Hi seanbaker,
I tried to go to your web-site, no luck, is it down? Here is a link to the "Motif" web-page at "Yamaha" :> http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gSYS00005MOTIF
It reminded me of a couple of go pionts, the appregeator (multi-poly-?) means that you can play multiple notes at the same time [ie: C cord=C-E-G in harmony with an Em cord= E-G-B and have them interact with eachother ( I think ) Also you could have a "piano ref`" and a "guitar strum" at the same time ( if it does what I think ) I say that because all appregiators are not the same ( I think you can down-load the "Yamaha-Motif" manual) and the other point is it has a USB out-put for either "Windows or Mac"
As far as learning a new KB for me anyway it has always been a "hands on-learn by doing" so I think no matter what you decide I don`t think it would be to hard (might be fun) You can also download the 9000Pro manual at "Yamaha`s" web site as well .
You`ll get there--- Keep in touch-- best of luck, I hope I have helped !
jedi

Jedi,

My site isn't down. Perhaps a lot of people were viewing it at once. Try it again.

I think based on all this wonderful input from everyone plus some emails I've received, it would seem that the choice to go with the 9000pro or the MOTIF is simply a choice of what style of keyboard one is used to working with. They each have the same quality of sounds, just different ones each. Although the 9000 has auto-accompaniment, it appears you can do your own sequencing too plus it has increased polyphony. However I can't use the breath controller with the VA plugin on the 9000. The 9000 has more polyphony, but a less powerful sequencer. The MOTIF has synthesis and arpeggiator features, but lacks realistic "sweet" voices. Does YAMAHA actually believe people want a few things and not the others? Am I just some strange composer type that wants it all in one package?

This whole process really just makes me mad that manufacturers won't make one great big expensive thing that does it all. I would pay $6000 to have both keyboards in one (and having the piano samples from the P80 would be nice too). People pay twice that much for a real piano that makes only one sound AND needs maintenence. I would gladly pay that much for the absolute Rolls Royce of keyboards/workstations with the best sounds ever. So what if it needs to have 900MB for voice memory becuase the sounds will be unbelievably real. So what if it can take a breath controller AND all three types of piano pedals (I'm probably one of a few who actually use all three when playing piano). So what if it weighs five tons--it's going to stay in my home studio. And so what if it is a "production synthesizer" and an "arranger" with arpeggiators AND auto-accompaniment. Is there some electrical disorder that occurs if both things are put in one instrument? I guess I'm just stupid about the technology. Call it what you want: synthesizer, workstation, arranger, organ, Casio VL-Tone, cookie monster piano--just give me everyhting!!!! I'm tired of being forced to buy every type of thing out there just to have everything. I would end up spending more than what it would have cost just to make the Grand Daddy I am looking for. Isn't there some market out there for what I want! Is there anyone out there that makes such a beast? Maybe I need to look outside the mainstream manufacturers like Yamaha, Korg, Roland, etc., and find some other company. Anyone know?

Enough dreaming. I guess I simply have to play with both the MOTIF and the 9000Pro enough to listen to the samples since those are what I have to live with. I can learn how to use one or the other, but if I don't like the sounds, it will be for nothing. Even onboard sequencing means very little to me since I have been obviously using a PSR-500 in conjunction with Cool Edit Pro and never having to worry about polyphony, number of notes, etc. It's all realtime to a click track. If I can do that with a "toy" keyboard, just think of the possibilities once I get my hands on something with realistic, more up-to-date sounds.

Hi Sean,
WOW-- Even though I don`t have I don`t have "realplayer" on my computer , just going through your web-site was most impressive !! (I`ll try later to get realplayer to hear some of your songs) (Quicktime? for us "Mac" users?)
Anyway, you bring up a very good point, why can`t they make one KB that does every thing!! Great idea but I don`t think it will happen (too much corp. greed).
I almost feel bad about suggesting this, but , It is that time of the year , well almost , when some new KB should be hitting the market . For one the "Technics KN7000" but from what I`ve read that is just going to have a huge price tag and I`m not sure about expanability. The "Gem- Genesys" is also comming but same thing not sure about expan. And "what about first production bugs" you certainly don`t need that. So in the end I think they (the companies) just want our money. One thing, you mentioned use of a breath controler, I wonder, could you "hook up" and external to the 9000Pro? If so your in luck. In any case if you`ev been using a "Psr500" to do your work (even though I`m only guessing) then whatever you get will be "a breath of fresh air (sorry -on pun) They have come a long way since the psr500. If you have a chance, see if the 9000pro will work with a breath-controler even if it`s through "midi" I know that "Yamaha" does make one.
Well take care O-BTW feel free to e-mail me if you want. Keep posting -"talk" later and "Scott Yee if your reading this can you offer any help, thanks"
jedi

