I am interested in buying a sound module, but don't want to pay for all the extras I won't need: ie: sampling, etc, etc.

The Phantom rack and Triton rack, both look amazing, but are also full blown samplers, which is why they both cost upwards of $1200. I would like to pay a lot less than that -- but only if I can get great sound.

Anyone have experience with this?

I run Roland XV-5050, with two SRX expansion cards - brilliant.
Keith

Hmmm, those are nicely priced. And the sound is as good as the Phantom? How many expansion slots? Are the expansion sounds better than the programmed? Thanks!

I have a QSR Alesis sound module that I am looking to sell at very reasonable price.($200 plus shipping) If you are interested email me at emurray3@twcny.rr.com

Ed

The 5050 stacks right up there with the Fantom sounds, and the expansion boards have stuff that rivals the best on the market. Best $400 module out there, I think.

I agree with Dave about the 5050..but there are a couple other units to consider...
the 2020 is a half rack with most of the same sounds as the 5050, including 2 slots for expansion..It has 40 insert effects compared with twice as many on the 5050...
Neither of these will give you the capability to play"Scat" sounds..the vocal expansion board will not work with the 5050 or 2020, and there is not a compatible SRX vocal board yet..

This brings me to my suggestion..get a JV1010, still has decent sounds[less the xv stereo sounds,but stellar enough], includes the famed"session" board , and a single slot to add a JV board[like the vocal board]..
You can buy a used JV1010 for under $200 and a used Vocal board for under $100...For under $300, you have a valued module..in a space saving half rack unit..

Fran,
I think you are wrong about the scat voices not being in any of the SRX expansion boards available. The complete orchestra contains orchestra 1, orchestra 2, vocal colections (which contains the scat voices), and one other I can't remember right now. The voice card has choir and the jazz scat voices included.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

I am smiling as I write those words, but I am sure you don't mean the same thing that comes to my mind.

Can somenone please tell me what the "scat" sounds actually are? Or provide a link so I can hear?

George , thanks for correcting me..now that you mentioned it ..I do recall that collective group composite on an SRX board, although I have never had an opportunitie to listen to it..

This being the corrected info, I would go for the 2020 or the 5050..
I had the flagship 5080, and it did sound great..so the 5050 without the sample playback features may be the ticket..

http://www.rolandus.com/products/details.asp?CatID=13&SubCatID=54&ProdID=SR-JV80-13&PageMode=15

Select Vox Patch Demo; you'll stop smiling...

Hmmm, check out the Yamaha Motif ES rack - it just came out, and I can get it for 900 bucks (which is cheaper that the original Motif rack!)

I wonder if I would need any expansion boards with something like this...
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MotifRackES/

OK o3bor, thanks.

Hi all,
The Roland 5050 has two slots for expansion cards (the new SRX's only) and you can get an excellent preview at http://www.rolandus.com/Multimedia/Flash/srx/srx_demo.html .
Click and hold one of the cards and drag it over to where it states.
The two cards I have are the Complete Orchestra (6) and the Complete piasno (11). Very pleased with both.
Keith

Is this for a studio or mobile setup Chony ?
The reason I ask is that your computer can also become an excellent sound module at less cost and with much more choices available vs a hardware module. The popular choice is often Edirol's HyperCanvas, but I favor Steinberg Hypesonic or Luxonix Ravity

As far as an ES module, I find the sounds to be excellent on my Motif ES, but if you are going to be using them as a sound module for arranger patterns, plan on doing a ton of tweaking to get the styles to sound as good or better than those on a dedicated arranger.

There aren't a ton of cards to be had for the Motif series, but the XG card might be very relevant for someone who wants to use Yamaha styles. Still, I doubt that this will give you better sounds than a Tyros or PSR3000. The internal ES voices are magnificent, but the style data in it's original form can't call them up.

