My keyboard doesn't have them so I'm curious if I'm missing anything. I've tried them out on other keyboards and it just seemed kind of gimmickie. Are these must have items to have and I just don't know it, or do you rarely use them?

I saw several pro players demoeing an arranger keyboard using the modulation/pitch bend a lot. He was using it even when playing bass lines and especially during solo instrument lines.

I wonder how other players uses it. I personally never use it but I am not as advanced as some of these guys.

Pitchbend wheels are a must if you want to truly get the right effect when playing sounds such as guitar, bass, and sax. A pitchbend wheel when used with a guitar sound will allow you to bend notes and use it as say a whammie bar.. They are by no means gimmic. It takes some practice to use them properly too. You have to know where and when to bend the notes.. A modulation wheel is also quite handy but for the basics a pitchbend wheels is quite important. Also theres the joysticks too that you'll find on Korgs and Rolands. Personally I think they work much better than the wheels.. I use the pitchbend extensively when playing. Many of my songs will have a guitar, or sax solo. Also if you're playing brass instruments the pitchbend is quite effective.

Squeak

Squeak,

Can you post some songs using the pitch bend tecnic?

Chuck: When playing in arranger keyboard auto accompaniment mode, with the left hand required full time to trigger full chords and also be heard (left hand instrument sound) as well, the pitch bend & modulation wheels are totally useless, that's unless you have more than 2 hands. To solve the problem of adding pitch bend and vibrato in arranger auto accomp mode, Yamaha has begun incorporating pitch bend with key touch sensitivty instead. A great exampe of this is on the Tyros' "Aloha Guitar". - Scott

I never play a song that I don't use the pb wheel, unless it's all piano or organ.
But then I don't use full keyboard mode also.
I have played around with the Aloha guitar on the 2100 and it is harder for me to do it with touch.
You can hear plenty of examples on my website. www.donmasonmusic.com
DonM

Scott,
Yes, this is another thing I wondered about...I only have two hands. It seems like I have more than enough to do with playing, punching fill buttons, etc. Maybe if you could control pitch with a foot petal like I do with the sustain it would be more feasible. If you could control it with pressure on the keys like you said it would be interesting and more possible. That would be like after-touch I assume?

Chuck ....its not an easy craft and takes alot of practice to do...but if you master it it adds realizm to your playing for sure....I personaly never have a need to use it on stage..
but some use it very frequently.....
it's all depenent on how you play & what style, know WHEN to use it too.
I suggest you go listen to people use it and see if its just for you or not..

------------------
www.donnypesce.com



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 01-13-2004).]

Squeak hit it right on. When I'm with a SMF, my left hand stays with the wheels during sax and guitar solos. Even when I'm playing in arranger mode, for those instrumentals I use the wheels... and yes, I have a VERY busy left hand, but for me, it's worth it for the sound I can get. IMO, getting a great sax or guitar is one of the top AK benefits.

Start listening closely. Any time you're really impressed by a keyboard sax solo, and you're not sure if it might not be a real sax, you can be sure there was a lot of wheel or joystick action. As squeak and dnj said, it does take lots of practice to get it right.

Glen I'd like to hear your wheel technic if possible can you post a demo or 2?

Donny... glad to if I could, but right now I'm a novice at best re recording and web posting an mp3, but perhaps later.

Thanx Glenn..but when your ready please let us know we'e here to help each other.

The pitch bend wheel has become second nature to me, almost like using a clutch with a manual transmission. I need it.

I have the joystick on the PA80, which controls both pitch and modulation. I don;t use the mod function as often, but it's very useful when working with certain patches / sounds, such as changing the rotation effect speeds on organ patches.

In the Motif ES, I set up some of my user patches so that the mod wheel doesn't control modulation at all, but instead it's applied to control some other parameter, such as an effect depth or filter cutoff.
Very useful tool in that respect.

AJ

Chuck, you can indeed control the Pitch Bend by way of a Foot Pedal[s] on the PSR 2100/Tyros etc. Many other Brand Keyboards have that same feature. Of course you have to set the Keyboard up to trigger Pitch Bend with the Foot Pedal[s] but it is easy to do (on the PSR 2100 and Tyros at least).

Best regards,
Mike

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 01-13-2004).]

Thanks to all for responding. So far, I like the foot pedal idea but maybe I could get used to the wheel with practice.
DonM,
I visited your site and tried the song "Before You Accuse Me" by Clapton, or is it CCR. Who wrote that song anyway? Anyway, I thought it was great recording and a fine example of using a guitar sound with the keyboard. I liked your voice also and it fit the song perfectly. I think I heard two voices in parts. Did you overdub a harmony? I'll try the other songs when I get time. Now you need a picture of yourself after losing the 47 lbs.

Chuck,
Here's what I suggest. If you can watch MTV or VH1 to see the bands playing.. Watch the guitar players. Also listen to some sax songs too. Listen closly to these instruments and you can get an idea of how they sound and where notes can bend. It really takes some practice. What type of keyboard do you have? I'll throw together some really simple examples for you using several voices and send them to you. When you get the hang of it I think you'll find yourself using them more

Squeak

Chuck,
Thanks, "Before You Accuse Me" is by Delbert McClinton. He's a Texas-Blues type and has many great songs. Eddie has another of his songs on my website.
The song was played and recorded live on the job, with no overdubbing at all. The harmony voice is from the harmonizer on the PSR2000.
The photo on the opening page is the slimmer version!
DonM

Don,

Nice rendition of "Before You Accuse me".

The foot pedal is a choice for someone who needs to keep both hands busy on an arranger. I started out many years ago as an organ player, but as soon as they became affordable enough, I switched to synthesizers. For me the pitch wheel became an extension of my playing, but I like a joystick even better, since it allows me to control both mod and pitch wheel bending, at once.

I just don't think I'd feel comfortable with a foot pedal for pitch bending. Sometimes my technique includes very rapid but barely perceptible bends that are meant to imitate string resonance. I don't think my foot would do as good a job here, no matter how I might try. I've tried assigning pitch bend to aftertouch on another keyboard, but that really didn't have the right feel for me either, as opposed to a pitch wheel / joystick.

Even when I play an arranger, I can pretty much free the left hand up enough to throw in some pitch bend articulations into a solo, as long as I stick to simpler chord changes. I set up my PA80 to recognize both single and multi fingered chords, so that I can manipulate the joystick with my ring finger while I change chords with my thumb and index fingers.

Squeak makes a good point. Before you try to emulate different instruments, it's good to give a good listen to some well played examples, while trying to focus on and picture what the player is doing with the instrument.


AJ

Squeak,
Well, I do get MTV but you can't force me to watch it. It's more like NoiseTV to me. I'll be paying more attention to the keyboard players now that I'm playing Keyboard. I played guitar for a long while so I always watched the guitar players.
This fall Autin City Limits had Steve Winwood on their opening show and it sure was fun watching him play organ especially when he came to a couple of my favorites: I'm A Man and Gimme Some Lovin'. Great Stuff. The guitar player and drummer were super also.
DonM,
About your picture...Ooops!
I've already learned "Before You Accuse Me". Of course it's only a few chords but great to improvise with.
ChuckH