One of the lower keys on my 2000 has broken.
The key has some "spring back" but is "mushy"
and does not respond to the touch sensitivity.
Donny and I had a session las Tuesday and it looks like it got a "work out" (Donny, you broke my KB!)
Anyway, Uncle Dave is right, this machine was built as a "toy", not a professional kB.
I am in deep trouble, since I got a gig on Saturday and I have no replacement for it.
God knows how long it'll be laid up for repair.
Does anyone know what might have happened?
and what to do about it?
heeeelp!
Mario

[This message has been edited by Mario (edited 09-05-2002).]

Many times, the spring at the top of the key falls out of place and just needs to be repositioned. I hope that's all that happened. Good luck!
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Thanks George. I have the cover off the keyboard but it seems like the whole keyboard system is enclosed and it's hard to see behind the keys. Do you know how to get inside this structure to examine it and see if the spring is out of place?
Have you ever seen this contraption appart?
thanks,
Mario

Mario,
sorry, I've never opened a PSR2000. It seems the PSR keyboards are harder to get into than the pro keyboards. there is more room and heavier parts inside the more expensive models and to keep things light, it's harder to work on.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Well folks, I found the problem. I finally figured out how to take the rubber key pads off for examination; and sure enough, one of them was ripped as if had been cut by a knife. Don't understand how something like this could happen, unless something fell on top of the key and hit it quite hard; it's something I consider almost impossible to do by just "playing" normally. (Donny, I know you are a “hard hitter” but even you couldn’t have done it on our last session)
Any way, the KB has a total of 4 sections of rubber pads plus one single pad for the top key. The repair is a rather simple one, since all I need is to replace the damaged pad section. Which I'll be ordering from yamaha in the morning.
Taking the structure around the pads to get access to them is a little tricky, unless you know how the whole thing is put together, which took me a while to figure out. Essentially, the pads are "sandwiched" in place by two solid-state circuit boards, which simply snap in place held by plastic push lock tabs, not screws.
I switched the rubber pads in the keyboard by placing the bad one (which was in the lower section) at the high end of the KB or the highest octave, which I can do without until I get the replacement pad section.
I am excited that I won't have to send the keyboard out for repair and get laid up for a month by fixing it myself and, that I will be able to perform on Saturday night.
I hope this can help someone who might run into the same predicament in the future.
Are you listening Scott? It’s just a matter of time buddy!
Yes, this keyboard was built as if Yamaha was already losing money on it. Lets hope the Tyros isn't built with the same philosophy of the psr2000, you know folks, catering to the "home players market"
Mario


[This message has been edited by Mario (edited 09-05-2002).]

mario,

I know the feeling very well. I am so glad you figured out the problem.get the part OVERNIGHT SHIPPED! Your KB would have been laid up for a while. I would get a few of those rubber things just in case of an emergency. This is why all pros need a backup KB identicle to each other. I have two 9k's, plus I have extra sets of keys and rubber key strips, plus I also ordered the 9k Yamaha tech manual/schematic booklet. Next time we meet I'll give you the service shop in PT Pleasant info for Yamaha in our area. Have a good gig!



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 09-05-2002).]

Donny:
How was your gig tonight budd? I would have come over, but you know my predicament.
I am glad we have a Yamaha service shop in Point Pleasant, I will call them tomorrow, maybe they'll have the part I need.
I see you are getting Sonar down "pretty good", it's a great program.
I'll give you a call tomorrow.
Mario

Mario, GREAT to hear that you were able to figure out the problem and avoid having to send the kb in for repair for 'who knows' how long. Donny's suggestion of purchasing the Technical/Schematic Manual as well as keeping spare parts on hand is very WISE!

I definitely hear you loud and clear, and realize just how lucky I've been not experiencing problems with my 2000 (yet). I'll just have to keep Donny Pesce a safe distance away from 'MY' board . . .just kidding of course . Luckily I've got a buddy who also owns a 2000 and has agreed to lend me his if ever mine develops trouble, but so far, mine's holding up fine, especially considering how much gig transporting & playing I do. I never bang on the keys, but I definitely play with intensity so would think something would have gone wrong by now, if it was going to happen. I'm just keepin my fingers crossed until I purchase my 'next' model arranger board: Tyros, XD9,KN7000, or possibly even another PSR2000 Mario, please keep us posted on your kb repair progress. We're all pulling for you. - Scott

Mario,

Glad you were able to figure out the mechanics of the keyboard. Let us know what the strip cost. It may be worthwhile to keep several on hand, if not to costly.

Can you take some digital pictures of the disassemled keyboard, and show us the proper way to get at the keys. How many times have we heard "A picture is worth a thousand words."

Thanks for helping the members benefit from your unfortunate predicament. I have been wondering about the Tyros construction , myself. I have not heard any comment about the feel or durability of the 'Tyros' keys.

Regards,

Jerry

mario,

check your mail ASAP

Anyone know a good spares contact in the UK for this sort of stuff - it look like getting a spare contact strip or two would be a very good idea!

Hi Everyone.
Mario I have never had a Psr series or any Yamaha Keyboards cause I never fancied them so what I am about to say is 100 neutral.
What happend to you is very COMMON especially people like us who gig a lot. I have changed quite a few on GEM WK serious at times I had to change the whole keyboard.
One thing I would like to tell you 1. is when you replace. If your keyboard have AFTERTOUCH be careful not to trun it over cause you have 2 ROWS of them CARBON pads, if you put it in a different direction you have to reopen and turn it the other way.
2. if most of you haven't experience it every now and then check all the notes and see if any of them sounds higher than the others, in that case it means that it is about to go.and one other thing most of them pads match with other makes for example roland puds are the same as WK4.

