Well, I've had the speakers for a few days and here's my thoughts......

They're good, but not GREAT. I don't think the mid range is missing as much as the highs and lows are more pronounced.

The satellites are crystal clear on voices like the piano and sound very good. The sub woofer is nothing special and sounds like a typical computer sub.

The mounting brackets and how they sit on the Tyros is nice and I do like the speakers facing me and allows for a better listening experience rather than pointing at the ceiling as in other boards.

I would have prefered though that they came up with a better set of all range satellites and dump the sub woofer.

The satellites won't run without the sub being on. The on off switch is on the back of the sub sitting on the floor which is a pain in the butt to crawl around on the floor to turn it off and on. I solved it by leaving the sub on and plugging it into a power strip at the Tyros level.....but....

I think the setup is ok for home/studio use, but if I were considering using it on a live gig, I would take my powered studio monitors to use, if I was not going through an amo or pa system.

In short, I think they could/should have come up with a better setup satellite full range set of speakers.
jam on,
Terry

The speakers should be built in

Actually Dave, I disagree. After having these, sitting on top facing me, I prefer them to the built ins facing the ceiling, the sound difference is amazing.
Terry

Terry,

Your review 'fits' with mine (a couple of months ago during one of the very first DEMO's)
I too disagree with UD (sorry UD ) and think speakers should be pointed to the audience/player.

A German company called SYRINCS produces great (mini)PA's with an excellent sound (about 600 Euros).....much better than the Yammy-system. (bright, warm, deep and SUB)

Roel

http://www.syrincs.de/new/m3bl.htm


Roel,

KOOL speakers

I also finally received (last Friday) the backordered Tyros speakers for my Tyros keyboard. My opinion is that though they sound very good (but not great), that they sound BETTER than ANY arranger keyboard 'built in speaker' system I've ever played.

Tyros speaker setup/breakdown is really a breeze, If the speaker brackets are left mounted to the keyboard, it takes less than 8 seconds to attach each satelite speakers to the keyboard, and another 10 seconds to place the subwoofer on the floor and plug it into the keyboard. The subwoofer is heavier, and not built as rugged as I would have prefered, but it definitely sounds better than any internal 'built into the keyboard' speaker system. Frankly, I'd never rely solely on 'built into the keyboard' speakers alone to provide sound for any of MY paying gig performances. My clients deserve better, so I almost always augment my sound with at least one external PA speaker (EV SxA100). What I particularly like about the Tyros speakers (as personal monitors) is that can be optimally aimed directly towards MY ears.

The one thing I notice about the Tyros satellite speaker mounting brackets is that there is a 'seemingly useless' piece of plastic that sticks out (protrudes) out past the rear of the keyboard making a 'larger than necessary' keyboard case required if the brackets are to remain permananantly attached to the KB. After coming to the conclusion that this piece of protruding plastic is totally useless and will not compromise the integrity or strength of the bracket whatsoever, I'm thinking of removing it altogether (with a hack saw) to make it possible to fit the keyboard in the 'smallest possible' keyboard case (Kaces Porter #9 or Yamaha Signature brand Tyros gig bag) which more closely matches the EXACT dimensions of the Tyros keyboard itself.

I'm also looking for a separate lightweight soft yet padded gig bag which will best fit the Tyros Subwoofer: 13.8" (350mm) x 8.3" (210mm) x 12.6" (321mm) and/or the Tyros satellite speakers: 3.8" (97mm) x 6.9" (174mm) x 7" (178mm). Anyone have any recommendations?

Thanks. - Scott

SPEAKERS.

The reason yamaha put separate speakers witht he TYROS was to make the illusion that it is a "professional" board (since all professional keyboard DO NOT have speakers, pro keyboardists use amplifiers on gigs) and pro keyboardists look down upon keyboards with built in speakers, considering anything with built in speakers to be a "toy" so

this was a marketing move by Yamaha.

A good friend of mine has the TYROS, he hates the "tyros speakers" and recommends an amp (he is a gigging musician in a 2-man band.)

