Hi all

After a few months reading this forum and appreciating more and more the variety of themes and the excellent tips by professionals (thanks a lot Henry for your mail!) especially also for newbies as me, it's time to introduce myself:

May name is Hansruedi, I live in Switzerland
and use a Solton SD1 and CW Sonar (the german version)for hobby and like them both very much.

I however have still a slight problem in using both components successfully together
and hope, that somebody can explain me, whether one side has a bug or whether I
interact them in the wrong way.

1. All midi files created on SD1 and immediately re-played on the KB work fine, irrespective of sounds, presets and programs used, ie I don't need to bother about GM and non-GM sounds and drums.

2. Based on this experience I expected the SD1 to re-play Sonar-corrected midi files the same way, provided I corrected only a few wrongly played notes with Sonar (nothing else): but this is a wrong.

3. Now I did a simple test (the option in the SD1 sequencer was set to GM midi = Yes):
I recorded on the SD1 a midi file
with "Record" (ie not with the internal sequencer) and copied it via diskette to the PC.
4. I opened the original midi file in Sonar
and saved it under a different file name (without any modification), in order to have it ready for later corrections.

5. In this process of saving Sonar adds 1-2 tracks and inserts a few sysex/program changes being imho responsible for wrong sounds, sometimes for the
right hand only, sometimes for the accompaniment. The drum sounds on tracks 9 + 10 re-play always correctly. (I tried both out, saving as midi file 0 or 1, midi file 0
lead to an error if opened in SD1)

This means, a midi file is corrupted by Sonar
without any user modification. I was not able yet to figure out, under what circumstances, does it depend, what sounds are used?

6. When I save the opened file on itself, ie using the same file name, again without any user modification, Sonar freezes and I have to re-boot the PC. (But I can live with this of course)

I contacted the hotline in Germany and they adviced me to set

GeneralMIDISMFs=0

in the file TTSSEQ.ini, but it had no effect.

IMHO Sonar should leave completely untouched
a midi file, if not modified intentionally
by the user and the SD1 would re-play such a file correctly, irrespective whether a sound is on track 1 only or split up on tracks 13-16. The manual says, that midi files created with "Record" match always GM standards.

Last but not least I'm desperately looking for instrument definitions (would even pay
a reasonable price for it), but imho they wouldn't help for above problem.

Sorry for the long thread, but what am I doing wrongly? Is the only work-around having the manual with its midi definitions ready when making music?

Brgds
Hansruedi

Did you receive the SD1 manual ?

Hansruedi,

Sounds like it's a problem with Calkwalk Sonar. It's inserting additional data into the MIDI file. When you have GM mode turned on in the SD1, the MIDI file will use GM sound only. So it should be compatible with any sequencer. Did the MIDI file play correctly from Calkwalk?

Jemru

Henry O ! NICE input .
The one thing Ketron added to the manual for the SD1 is SYSTEX info . That is the reason for asking about manual . dano

@all
Thanks for your replies. Is it possible, that somebody with an SD1 and Sonar could repeat this small test? I have also the
"corrupted" midi file ready for a bilateral mail. However I can hardly understand, that
out of thousands users my Sonar copy should destroy midi files (unless I
did configure Sonar not completely yet)
because otherwise it works fine, all functions I discover work according manual
@DanO1
Yes, I received the SD1 manual (ie I downloaded the November01 version from
Ketron's site. I don't see however, in what way the added Sysex info might help?
@Henry
As a soundcard I'm using SB Platinum only, which can't be used to reproduce music as it re-plays almost all sounds wrongly. It can be used as a basic control for newly created / corrected notes. So I always need to re-play midi files on the SD1 in order to enjoy the full music.
I'll try it out whether I'm able to hear the additional created tracks and sounds. Off-hands I would say, the midi file must play also incorrectly with Sonar, as after the first save the additional tracks and Sysex are there.
Re GM mode: Yes, GM mode was set. However imho this shouldn't make any difference. I expected an external sequencer would leave
leave an existing midi file untouched:
As long as the KB can re-play it's own
- even it was slightly proprietary - midi file, there seems to be no reason for a sequencer to change it? (newly created files of course to be created according standards)

Hansruedi,

If you have a MIDI interface on your PC, try playing the MIDI file from Sonar through the MIDI interface to the SD1. It should sound the same as playing the MIDI file on the SD1 sequencer. This should work even without a SD1 definition file.