Can you hear MP3's? I have prepared a medley of different styles of things I've created using the PSR-500. The only "automation" I used was creating my own drum rhythm. I did sometimes keep the onbard fill-ins but reprogram the main beat. Evrything else was played live in the onboard sequencer. Then the vocals were mixed in using a multi-track tape recorder (and later Cool Edit Pro for reamstering). So I guess you're right, anything better will be a breath of fresh air.

I won't leave it on my server for too long. You can download it at this address:
www.seanbaker.com/psr500.mp3

Hi Sean,
Thanks for the "mp3-demo" , I realy enjoyed it. My freind you have talent+ and who is the female vocalist? A voice of clarity and beauty. If you did all that on a psr500 (and I`m sure you did) you make old "gear" sound like new stuff !!! O-BTW the drum beats are cool too. I checked on "Yamaha`s" web-site and found a "wind controller" that works through midi , link> http://www.yamaha.com/cgi-win/webcgi.exe/DsplyModel/?gMCD00005WX5
From what I heard on your demo , the 9000Pro , would IMO suit you very... nicely.
Do you plan on releasing a "CD" with your talent for "arranging" and the vocals (the lady) you could make a "mint" !!! To be completly honest it sounds like "Karen and Richard" are back, (the Carpenters, dare I show may age ,hahahaha)
Anyway it was a pleasure and thanks again, Take care and best of luck
jedi

Hi Sean,

Welcome to the Synthzone Arranger forum.

I listened to the many excellent song offerings produced & performed by you (and the '4 Sexes' on your website and I'm really IMPRESSED with both your website layout, music & entertaining commentary. I really 'dig' your 50's 60's lounge jazz style, and your polished musicianship skills. It clearly shows you've put in your dues. I'm both an afficiando & performer of the same (similar) style of music myself (wow, 'another' Rosemary Clooney Fan . . . I loved your rendition of 'Shore of Brazil', and yes Rosemary really missed an opportunity of not recording it on her recent album of Brazilian songs, but you and the Pink Lady did it justice. Julie London, Pied Pipers, Steve & Edyie Gorme, what a COOL era, and you've really captured it so well. I was particularly impressed that your early demos were produced entirely on the Yamaha 550 arranger. Just goes to show that it's not necessarily the instrument you use, but HOW you use it. Btw, what is your musical background & how did you get into the cocktail lounge thing?

Back to your original question of auto accompaniment arranger vs workstation. I can understand your dilemma. For a one man band (utilizing the Yamaha PSR2000) performing musician such as myself, an auto accompaniment keyboard is the way to go. In your case, since your specialty (from what I hear) is jazz, and you are working with a live band (the 4 Sexes), I wonder how useful the 9000pro be. The 9000pro is a great keyboard but the styles (jazz) are pretty weak. In fact, I had to export and cutomize the much better jazz styles from my prior arranger board (Technics KN5000) to my PSR2000 to achieve type of swing styles I was after. If auto accompaniment is still what you need, I'd also checkout the Technics KN6500 or the upcoming new KN7000 when it hits the stores (later this year). Imho, Technics does a much better job with jazz genre styles and also, if you enjoy playing those cool jazz keyboard voicings (rootless chords etc ala Diana Krall & Bill Evans), only the Technics really supports this in full keyboard mode. Good luck in your keyboard search. I'll look forward to checking out your act with the 4 Sexes at Nicky Blaines if I ever get to Indianpolis. If you have any other specific questions, please feel free to ask. There are a lot of knowledable people here from divserve musical backgrounds willing to help. Scott


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http://scottyee.com

Jedi, First to address your comments: Thanks for the compliments. The girl singer is Heather Nieideffer. We've been working together for about ten years since we met as freshmen at IU's school of music.