If you're going to pay $3000 USD for a keyboad, I think it deserves an amplifier that will make the best of those "great" sounds, I would recommend the "motion sound" stereo amp with built in "real" leslie type speaker for the organ sounds too, at about $1100 going price at online music stores.

hope that helps,

(personally I inveted in a new Roland module rather than pumping out $3000 for a TYROS, which doesn't allow you to play its best voices, the mega voices, "live". MY Roland XV5050 module has 1300 patches/voices which can be edited, and all the lovely guitars (which sound just as good as the mega guitars) can indeed by played "live" thru my trusty old PSR.

I still like the Yamaha trumpets/saxes better than the Roland's, but all the other Roland voices are absolutely fabulous, and I was a dyed in the wool Yamaha addict before demoing the FANTOM in the music store, falling in love with the sounds, then ordering the module online.

Of course the XV5050 is a SOUND MODULE and doesn't have styles or any of those extra bells and whistles. If I want to use styles, I can run them thru that, but since I've been recording as a hobby for a few months, I've drifted away from the PSr styles and am into making my own "backing tracks" for my songs.

Good luck,
Cathy

Hi Roel,
I wonder where would it be possibile to order those Syrincs speakers here in Europe. I have tried Synthplanet, but they are not in stock...

Adrea,

I just emailed Syrincs for more information.
Let's wait.

Roel

Thanks

Well, now, I guess that's aimed at me, huh?

Scott - just because YOU don't play any situations where the lack of gear is more appropriate, please don't presume to tell anyone that I'm not giving my clients everything they deserve. Believe me - they get way more than their money's worth when they book a party with me. Top notch entertainment with state of the art gear and class performances. size does NOT always matter. Sometimes it's WRONG.

My clients deserve what they pay me to offer. My judgment is worth as much as each note I sing, so let's not make it a shouting match about gear, cuz you'll loose. You're a nice guy, but still a rookie when we compare years in the trenches, so lets not go head to head on this.

In fairness - I agree that a larger 3 way system probably does sound better than a built in system, and I rarely use JUST the kb speakers without any reinforcement, but when I do .... you can bet that the end result is EXACTLY what is called for in that situation. Musicians for centuries have been labeled as "playing too loud," dressing sloppily, taking too many breaks, etc....
This is one way I've found to erase part of the damage that my predecessors have laid out before me. Small is definitely called for MANY, MANY times in my year.

Maybe it's time to move all this Tyros talk to the Yamaha forum ...... it's starting to overpower the conversations ! That way - you'll ALL agree.

Scott,
DO NOT TAKE A HACKSAW TO YOUR NEW TYROS. Any modifications have to have the manufacturer's permission IN WRITING. The minute you do that you have totally voided the warranty and any problems you may have are yours not the manufacturere or the dealer.
BE K@@L
Bebop

Hi Bebop: Don't worry . Believe me, I won't even bring a hacksaw into the 'same room' as my Tyros keyboard. I checked with Yamaha, and they assured me that cutting off that insignificant plastic piece off the plastic speaker bracket (which came with the 'optionally' purchased Tyros TRS MS01 speakers) should not compromise the strength or integrity of the speaker bracket, and also will NOT void the Tyros keyboard warranty, because it is not a part of the working function of the speakers, bracket, or even the Tyros keyboard whatsover. The other re-assuring thing is that it's simple, easy (and cheap) to purchase & replace speaker brackets if necessary. To be on the safe side though, I probably just order an extra pair of Tyros speaker bracket replacements FIRST, before attempting to cut ANYTHING off. - Scott

Hi all,

Built-in speaker are OK if the audience (room) is very small.

I would never use a single PA-speaker because the stereo-image of the keyboard is completely lost while using ONE...... my audience deserves better !

Leslie-speakers should only be used on 'drawbar' (sinus) organs as Hammond. Using them on arranger keyboards sounds terrible (with drums etc.) When sinus-sounds leave the keyboard through separate audio channels it is OK to use rotating horns/speakers.
The Hammond samples in the SD1 have a very good Leslie-effect attached. The DSP however sounds poor .... hope OS4.0 improves this.

It's OK with me if the Tyros discussions take place here

Happy NEW YEAR !

Roel

Actually Roel, I have used the Motion Sound with the PSR 9000 JUST for the Right3 voice. With that keyboard and the Tyros, you can channel certain voices to specific outputs and thus channel a specific voice to a specific AMP. In my case, I channeled all Organ voices to the Right3 layer and wailed away whilst the rest of the keyboard went through my other stereo keyboard amp.