Henry

So if I have a midi file that was done GS, I can change my seq play to GM and it will ignore bank changes?

Hi Henry
Yes it does. Recording the SD1 via Midi cables in Sonar works perfectly, provided
I replay them immediately, ie without a prior save / open of the file. The only minor "problem" is, that the right hand sounds are in most cases 1 octave to low, but not always, but the sounds are always correct. I didn't bring this problem up yet, as I wanted to do one after the other. And the work around is obviously easy: I transpose the tracks before re-playing.

If I want to save / re-open the work, the sounds sometimes are also wrong, but I need to work out first under what circumstances.

Hansruedi

Hi all
Finally, after a long odyssey I have found out, how to produce stable and repeatable results with the combination SD1 and Sonar.
In this respect the following tipps do not claim to be the only way to work nor are they meant to be schoolmasterly. I just thought I might share it with the community after having read that others are struggling too. And the professionals amongst you might forgive me for publishing well-known knowledge, for me as a newbie it was a pain:

@Recording a midi file and carry it via diskette to Sonar
- If you record with the "Record" button and don't intend to modify this file in Sonar, ie just re-play it on SD1: this works fine.
- If you want this file to modify in Sonar don't use "Record". It might work fine, if only sounds of the sound bank 0 are used. If others are used, Sonar might add additional tracks, Sysex and program changes into existing tracks upon open / save. Such a file might produce strange sounds upon re-play.
- Instead of "Record" use the internal sequencer and you can change styles and sounds during recording. After recording press "demix" and you'll have all channels on different tracks. Such a file I could modify in Sonar and re-play on SD1 without any problems. Be sure to save it as midi format 0 (despite of the de-mixed tracks) otherwise you might get an error upon the attempt of re-playing it. My test-serie didn't show any difference, whether "GM sounds" was turned On or Off. One restriction remains: you can only use sounds of banks 0, 1 and 10. If using sounds of banks 11-14, the SD1 records a similar sound of bank 0, 1 or 10. There seems to be no way to access these sounds, even not with "GM sounds" off.

@Recording in Sonar via midi cables
- Despite the manual mentioning many times to connect a sequencer to Midi In 2 Ketron's help desk adviced to connect to Midi In 1. Be sure that F6 Midi / Utility Midi In 1 is set to GM (the mine wasn't). Midi In 2 is default set to "Keyboard" and used for another keyboard or accordion (which I use successfully).
- At this stage I would like to encourage you to define the instrument definitions for SD1, it's worth the 2 hours work! First of all it shows the correct sound names in the event view that the SD1 produced, second
you can insert at any point a program change with appropriate menue, amazing how that works! Again, define only sounds of the banks 0, 1 and 10, banks 11-14 are converted. Avoid the error I made: the bank / sound definitions in the manual under "Presets" are the wrong ones, you can't access the presets. Instead use the definitions under GM Sounds, bank 0, 1 and 10. As soon as I have defined all drum sounds I can mail the instrument definitions if somebody is interested in. Again save the file as midi file 0, despite of all tracks de-mixed (my template records every channel on a different track). As above it seems to make no difference, whether the option "GM sounds" in the internal sequencer is set to On or Off.

With above 2 ways I finally got compatible results: irrespective, whether recorded via diskette or cable and whether directly re-played over cable or diskette, the sounds are always as expected, same octave etc. a thing which was impossible before.

Btw a hotline staff told me, that he had similar troubles with an earlier CW version and an earlier Ketron Keyboard. I'm however not in a position to critizise anybody: it just was a lucky combination of a newbie, and some peculiarities of the KB and Sonar.
But I swear, I have been close to give up...

Hansruedi

Hansruedi,

Thank you so much for sharing your experience with us. This is very useful for all of use. I have saved this message for future reference. Have fun with your recording...

Henry