The analog modeling board is very good too, and it sounds a lot like ( and supposedly is modeled after ) the Prophet 5. I doubt that helps most arranger players though. I don't have the Piano or drum cards ( I think Pro has them ), so I can't really say. I do have the VL150 acoustic modleing card, and I think it does as good a job on horns, saxes, and flutes as anything I've ever heard. That pretty much is what is available in expansion cards for Yamaha Keys / Modules.

AJ




[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 03-17-2005).]

Id look into the Motif rack (not the ES) You can buy a used one for 650-700. They have something like 85mb of wav rom. Its great for orchestrial sounds, but not quite up to roland on the synths and pads.

Phil

Actually its for both. I would like to use it in my studio for arrangements -- but I would also like to use it in live performances to give me greater flexibility. I'm happy with the Tyros sounds for the accompaniment -- its just that in the solo melodies I would like more options. The only problem I can think of is I wonder if the Tyros is capable of sending MIDI messages to the Motif Rack to change solo instruments. If so how?



Actually I have use a laptop which I take to performances anyway, so software is deffinitely an option.

I checked out the Hypersonic very quickly a few months ago, but didn't think they came up to par with the Tyros or Motif sounds. Should I check it again?



I just checked out the demo on yamaha's website. http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/CD A/Con...RODUCT,00.html. How on Earth do they get those sounds to be so expressive? That is simply not possible to do live, or is it?

Thanks AJ, Chony

[This message has been edited by chony (edited 03-17-2005).]

Dear Chony;

The link does not work. Was it MP3 demos of the Motif rack?

Regards;
BN

Chony,

Sometimes adding a touch of effects goes a long way Chony. In my setup I use both Hypersonic and Ravity going thru Xlutop Chainer, which is a virtual Vst rack that allows me up to 10 plug ins per session. More than enough room to add a few nice effects. You could also layer a couple of softsynths together. Man what a nice sound that makes when done right.

There are certain sounds I like better on the ES btw. But certainly not all of them. Synth and string sounds are so much fuller for me on Ravity. I much prefer HS's drum and bass sounds, as well as its acoustic pianos.

As sounds are subjectve, I'm strictly speaking of my preferences here. For Guitars, electric pianos , and Organs I definitely prefer the ES over either Ravity or HS. Then again Dasample's Electroacoustic surpasses any of the Motif's guitars, so I use that instead. B4 beats the ES hands down for my organ sounds. I use Sonic Implants electric guitar soundfonts ( Les Paul, PRS, Telecaster, etc ) along with NI Guitar Rig or Amplitube for effects. Again I find the ES to be sonically behind here.

I agree about the VL sounds. That technology is probably 10 yrs old or better, and I still don't think it's been matched by any sample based stuff.

I am not sure how to go about using a closed structure kb ( Tyros, Motif etc )to change patches accurately on either a module or a software host. Of course if you were to use a dedicated controller, you could simply program any bank and patch data you choose.

I only use maybe 6 to 12 different sounds in a live setup, and I have all of these stored as Xlutop Chainer presets. Of course when I use an analog modeled synth Vsti, I can change several parameters on the fly using my controller. If I remember correctly I think I can also rework One Man Band so that one set of instructions ( bank and patch changes ) turns into another.

AJ

Try this, BN: http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/CDA/ContentDetail/ModelSeriesDetail/0,6373,CNTID%253D1967%2526CTID%253D206800,00.html

Wow AJ. I thought I was educated in these matters. It seems I have a lot to learn *sigh*. I'm just looking for great brass and saxes, pianos, and electric guitars -- in that order. And I don't want to pay $6000 buying every hardware and sofware module that exists!

Also, are the sounds you get on a card, overall better quality (in sound and expressiveness) than the sounds that come preprogrammed? Or is it just more instruments and sounds to play with.

If you only use 12 sounds, why do you have so much software and hardware?

I'm getting a bit exasperated as I have recently been diagnosed by family and friends as having GAS (Gear Aquisition Syndrome). I would like to break the habit, but, but, but I can't...