AL G

AL G,
Exactly what I tried to tell .... the only right way to do it !

Roel

Well, I stated before and will again....IMO with 20+ years of live gigging under my belt have never performed in any venue where I thought onboard speakers alone of any kind were adequate.

Perhaps the only exception would be Grandma's front room at xmas time, but real gigs demand real equipment.

jam on,
Terry

Dave,
While you're at it take the useless sports talk with it to a sports forum too will ya.
Terry

The reason I prefer utilizing an external PA along with the onboard keyboard speakers even on the smaller gigs, is not for increased volume, but to achieve a 'richer warmer' sound than internal keyboard speakers can provide.



NO ! Did I mention your name ANYWHERE in that statement? I was merely stating my
'personal opinion' based on my own experiences. STOP thinking I was addressing you specifically, I wasn't.



I find your above comment both denegrating and insulting, and not based on any facts.



As far as your suggestion of moving all further Tyros talk to the Yamaha forum, who
are YOU to suggest censoring topics here?. It's interesting to hear how prejudiced you are againest the Tyros, yet haven't even played one yourself yet. You certainly have the right to your opinions, but advocating a Tyros discussion ban here really shows your lack of open minded-ness to differing points of views, especially on a 'general' arranger forum.

Scott

i don't think UD or anyone here was saying to just use the Internal Speakers when you GIG out! .... Just for self Monitoring Purposes!

I expect that the Tyro's will take main stage here for a month or 2 and it should... it just came out ... and many are excited about it.

I was coming to the board for months because of the kidding around we do here and the good info and diverse Opinions ... and Respect we have for each other ( most of the time)!

The Technics, Korg,Yamaha,soltan,ect are all Good Brands... and since this is a Genetic Arranger Forum and Not a Tyro's Formun ... I sort of agree with UD on this ... I sort have been feeling uncomfortable for a month or so ... talking about the PRS9000 with all the talk of Tyro's! ... or any other Brand!

And I don't mean any disrespect in saying this ... When someone got the psr2000 ... is was the GREATEST thing... and now same person LOVES the Tyro's ... ...and it's a LOVE affair ... and I know what's that's like! Let's all support each other in our Current LOVE affair with the Keyboard of our Choice!
This year it's still the psr9000 for me!
Love you guys!
Happy New year!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Roel:
[B]Hi all,

.
The Hammond samples in the SD1 have a very good Leslie-effect attached. The DSP however sounds poor .... hope OS4.0 improves this.

It's OK with me if the Tyros discussions take place here

Happy NEW YEAR !


Hey Roel ,
I was told that organ sounds have been improved with 4.0 . Ram banks will be loaded with all the new sounds .
Another feature added is the ability to instantly remove all parts of the style accept the part one you want with one button ( F1 thru F10) .
Drum and bass feature will be assignable via the foot switch .
Drum remix is going to be nice as well !
Keep jammin ! 4.0 is around the corner . Dano


PS....I do not mind the tyro's discussions . Happy New Year


------------------
Piano Man's Music City
624 Frederick Rd .
Catonsville Md. 21228
410 747 0200
danosmusic@yahoo.com

FWIW......Of the last 20 posts at the top here, only 2 were in regards to the Tyros. If my math is correct, then 80% were on other boards and subjects.

Terry



[This message has been edited by trtjazz (edited 12-31-2002).]

sounds like FUZZY Math to me!

LOL

Hey... nobody is saying don't talk about the Tyro's !

Just the Undercurrent that everything "other than" the Tyro's is "OLD NEWS" !

Comprenda!

Scott and Dave: Now you boys play nice. Don't make me come out (over, down, up) there.
DonM

Woops, now that I sharpened my pencil.....90% other than Tyros. I'm not even a blonde either. No wonder why oppenheimer never called me for the Manhattan project.

BTW anything other than the Tyros is old news at the moment, but Winter Namm will probably bring new toys to talk about, that we'll also get sick of hearing about.
jam on,
Terry

Both Scott and UD have a strong voice on this Board ... and I LIKE IT!

UD has bought a TON of stuff and reviewed it all for us ...

Scott has reviewed the PSR2000 and Tyro's and in the past Technic's too ...

We got 2 reviewers who don't always AGREE as I see it ... like good Movie Reviewers!

