on the very keyboard you own! If YOUR work doesn't equal theirs, it certainly isn't the arranger...

We really need to try to think less in terms of a technology fix, and concentrate more on an 'understanding' fix... Deep and intimate knowledge of the full capabilities of what you already own will go a lot further than a cursory knowledge of the NEXT arranger...

JMO, yada yada yada....

I agree, Diki, but I am without a keyboard at the moment so I'm not replacing anything.

You bet that my next keyboard will have to last longer than 5 years. I'm not the kind of person that has to have to latest model just to have it. Far from it. What I do want is good voices, styles, durability and sturdiness. Weight doesn't bother me at all. Guess that's why I am leaning towards Roland. I might check out Korg next month (if I find a music shop that has one) when I'm going to Thailand but 99% certain that it's going to be a Roland.

My next keyboard won't be a spur of the moment decision as I've been religiously doing my homework by reading and rereading the User's Guide of the G70 and E80. Of course, without the actual board it's all just theory but at least it's a start in the right direction.

Taike

Taike, yes, I did get the C1. About as close as you're going to get to a B3 at 33lbs. I'm playing some occasional gigs with a drummer and guitar player (we'd like to add a female jazz vocalist - for variety). The rehearsals are more fun than the gigs. I'm having a ball jamming with guys in their 20's (they're bright, talented, and drug-free). Unfortunately, I'm not up to gigging as often as they would like so I don't know how long this will last.

I could give you a run-down on the C1 but I'm sure you've already done your homework. Although great as a lightweight gigging substitute, without those drawbars, that big seat, those 25 pedals, and that great, expressive, long-throw expression pedal, you'll never delude yourself into thinking you're sitting behind a real B3.

Good luck with your search. The Roland is not a bad choice (given your situation regarding service/repair). I had a VK7 (traded in to Dan-O) and it sounded pretty darn good (weighed a ton, though ).

chas

Chas, I did listen to the C1 demos and read several reviews. All positive, mind you. I'm happy for you being so satisfied with it. Would be nearly impossible not to as it really does sound great.

Rehearsals can be a pain at any age. I used to have 2-hour rehearsals every Sunday for like five years or six years. At times fun, at times a royal pain especially when someone didn't show up. Yep, those guitar players with their backaches again although I would call them hangovers. But, hey, once those groupies start lining up you'll feel 20 years younger.

The Roland G70 and E80 are becoming more and more appealing but I'd opt for the former any time. Rather have 76 keys then another few extras that won't make that much of a difference.

Taike

Taike, I have a business associate in a little town outside Atlanta who I see about twice a year, and I absolutely want to contact Chas when I plan to take my next trip. I have a list of favorites here (You, UD, DonM, Stephen, Tony Mads, Nigel, Rory and others) but Chas, as far as common interests (music, politics, flying, social issues) is concerned, is top rate and thinks like I do. He's articulate and shares his beliefs and opinions in a literate, in-depth manner. I really look forward to a time when we can visit. I'd like to take the King Air down to let him see and maby fly it.

Just wish you and our little novice monk were closer. A visit would be great, but Laos is pretty far out of the range of the King Air.

Maby someday,


Russ

Taike.... For something with longevity, I can't recommend the Roland G70 too much... I had a G1000 prior to getting the G70, and gigged that day and night for about eight years, and sold it in perfect working condition (very nearly showroom condition!).

My current G70, aside from some power supply issues that were cleared up under warranty, is mechanically perfect after two years of heavy gigging at an outside beach deck in Florida. It looks like it will remain as tank-like (and tank-heavy, Ian!) as the G1000.

Yes, there are other, slightly more advanced OSs out there, but it is still hard to find a more live sounding arranger, nor an OS that makes 'tweaking' the styles and SMFs any easier. The key-bed is still the best of ANY plastic action on any keyboard (not just arrangers) at any price, and as the direct first order interface between you and your music, one of the most important considerations for any that consider themselves 'players', IMO...

I am even doing first call session work with it, as the piano handily beats my kurzweil, and in a mix, can stand up to our studio's Steinway on SOME material!

Unless Roland add a Chord Sequencer to the NEXT G-series (if there even IS one, rumors hint otherwise), I anticipate using mine for decades!

I AM a little puzzled as to your choice of either an arranger OR a C1, though. They seem such completely contrary tools. I can understand indecision between, say, a G70 and a PAX2Pro, but a B3 and an arranger seem to have totally different goals. Now.... put them TOGETHER, and you'll have a system that totally rocks! Trigger the arranger from the C1's lower manual, and jazz your brains out...!

But choosing one or the other seems to indicate really conflicted goals. Do you NEED automated backing, or not? If you don't have a rhythm section on call 24/7, the arranger would seem the more versatile tool. If you can't spring for a G70 AND a C1, we have a few members at roland-arranger.com that are using G70's with Nord Electro modules, for the ultimate in Hammond authenticity (the onboard G70 B3 sim is passable, but not up to the Nord's 'grease' factor!), AND an 'on call' rhythm section.

Best of luck with whatever you choose...

Taike, you may have already seen this, but I basically agree with everything this guy says. However, I think your concerns about service/repair are completely valid and I would be wary of getting anything other than the big three or at least something that I knew could be serviced locally. But read this anyway .
http://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-review...yType=ReviewDet ail

chas

PS: You know it's just a matter of time before Russ and I get together. He knows that he has an open invitation to my place (although I'd probably hound him to death for stories about such legends as Ray Brown plus those parts of the 60's he can remember ).

Hi Taike
You already know what you really want, so why not hang on a bit longer and save a few more Kips (LAK) and get what you�ve always wanted.
Think about it carefully

Bill

CHAS, thanks for the link and for your understanding. Service is indeed very important. Just don't want to take the risk but the C1 does look and sound great.

By the way, Eddie Landsberg is quite famous amongst (Jazz) Hammond enthousiasts in Japan. in fact, he's made Japan his home. I guess you're already aware of this?

RUSS, always welcome to the land of a Thousand Islands and Million Elephants. So far I haven't seen any elephants.

Now would that be something you flying over to Chas's. The way I know Chas, he's building a landing strip right in front of his house.

I'll send you email later today (Saturday here now 12:09AM).

DIKI, I guess there's a slight misunderstanding. Chas mentioned the C1 because of a comment of mine that a B3 would fulfill all my needs. While I would love a B3 or C1, it's the service I'm worried about. I am not pondering whether to get a C1 or a Roland. It's almost written in stone that it's going to be a Roland. At least I'll be getting a great kb that's built like a tank. In fact, I insist on having a kb that's built like a tank. Hey, at least we agree on all its good points. And ... I know whom to ask for help.

BILL, you got me there but a Wersi is way out of my budget. In fact, it costs about as much as a small house here. Would love to have another one but it won't be for now. And once again...service's the dilemma.

Taike