Hi
http://www.rolandkeyboardclub.com/v/prod_detail.php?id=224&selected=3&pagina=1

Thanx for the link .....mny have been waiting for these, I hope to hear more soon.

look at that!...
they did it after all!
thanks nielshs

that's not bad either!!

They kind-of did it. IMHO a few highly orchestrated demos does not give me a feel for what the instrument sounds like. Compare this to the yamaha site for Tyros 2.

Some real world demos from the manufactures would be nice for a change. You can read on this forum about Yamaha's disinterest in a 76-key arranger because the main market is the home-user/hobbiest. However, the demos provided by Yamaha and Roland are these pro-level, wiz-bang, sounds-really-cool-but-you-will-never-be-able-to-make kind of demos. The only place you see real-world is the videos of live demos when you can watch hands and see how much is playing vs. button pushing.

I think it's great that these keyboards have the capability of performing complex arrangments. However, the manufacturers do a disservice by not clearly delimiting between what can be easily done and what takes significant effort to produce.

But what do I know? They sell a lot of keyboards and I don't. Now that I think of it, they shouldn't change a thing. Because if they did, I wouldn't get the opportunity to buy the like-new keyboards on Ebay of people who don't understand what they are getting, get frustrated, and then sell them.

[This message has been edited by RobertG (edited 05-10-2006).]

Roland E-80: 61 note keyboard; 49.60 LBS (22.5KG) !

Scott that includes the built in 94 watt sound system[I think that is only 17 lbs more than your Tyros2 without the speaker set up]..
If the sound system is good[?]..50 lbs is nothing to carry..

Even if this was one of the best keyboards around...After years of luggin' around the Psr-9000, I got to where it was an extreme burden to transport the board. I had added a couple of pounds to the 9000 in customized item that I installed. I have to say that the weight was enough to really hurt my hands if I had to carry it very far. No more heavy weights for me!:O


Dennis L. Almond
aka...TwoNuts

Dennis , I like wheels on my cases..

I wasn't terribly impressed by those demos. I was impressed with the arrangements, but I thought the Big Band sounds were kind of cheezy. On the Orchestral piece, the Timpani drums sounded like a low register Machine Gun from the GM bank of sounds.

The Contemporary track did a good job of sounding like Pat Metheny with a very nice vocal patch.

Dennis, Amen, brother. MUST be under 40 pounds, preferably under 30.
Arthritis will get your attention, guys.
DonM

agree with kbrkr, not impressed and I wanted to be, but then again these are the first few demos and there's got to be better to come? the smooth jazz demo, the sax and guitar sounds don't come anywhere near to the Tyros 2's SA sounds.

I just listened to the "movie" demo and I am NOT impressed.

No demos on the E50/E60.
If the E80 isn't that impressive, the E50 will be even less so.
Hey Yamaha, when are you coming out with the PSR3100. The canadian dollar is up. I'm ready, willing and waiting.
Starkeeper

[This message has been edited by Starkeeper (edited 05-10-2006).]

I think that some of your Tyros owners can´t be impressed by anything. You love your polished souding keyboard so much that your have forgot how music should sound when it comes from a real band. The G-70 and E-80 sounds more rearl than the Tyros2. Try to listen to some of your cd´s.

nielshs I've said it before, if you don't want to see negative comments on SZ then you may as well post elsewhere.
The Tyros 2 does have it's faults yes, so does the G70, all others and no doubt the E80 when it's out. However just because people have chosen to voice their opinions on here (and they are not all Tyros owners either) don't get ratty because some have said the few E80 demos are nothing amazing, because they are NOT.
As for the G70/E80 souding like a real band, if a band where I lived sounded like that they would pay them up early and send them packing
I'm not having a go at you either, you always start off on one as soon as something negative about Roland is said. You've said enough negative things for ages now about Yamaha and to be honest I couldn't care less what you think of Yamaha or me. It's a forum so take the rough with the smooth m8

Just remembered a music shop in the UK already has an E80 by the looks of things as they are preparing a demo DVD which is going to be sent out to me free very soon. The guy at the shop has also edited some sounds and new styles which they are giving free with the E80 so it could still look good.
When I get this DVD I will post my thoughts -hopefully positive as I want another arranger keyboard soon and have not had a Roland for ages.

