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#151547 - 09/13/07 09:06 AM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
OldNewb Offline
Member

Registered: 01/19/04
Posts: 638
Loc: Shorewood Wi. USA
Quote:
Originally posted by cassp:


One thing that I have trouble with on arrangers is finding a style to go with a song like Crazy Love. Maybe that's why I get frustrated, because these things aren't really made for songs like that - and I like doing songs like that. Last night at band practice we tried to put together the Allman Brothers' Midnight Rider - no luck finding even a compromise style.



Casp, Coincidentally, I was messing with a style doing midnight rider on the s900 when I changed which ots I was using, changed from key of A to Em, and wound up with the "improv at the pad" which I submitted a few days ago.
I will record it later today, when voice and fingers wake up more, and show the same style used for midnight rider as was used for my Improv.
As UD says you only need a few good styles to do tons and tons of songs. (paraphrased from UD) BTW I REALLY enjoyed your Crazy Love and will also look for a style on the s900 that I would use for it.
Jim
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#151548 - 09/13/07 09:33 AM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Cold Cold Heart , written & performed by Hank Williams

Cold Cold Heart , performed by Tony Bennett

Both versions were #1 smash hits for BOTH artists. Viva la difference!

Scott

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 09-13-2007).]
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#151549 - 09/13/07 10:12 AM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
cassp Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/21/03
Posts: 3748
Loc: Motown
There's certainly something to be said for multiple versions and styles. Not everyone can sound like the original artist, nor should they. To paraphrase our dear Americal Idol judges; you have to make it your own and sell it.

In listening to those two versions, I'm reminded of a George Jones tune redone by James Taylor on disc two of his "Live" CD - "She Thinks I Still Care." I not only think he nailed the song, he did it even better than George. If someone could post those two versions, I'd appreciate it.

I did a YouTube search for 'she thinks i still care' and the results are unbelievable. Good and terrible.

[This message has been edited by cassp (edited 09-13-2007).]
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#151550 - 09/13/07 10:26 AM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Quote:
Originally posted by cassp:
Not everyone can sound like the original artist, nor should they. To paraphrase our dear Americal Idol judges; you have to make it your own and sell it.


and to paraphrase the 'chairman of the board': "I did it MY way", and dammed proud of it.

She Still Thinks I Care , performed by George Jones

She Still Thinks I Care , performed by Harry Connick Jr.

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 09-13-2007).]
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#151551 - 09/13/07 10:50 AM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
cassp Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/21/03
Posts: 3748
Loc: Motown
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#151552 - 09/13/07 03:35 PM Re: G70 Live arranger recording #2
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14269
Loc: NW Florida
Sadly (or, in truth, thank God!) comparisons of arrangers by using converted styles is not a real apples to apples comparison.

The sound itself makes the performance, which becomes the style. Change the sound, and the performance no longer plays to it's strengths. So take a style, carefully optimized for one arranger's sound set, and translate it to another arranger, and you will always have a not so level playing field. And as more and more arrangers add proprietary techniques (mega Voices, 'Live' loops, Guitar Modes etc.) the gap only widens.

I feel that the TRUE comparison test of an arranger's sound quality is simply the comparison of the instrument's ROM styles, which one hopes are optimized as much as possible to the arranger's sound set. From this, you should get a good feel for how the styles are written (busy or simple, supportive or dominant, etc.) and how the sounds 'sit' together, and whether the instrument has a 'home' or a 'live' feel to it.

POSSIBLY, one could convert one set of styles to another format, and gain that instruments strengths, but usually at the cost of what makes them so good on the original arranger. I for one have never heard a translated style sound as good as it did on the original, unless you are talking legacy styles from back before Mega voices and multi-velocity drum samples became the norm.

And would one actually REALLY want to do that to a whole set of styles? The styles AND the sounds are pretty much integral to each arranger. I think it is better to compare the arrangers pretty much OOTB. It's how the manufacturers, at least, feel they sound their best...

So cassp's same song, similar style comparison method is VERY informative. Perhaps with a similar choice of RH sounds it could be even closer, but I still feel it is FAR more informative than a translated styles comparison, which always favors the original.

JMO, yada yada yada...
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