Good luck

It's just amazing. Where were the Yamaha engineers when brains were given out?
As I analyze the construction of the 2000, I am just “perplexed” at some of the things I saw.
They have 10 screws holding the small metal cover for the arranger's electronic board inside, but are you ready? .. only two screws holding the whole structure that holds the keys. In other words, if these two screws come lose, the whole keyboard mechanism comes apart. More incredible yet, is the "metal to plastic" screw system the use to hold everything together, something you would see in a "Mattel toy" build for a child to play with; specially in such crucial areas as this one.
Another think that I was amazed to see was the key themselves; Yamaha uses the plastic on the keys for their "spring back" action, in other words, there are no metal springs whatsoever, the rubber pads help the keys to spring back when pressed, but the key actually "bends" at it's root. Wow! Imagine, how many times this bending action happens throughout the life of a KB? It's like they've been pompously designed to "break".
Another cheap "shortcut" that Yamaha utilized in the construction of this KB is the "ribbon" connectors they use. I was "terrified" after I put the KB back together when, after turning "on" the keyboard, it booted up fine but the arranger section did not work. What now? I said. Well, after reopening it, I noticed that one of the ribbons had disconnected probably while removing the front cover. I noticed that it actually didn't have a plug at the end. As I try to reconnect it, I realized that the ribbon goes into the "socket" by pushing it in and locking it by pressing two small tabs on each side of it, no solder performed here folks! just "contact". Cheap, cheap, cheap, shame on you Yamaha!. This kind of connection will eventually becomes lose due to the vibration of the sound generated by the speakers. What happened to the good old Japanese craftsmanship?
I am still perplexed at how they can produce such a "clean" great sounding kb and put such "shoddy" construction in it, they could have charged another couple of hundred dollars for it and build it right, everyone (included Yamaha) would have benefited from it.
Folks, if the Tyros was designed with the "home Player" in mind? well, let me tell you, ...I will have to be extremely certain , that this new Kb is not going to have the same type of construction of the 2000 before I place my order for it.

Regards,
Mario



[This message has been edited by Mario (edited 09-06-2002).]

Mario,

I'm not surprised at all. You get what you pay for!

I've used the 2000 for just about a year, at least 5 nights a week. I've had no problems at all, and I actually like it better now than I did when I got it.
It is an amazing keyboard at any price, and simply a wonderful buy for the money.
Of course I still have not forgiven Yamaha for marketing it under false pretences and for not correcting the vocal harmony fault (actually a minor thing).
Because of the versatility and functionality of the 2000, I now plan to get a Tyros--after I see it and play it of course--despite my dissapointment with Yamaha.
DonM

Hi Don:
I am not knocking the 2000. Yes, it is a terrific machine for the money. I am criticizing Yamaha for their poor judgment in building this kb. I personally love the sound and capabilities; it's how they "mismatched" the design with it's construction.
Mine is a keeper as well, since I love what is capable of doing, but I am concerned about spending $3200 for a "supped up" Tyros and find out that there are no springs on the keys, just plastic "bending".
Regards,
Mario

Wowwww. nothing to do with the GEM WK4 , it is very robust and what I call a pro keyboard.No SPRING!!!! that's way toooo much,
2 Screws holding the keys!!! it is a toy thing.
About the connection you mentioned if it is the kinda one I know that is ok, not easy to come off, but the thing that there are no spring that is way too far for me to think off. oh well we can't always look inside when we buy a keyboard.....

You manged to get it running now??? for your gig on Saturday??


Tony.

I had a REAL toy Yamaha synth voice sampler, a VSS-30: http://www.sonicstate.com/synth_reviews/yamaha_vss-30.cfm
http://www.harmony-central.com/Synth/Data/Yamaha/VSS-30-01.html

My kids banged away on this puppy for years and years. It still works great! What a fun toy (especially changing your voice and having each key play the "voice" in a different tone -- has built in mike). I paid ~$35 for it on close out when it was discontinued.

I bring this up because of this whole "built like a toy" issue with the 2000. In fact one of the keys on the VSS did break a while back. When I opened it I too was surprised to see all the keys were "cut" from a single sheet of plastic (a single mold for all keys on a single sheet is more accurate). They key "fingers" on the sheet (the note keys) bend using the pivot point of the plastic. So the flexibility of the plastic is what provides the action of the keys. Clever! Cheap!

The danger is not from overuse of the keys causing the plastic to fracture at the "pivot point". In my case one of the kids pulled UP on that key (maybe it got caught in something) and that's how it broke.


Anyway, surprisingly, I was able to glue that "key" back on the main sheet of plastic and it again played good as new. The action in that key is not materially different from the others.

You want Steinway Action? Go pay Steinway prices! I don't expect these keys to "break off" from overuse. But don't pull UP on any of them (this will happen when you move the 2000 and something gets caught (a sleeve on your jacket?) UNDER one of the keys)....

Cheers,

Bob

Bob:
Again, and forgive me for repeating myself, I am not kncking the KB, I know, I know, it's cheap, and that's fine! It's Yamaha's poor judgement on building it so poorly when another $200 added to the price would have kept everyone happy with a "professional KB" even them.
On a more positive note, I just call them and they will send me the broken pad free of charge, since they were happy to find out that I will be doing the repair and not them.

Mario

Jerry:
The strips for the 2000 are part # vu328400 and they cost $19.95 a piece, plus $4.95 for shipping. They cost nothing if you are still under warrantee, however, you would have to go thru a dealer.
Mario

[This message has been edited by Mario (edited 09-06-2002).]

HI: Mario
I hope you get your KB going again for your
gig Sat. Night.
Did you get extra strips for the 2000 just
in case you need them at a later date?
Denny

Mario - thanks for printing the part no for the strips - and the PSR2000 keyboard "spring" is identical to my older PSR630.