[This message has been edited by Craig_UK (edited 05-10-2006).]

I just spoke with a friend the other day who talked to one of Yamaha's 'arranger keyboard' design team guys, of who had a chance to play the E-80, and who acknowledged how much he was impressed with it, saying he felt it was a dramatic improvement, addressing & correcting the widely acknowledged complaints about the G70, adding that the E-80 (not G70) appears now to be Roland's top contender to beat Yamaha Tyros2. . . so the arranger race continues for Yamaha to continue to work feverishly to stay on top.

Though I presently have no plans to purchase an E-80 myself (50 lbs is way too heavy for gig transport portability) , I'm really anxious now to get my hands on one now to take it for a test drive myself. - Scott

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 05-10-2006).]

Funny that it´s your comments that piss me of. Seems that YOU don´t want to see negative comments yourself, when it comes to the Tyros2, right.

[This message has been edited by nielshs (edited 05-10-2006).]

Seeing negative comments about the T2 doesn't bother me. For the few negative ones I've seen, I'm sure Yamaha will rectify them in a future operating system update, so if Yamaha are to iron out any imperfections, negatives can only serve all T2 owners for the better.

Very interesting. So Yamaha checks out the competition. If only Roland would be so inclined, they might wake up.
Starkeeper

It looks like the e80 sounds are ahead of the g70 but unfortunately nowhere near the tyros2. Why cant Roland get their saxes,strings,guitars and flutes to sound as good as the tyros2? Why dont they create new and improved samples? Take a listen to the sweet soprano sax on the tyros for example. Its amazing. The soprano sax on the g70 sounded totally unrealistic and weak at best. Heck i doubt the korg oasys has a better soprano sax than the tyros. Now perhaps Roland has a newly sampled soprano sax on the e80...we will know soon

Hi

The first E-80 style demos published and it seems that everything starts all over again. "The Tyros2 sounds better", "Im NOT impressed by the sound", "Its to heavy", "The sax and guitar sounds don't come anywhere near to the Tyros 2's SA sounds" ..........................................

Im out of here, bye bye.

Best Regards
Niels

To each his own,,,When I play the E-80 and/or G70..I will know in 5 minutes if it is for me.

This is all the time I needed with the Tyros2..to know it isn't what I want..

Listen to all opinions with an open mind, but trust your own thoughts after you play them..

I thought the E-80 demos were just okay..the same with the Tyros2 demos I heard..
Don't base everything on these demos...wait till you play the instrument...know matter what brand..

Hello All
Just thought I would add another point to ponder over.
You all seem to have missed something here, and that is the bit rate, which is 128Kbs.
As you may or may not know, the lower the bit rate, the more the compression, and the worse the sound.
Modern Arrangers need at least 192Kbs to show off the quality of the sounds, Giga Samples and other large sample library’s require a minimum of 256Kbs to show the quality of the sounds.
So I would suggest that you wait until some proper samples are released, and then make a judgment on the quality.

Bill

The demos only appear to be on the Roland keyboard clubs site, they are not on Roland.com as of yet, so as Abacus rightly puts the quality is a low bit rate. Maybe a model was lent to someone for those demos?
I know one of the UK shops already has one. Roland will possibly put different demos and maybe a video shortly on their web sites. The E80 is supposed to be out late June/early July in the UK from what I'm being told, so Roland still have a month to get into shape, but as usual they always leave it late to demo their models

I hope to see a real good quality live E80 Demo also...I enjoy watching them all..I think all KB should be done this way.....seeing & hearing is believing to a point

I heared the Demos of the E80 and they are very good and impressing.Another good point is that the wellknown Rolandhaters can post their negative comments again. Come on boys tell us about the E80 what you have to say.
The sounds ,the styles, the weight and what so ever, everything can be critisised.
The E80 must be a great instrument to create so much reactions. Some of you seem to be a bit anxious.
Come on Craig and others let us hear you.
The E80 will be strong enough and we all know your comments, we , Rolandplayers and neutral musicians laugh and have a big smile when we read what you write.
The E80 will be the winner and you are the losers.

Hi all
The real accoustic instruments are the original (no electric sound effect). So how close your keyboards sounding like original?
We have two ears. Original don't use 'lipstics'.