Chony

In a live setup, I just don't need a lot of sounds. A good organ, a good piano, a good EP or two, a sax emulation, a good guitar emulation or two. Maybe a flute or harmonica here or there. The rest if any are analog synth sounds.

Depends on what type of show I am doing too and whether I'm solo or not. If I'm not solo, I tend to just use the organ, and a few synth sounds, and occasionally a piano. Also the VL150 plug in sax emulation usually turns a few heads when I use my breathe controller with it, and it sounds great to boot.

In the studio, I use more sounds than I care to count. That isn't the problem. Trying to chain 2, 3, or even 4 apps together, like One man Band, Jammer, Sonar, and FL studio.. That is the problem. It completely stifles creativity.... So, I have taken more to recording more stuff in real time in either FL or or Adobe Audition, and just using the laptop as a soundmodule. My drum tracks suffer. I'm ok on basic beats but my fills can be bad at times, but the rest I can play pretty well. Later I usually redo the drums anyway. My guitar work is getting a little better, so I would rather record my real guitar too, when I am up to it.

The sounds on the plug ins are different. I would say that nothing on the ES internally can match a few of the VL150 sounds. I like the VL, because the presets are very good, so it is immediately playable. The AN150 definitely sounds more analogue then the sample based internal sounds of the ES. It should as it is physically modeled after a real analogue synth and is not sample based. That said, some of the presets aren't very impressive. It takes some editing to get lush analogue sounds, but they are in there. You can do basic editing inide of the ES, but many parameters are accessible only via an external editor ( software ). What's worse, even the AN presets are dry in the ES, so I have to save edit and then save each one to a user voice in order to have effects applied.

It is sooo much easier to just link to the NI Pro53 software, which like the AN, is modeled on the old Sequential Circuits Prophet 5. The Pro 53 presets are awesome, and the editing interface is right there in front of me. The AN can be every bit as good, but it takes more work than I want to do.

AJ

[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 03-17-2005).]

Uh huh. The breath controller. That's how they did it. Okay, how much do one of them cost. Just another 500 bucks. But I can play flute, so naturally I should own one of them. (If you can't tell, I'm in the middle of convincing myself to buy a MIDI wind controller.)

Only problem is, you can't plug a wind controller into the Motif Rack (just into the motif keyboard). Btw, how do you play keyboard if you are using two hands on the wind controller?

Thanks for all the info. It looks like I'm going to be involved in quite a bit of research now. Btw, would the roland horns be as good as the yamahas? I'm thinking that if I go hardware, I may want to go Roland as I have many more SRX expansion options.

Thanks again, Chony

If I remember right my breathe controller cost me about 70 dollars. It's an important controller for me because it controls the "breathe" expression parameter on the VL150 while I play the actual notes on the keys, but it's also very different from a wind controller, which also requires that you actually play the notes on a simulated horn or sax controller. In this case you don't play the keys at all. I have never tried to play any real wind instruments, at least not seriously, so I know I could never pull that off.

I don't honestly know how the Roland stuff sounds. I can only say that I've yet to hear any sample based emulation that I thought was better than the VL.

AJ




[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 03-17-2005).]

Could you please post a link to this breath controller? Does it plug in via MIDI, or must I have a keyboard which can accept a special plug? This deffinitely sounds like something I can incorporate to my current performance setup!

Thank you, Chony

http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/CDA/ContentDetail/ModelSeriesDetailPF/0%2C6603%2CCNTID%253D1321%2526CTID%253D208500%2526VNM%253DLIVE%2526AFLG%253DY%2526LGFL%253DN%2C00.html

Unfortunately, at least for this one, you need the Motif ES, another Yamaha KB that hosts the VL70, or the actual standalone VL unit.

AJ

Hi, Chony!

Where can I buy the Yamaha Motif ES rack
for nine hundred dollars?

Thanks for your help.

Merrill

At guitar center in Manhattan, NY. They will not advertise the price, but if you walk in, they'd give it to you. Offer will not last for long.