Also, many probably placed BETS that UD would at least Buy the Tyro's (for a few hours or days) and then Decide how long it would take before he sold it!" and UD decided not to buy it and review it!

So the gamblers LOST !

Now if UD and Scott can play the Review game but do it with a DRY sense of humor or funny pokes at each other ... I would have even more fun on this Board!

Both you guys are professional's and Gig out alot! And both are always trying to be helpful and honest in your insights!

And if either of you like something or HATE something ...you both don't pussy foot about the matter! And that's why I like you both!

Same as i like the Good Movie Reviewers when they Joke at each other when ONE gives a THUMPS UP and the OTHER a THUMPS Down on a MOVIE!

Andrea,

I got this reply from SYRINCS

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hello Mr. de Jonge,

thank You for recommending our products!!

For international selling, we handle european dealers identical with german dealers. So business is no problem. They just have to contact us.

For overseas business we have no partners at the moment.
But I know, that there are people already using SYRINCS.

With a happy new year,
keep on rocking

c.schucht@syrincs.de

My, MY, .. has all that "GIGGING" during those Christmas "JOBS" taken the CHRISTmas spirit out of us already?!?!? ...
Personally, I love all the talk about the other kb's and realize that the TYROS is the new kid on the block and is going to get a lot of talk right now ... but deep down I also realize that you guys don't know what you are missing by NOT having a 'technics', the BEST kb EVER !!! .....
.... and once again I wish you all:
PEACE, LOVE and PATIENCE !!!
t

I don't own a Tyros, will probably not own a Tyros in the forseable future (that's a complaint). If or when I'm able to afford something THAT expensive the Tyros will be old and discontinued (maybe I'll be able to buy a used one ), but I read all the Tyros posts and I am interested in all the feedback. Enjoyed the comments by Simon, Scott and Terry (keep on Jamming). Also appreciate users with other boards explaining why they won't switch to the Tyros. The Tyros discusion stays.
Starkeeper

Whew ...... touchy emotions today, huh?

I wasn't saying NO Tryros talk at all, I was just suggesting that the "Tyros specific" comments might be more appreciated in an all Yamaha forum, so the owners with the on hands experience can help each other out. Hands on advice is more valuable then speculation, right?

Yes, the mindless sports talk is just a diversion .... live with it - some of us like other things too. All music and no play makes "Jack" a dull boy. Whoever Jack is ...
It's just a way to make this place more personal, and fun.

Scott...... what can I say? You and I have had our share of miscommunications in the past, and it looks like another bout has just ensued. Sorry if you feel assaulted, but be honest - that speaker comment was shot right at me. No one else talks about the value of the on board systems as much as I do .... and for that matter - maybe some of you should try doing some of the intimate, quiet venues that facilitate conversation and eloquent dining music. You'll save your hearing, your voice and you just MIGHT enjoy the music at a more sensible listening level. There is a lot to be said about acoustic (or as close as CAN be) sound.

In small setting where the KB is the main system .... the stereo image is very much pronounced, and if you add a small bass amp or powered sub (mixed at the PROPER level) you can fill out what's missing quite nicely. The kb manufacturers know their stuff - the on board speakers make a terrific tone, and sometimes, it's better than an outboard amp, because of fine tuning of EQ settings.

I did a Christmas party a few weeks ago that was a tiny dining room in a fancy restaurant and was set with a long table for twenty. That's it. The people were so close to me, I almost didn't use a mic, but I thought the effects would enhance the performance .... even at the minuscule volume level that I performed at. The job paid very well .... (as much as any other Saturday night would for me) and the volume level, fullness of sound, QUALITY of tone, and energy of performance were ALL at my normal standard. The client and their quests were very satisfied, and at NO time did anyone have to say ....... "Um, could I hear a little more stereo separation please?" or "Is that as loud as this thing gets?"

My point is (and continues to be)

External amps are not always necessary. It's entirely up to the size and volume requirements of the situation. I do a very broad cross-section of work ranging from intimate cocktail parties to high school dances, and everything in between. The gear setups have to be flexible and the decision to use "what" has to be made at each performance. There is NO one way to set up, and at the end of my year (tomorrow) I will have done such a wide variety of setups, I could publish the list in Keyboard Mag as a "How to" manual for the novice player. I pride myself of being extra creative with setups, and my clients all appreciate it. I hate to even see wires in a fancy home set up. It takes away from the visual.