Hmmm... the G-70 has been around for quite some time now; some people, like Frankieve, had even the time to buy and sell one.
Frankly it's difficult to believe that someone who is so interested into everything that bears the Roland logo didn't have the time to check one.
Maybe you did, were disappointed and are too proud or stubborn to admit it?

NO...never tried the G70,,Even did a 4 hour road trip last week hoping to play one[Ask AJ]..
Proud or disappointed...only when it comes to family or friends..
I really don't care if it's Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Gem, Ketron,....even if it was Siel...If I like it , I will use. If I don't, I won't..

The reason I support particular Roland boards is because of the quality construction, and features that work the best for me..
There is a long list of boards I did not like well enough to keep..including Roland[Fantom X as an example]...Doesn't mean the board isn't a great choice for someone else.
If I am dissatisfied with the G70 or E-80, or any board [even Yamaha]..I will voice my opinion, as I always have[in response]..

Yes, buying a G70 as a controller...I was kidding.

Have you noticed that every time there is a new keyboard introduced, one or more members leave the forum?.

Let's hope the keybord manufacturers don't release many top models at once, if they do, we will lose half the members.

Imagine Ketron SD2,
Yamaha PSR 3100 and Tyros 2.5,
Korg PA-100,
GEM Genesis 2

All released at the same time.... the Synthzone forums will be renamed "Empty rooms".

Come on guys.
Theodore

It makes my butt laugh the way nielshs and Wis go off on one everytime someone says they don't like a style, sound, style etc belonging to Roland.
How can I be a Roland hater when I have been using one Roland keyboard or another for the last 20+ years. I've had D50, G1000, VA76, Fantom and some others I can't remember.
I just don't think Roland have yet come up with an arranger that brings todays sounds and features like they did when the G1000 came out. The G1000 at it's time was simply the best out there, so it's about time Roland repeated it's success, but I don't think they will with the E80 and certainly not the G70. Only time will prove me wrong and if I like the E80 when I get to hear and play it in person I will definitely buy it. My money is ready and waiting for the right arranger to go with my T2 and G1000.

Geez, all I said was that I wasn't impressed by the demo's. I never said my sounds or keyboard were better, nor did I say the E80 is rubbish. It's just my opinion.

But, Are you seriously going to tell me the Timpani drums in that demo were acceptable?
What about the Brass samples?

I have owned 7 roland arrangers and only 1 yamaha. I have always wanted Roland to be the best because its the brand i grew up with. I too strongly believe the g1000 was Rolands last fantastic sounding keyboard. I think the reason is because at that time (was it 1998?) the competing keyboards from yamaha were not as good. But in the last 5 years yamaha has taken a giant leap ahead of the competition with its tyros and tyros 2. Roland on the otherhand seem to have taken a downward spiral and have not yet recovered from that. I know a shop not far from where i live that has been unable to sell the g70 they have on display for one year now .why? The same shop sold MANY g1000 and VA7 .. I see alot of people saying Roland recycle the same old sounds with each new arranger. Even the Korg Pa1x sounds amazing with its rx tecnology. Roland seriously needs to invent new technology for their sound engine and need improved marketing. Yamaha continues to remain the benchmark. These are my feelings....

Rolandfan,

Amen to that.

My first aranger keyboard was a Roland (after 25 years hiatus). It had superior voices, IMO, to an equivalent Yamaha. I would love for Roland to go head-to-head with Yamaha NOW and make it a tough decision for me to decide between them. We will soon find out.
E50/60 against a PSR3100.
Starkeeper

Some time ago someone here posted a link about the history of Roland. (sorry, I can't remember who posted it to give credits, but I think it was on Sound on Sound website? Something like that)

It had the (remarkable) history of the owner/founder, from the 50's until today. The interesting part, (when you take into account latest offers like G70 and E80 which were not welcomed with applause) was that in the past 5-6 years, the founder has had some health problems related with age and had withdrawn from the company's every day work.

The article mentioned that after that the company seemed to have entered a slumber of sorts, not releasing so many innovative "products per five year term" compared to other periods in its history.

On the other hand, I agree with Abacus, 128 Kbps is not the bitrate to choose when showcasing a new product. You need 192 at least. And maybe the arrangements were not the best.