And regarding the CD, she is also the lead singer for my live band "Four Sexes". We hope to have it out next month. Please check out www.foursexes.com and hear the preview clips and then click the "send us" link so we can add you to the notification list once it's released.

Yes, everything was done on the PSR-500 except of course the vocals, the synth-sitar, the jingle bells, and the horse-clip-clop done by my mouth, ha. The drum beats were made using the PSR-500's drumsounds. Like others, I'm sure, some of the preset jazz styles leave much to be desired. I found that sequencing my own style on the psr-500 was better because I made them less complicated than the presets which at times get annoying. I did often keep the preset drum fill-ins because they added a nice break to the drum loop and I hate to have to program a fill-in since I'm not a drummer.




Scottyee: many thanks for your supportive comments. Actually it was older PSR-500 (from 1992) that I used. But, yes you can get good results from a toy keyboard. My only problem is the quality of the samples which is what brought me to this forum in search of a better keyboard.

Regarding the "auto-accomp" discussion. I guess I got off topic a little. The auto-accomp thing is really secondary to me. I only enjoyed using it to make quick demos of new melodies for my lyricist when I didn't want to spend too much time orchestrating the song, but still wanted the lyricist to get a good feel for the tempo and style. I can really live WITHOUT it if to get better quality samples and sequencing abilities I have to go with something like the MOTIF. But it sounds like the 9000pro sequencer may suit me just fine.

Also, yes, hearing my demo would lead you to believe my specialty is jazz, which it is. However, part of what I'm working on now involves much more need for electronic/techno type grooves, pads, and leads. Of course I still want to be able to retain use of jazz stuff which means good acoustic instrument sounds too. In light of this, 9000pro or MOTIF???

I've been into "Space Age Pop" music since about 1987 when I was sixteen and discovered that my orchestra teacher in highschool, Dick Dennis, actaully worked with Henry Mancini, my favorite composer whom I had just begun discovering then. Before that I was sucked into big band music while playing for the jazz ensemble. Through college, I became more interested in vocalists from that era and vocal groups. With Heather, I put together a vocal quartet specializing in Piep Pipers, Modernaires, Hi-Los type of stuff. Later, Heather and I did many Steve & Eydie acts since the other two members of the group graduated and moved on. After, Heather and I both moved to Orlando (and consequently both met our spouses there), we decided that we all hated the Florida heat and moved back home where we have been dabbling in retro-styled jingles and now recently this fun, space age pop band, Four Sexes where we do many lounge renditions of pop/rock tunes besides the standards. Speaking of jingles, I forgot to include in the demo the "Remember When Theme" which also was done with PSR-500 and my baritone ukulele (???). You can hear that tune by going to the Remember When website. www.rwpi.com.


THANKS again to all who are helping me pick the right keyboard. I'm getting closer to my decision.


[This message has been edited by seanbaker (edited 07-19-2002).]

Hi Sean,
I down-loaded "RealPlayer" , but my "dail-up" is sooo slowww that I could only hear your songs in "mono" But I still enjoyed your (The FourSexes) music. A nice blend of ,Pop , Blues & Jazz very nice and original. I still think IMO that the 9000Pro would suit your needs, however, please don`t just go on my opinion!! If you haven`t yet down-loaded the manual , it helps, thats what I did before I bought my Psr2000 (Y2K) I had a chance to see and read about all the features and what it had to offer. (No place in my area had one , so I had to buy sight unseen, so the manual was a big help) Where you have a variety of "things" you do on a KB the 9K does allow alot of options ,but the "Motif" does as well. The only deciding factor for me would be the auto-acomp. As far as actual "sound quality" I think the 9K or the Motif would be pretty close (of course the amp and speakers will "tell the end story") Best of luck--OBTW did you have a chance to check out the "Yamaha" --"Wind-Controler"? 2nd BTW I signed up fro details reguarding the "FourSexes" CD
Thanks ,
I hope I`ve helped and not confussed--take care,
jedi
PS: The "Wow-Factor" of the "Goose-Neck" lamps for the 9K-P on a darkened stage, to me would be a big plus

[This message has been edited by jedi (edited 07-19-2002).]