We all have our own experiences to draw from, and it's only natural to assume that our way is the best way, but this place is starting to get overly sensitive to criticism. My mind is open to anyone's comments or suggestions, and my advice and/or comments will ensue, if I have a valid point to share. It used to be a happier place .......... let's get back to that.

So, here's my New Years Resolution:

I promise to censor all comments that "single out" another member until I reread it. That way, I'll get a fresh approach to the subject matter before it becomes a public statement. In the end - I really am trying to help ..... and sometimes that help will come in the form of challenging another member's advice if I feel it's valid. I stand by all my comments thus far, and I'm sorry if everyone does not agree, but hey - that's life. We're all different.

Happy New Year to all ........... I mean that.

Hi Roel,
thank you for the info and all your help; so I guess I should ask a local dealer if he can order those Syrincs speakers... hmmm...


[This message has been edited by Dreamer (edited 12-31-2002).]

Tony,

Technics? Please!! Don't let the cat out of the bag. Just pucker your lips a bit, slide your index finger close to those protruding kissers in a vertical position and emit a SHHHhhhhhhh------- sound.

Grandpa Doug

P.S. Happy New Year to those who don't have. To those who do have, you are happy already.

P.S. Number two: Uncle Dave you were born with the outer ends of your lips pointing up so your happy no matter what.

Hi Dave,
I have a little suggestion for you, to begin the new year in a different way. You say that you are in love, right? And when a man is in love, the woman he loves has a deep influence on him: he wants to be up to her expectations and would never disappoint her. Moreover, you wrote that the woman you love is very good-hearted and is involved in charity organizations, health-care providing etc.
So here is my suggestion: every time you are going to post something here in a sharp-tongued way, just think what "she" would say of your behavior. Would she approve? Would she be still proud of you?
If the answer is "yes", then go on.
Happy New Year to you and your loved ones.
Andrea

Andrea,
Wise words. Definatly food for thought. Thanx.

It's been obvious (to me) that Uncle Dave and I have been in FULL agreement regarding utilizing onboard keyboard speakers all along, and that augmenting them with a small bass or PA amp just helps to 'fill out' what's missing from the onboard speakers alone. In fact, my INITIAL post on this thread stated 'just that', so I was actually SURPRISED to find Uncle Dave thinking I was somehow taking aim at HIM.



Uncle Dave, I agree. I too have played MANY small intimate quiet room venues (conducive to dining/conversation) in my almost 20 years as a pro musician-entertainer. I'd hardly call myself a rookie though, as you had referred to me as.

Ok, maybe "rookie" was a bit over the edge. I was just fluffing my tail feathers ..... peace?

Peace . . . of COURSE - absolutely !

Dave,
The right thing to do...
Happy New Year
Terry

I know you guys are sick of hearing this, but if it doesn't copy and paste measures, to me it is useless. I have to have this function in sequencing. I could care less if the sax sounds better than Getz, Coltrane David Sanborn and every sax player that ever lived all put together. Period!!!

I'm the only guy here that disagrees with everyone on this forum, and I am proud to say that I am a rookie arranger person. I enjoy the loner roll. Ha! Ha! I don't know how to do the little face guys. It's hard for an old dog to learn new tricks.

[This message has been edited by brickboo (edited 12-31-2002).]

bb,
You can do the little face by : colon and ) bracket....

Also, if you look to the left of your post area < (that way...your other left see the thing that says smiles legend? Click on that and it will tell you all the keystrokes for the little faces.

Now as far as on board sequencers.....they could leave them off entirely for my tastes....that's what I have Sonar for if I wanted to cut & paste....which I don't and is why I use the AW4416 hard disc recorder, because I'm an old dog too and prefer to have it all laid out in front of me with buttons and sliders to play with.
Terry




[This message has been edited by trtjazz (edited 12-31-2002).]

By the way, I was able to find both the Syrincs speakers and the Midiman sound card at this german online shop:
http://www.musik-service.de/ProduX/Recording/Monitore/Syrincs_M3_Monitor_System_mit_Woofer.htm

I use the Midiman Delta 4X4 card...it's an excellent card and come with a 4> & 4< breakout box for plugging 4 ...1/4" cables in for audio.
jam on,
Terry