Ah, I forgot....
Since when a company decides a product in a way that it is NOT easily accesible by potential byers?

Theodore

[This message has been edited by trident (edited 05-11-2006).]

There are Rolandlovers and Rolandhaters. Only a few good demo's are able to activate the Rolandhaters to come out of their holes and start them shouting how bad the E80 is.
The E80 is not even introduced yet.
OK boys go on with your shouting there is more to critisize, what do you think of the colour, the size of the keys, the touchdisplay and more.
Do not give up !!!!
I think the E80 is great and it will be a winner.

ummmm...... Actually i quite liked the demos. The instruments sounded as Neilsh said like a live band and not a CD demo as some other manufacturers keyboards sound. I happen to prefer the live sound which is why i went for the Pax. I thought that the brass an acoustic pianos sounded excellent. Drums were ok , but the timpani was poor but who uses the timpani in their arranger performances ????

I liked the sax too. Cant compare it to the T2 as they werent really demoing any single voice to its potential so the jury is still out. But guys, the G70 demo sounded very good too....remember ??? Thats why i was so very very dissappointed when i played the real instrument. I could not believe that it was the same board. I even thought that the one i played was faulty, you might remeber i suggested that in my first few posts when the controversy over the keyboard sound first blew up.

I hope that the E80 in reality sounds even at least as good as the demo's do because that would be a big improvement over the G70. Those that are loyal to the Roland brand will no doubt trade in the G70 and get the E80 if it sounds at least as good as these demo's. But i dont know what price they are going to get for the G70 as universally (even some of the members of the Roland forum) it has been panned .

AS for the weight....well i own the PAx and its true the weight is a worry. I am a relatively young man 37 and i dont have wheels on my case! the Pax is 48.5lbs so an extra 2 would not make that much difference. If i could have the same wattage in the speakers as the E80 i would not mind one bit !

I really want to like the E80 . I hope that when more demo's are put out showing the sound of individual instruments that it will have more favourable reviews.

PS Neilsh. Its only a keyboard, bits of plastic and wires. Dont get take it all so personally. If you like what you have purchased what differnce does it make what anyone else thinks ? Enjoty your board and make beautiful music !

It just is not possibly to judge a product from a web demo, so comments positive & negative are a waste of time.
Why bury a product before it's even available. Lets all wait until we can either play it or at least attend a live demonstration.

Graham,

I wasn't judging the product, I was judging the demo.

Al

There is some truth to that statement but I think demos give someone at least an idea of how the instrument will sound in real life. The demos are showcasing individual preset voices and styles and even though they are .mp3 demos at 128 bit rate etc., they will still let one know the proximity of how well or not so well the voices or styles are. So it would behoove Roland to make the demos in a way that proves to people its new E-80 arranger is a great sounding keyboard with very realistic voices. Judging from the demos I don't get that feeling at all. Others may feel differently than I do but reading all the posts in this thread tells me the majority of input from our members feel Roland hasn't come through in the sound department with the E-80. So at least from a demo standpoint Roland seems to have dropped the ball - again.

You can of course add SRX expansion cards to increase the sound palette and also the quality of sound and is Roland's way of getting you to buy their SRX expansion cards by putting in average sounding presets. And at a considerable cost to the consumer I might add. So you pay over $4,000 for the E-80 and you end up buying SRX expansion cards (there are over a dozen of them) at what, $300 or so each? They get you coming and going.

On a side note, Roland needs to come through with something completely new in the way of re-producing realistic instrument sounds with a new groundbreaking technology that will thrust them to the forefront of the music world and on the cutting edge of development. In my opinion they are being left in the dust except in all but a few areas like AC Grand Piano sounds, Organ sound reproduction, and Electric Piano sounds. The sad thing is I really thought the E-80 AC Grand Piano was rather anemic, although in one of the other demos the AC Grand they used sounded better.

Another show stopper for many is the excessive weight at 49.6 lbs.

Best regards,
Mike

Updated: on 05-13-06

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 05-13-2006).]

Oops, I see from further investigation that the E-80 has four speakers so that would be 35W x 2 for the main drivers and 12W x 2 for the Bass Reflex system.

Sorry my mistake. Actually it should sound pretty impressive with those specs. We shall see. Or rather hear.

Best regards,
Mike