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#167519 - 01/04/05 01:22 PM
Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 05/26/99
Posts: 9673
Loc: Levittown, Pa, USA
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I thought it would be interesting to post our feelings of the Arranger keyboards we each owned... This is my list with favorites first..
Roland G1000[what a surprise]..Durable,dependable,best get around board for live performance,lots of sliders and buttons.Great sounds,excellent read from zip for styles and SMF's..Best SMF playback..Very playable,best feeling keyboard of the bunch...
Roland VA-7..When I first bought the original VA new, I thought it sounded great, but some of the extra touches drove me a little crazy, I preferred the G1000 operation better..Later I bought a used VA-7 from a SZ member...this had a version 2 update..allowing many great updated features..It also had a great sound system and input jacks for a laptop..I was even able to get a decent mic/effects setting and save in a performnce..It actually recorded nicely..I sold it to make room for a G70...If I deside against the G70, I may replace with another Version 2 VA[maybe VA76 for better keys]..
Ketron X1..This keyboard was on the path to be the best...Great sounding voices and styles..good key feel..good speaker system..some quirks in the SMF playback,but had solutions to the problems..The hard drive folder limits made me crazy..especially searching while playing live..The G1000 was superior for performing live..
Ketron SD1,,this is a great board,but I could not get use to the all the same looking buttons...and it a semi dark room, it was a NO NO...Ketron is still capable of being the best...I don't know what the hold up is...If Roland re groups it may be too late for Ketron..
Roland EM2000..many of the G1000 features but had severe shortcuts compared to the G1000..It seemed to be built solid, but did not hold up compared to the G1000..
Roland E-600..A darkhorse keyboard...Great piano sound, good mic/harmonizer..Played sequences from floppy drive okay,but had quirks when using a laptop[99% okay]..
Roland G800,,I loved this board, it had a lot of great things , but the G1000 had all the good things plus the great things not available on the G800..
Roland G600,,a good 61 key board with the same great sounds of the G800, with a few goodies not found on the G800..but it didn't stand a chance next to a G1000..
Roland EXR-5, great board ,but novice oriented..Sounds are good but not Roland's best...
Yamaha PSR2100..lots of goodies for the dollar, but a poor feeling keyboard..many poor sounds..harmonizer was okay..SMF playback was embarassing too many times..
Casio MZ2000,,First impression was okay, but did not like overall..
Yamaha PSR2000,,Just did not like this board,,weak sounds,,2100 was much better..
Yamaha PSR 740,620, Korg IS5 and IS35...FORGETTABOUT them..
The views are my own opinionated revelations of hands on applications...and are not meant to offend you poor Yamaha and Korg lovers......just kidding..
Hey I forgot the Farfisa G-7,nothing great but a pretty neat all in one keyboard[simular to the PSR2100]...and that is where I am going to place the Farfisa..right under the 2100...
[This message has been edited by Fran Carango (edited 01-04-2005).]
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#167521 - 01/04/05 03:32 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
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I suppose my all-time favorite at this point would be Tyros. It's easy to operate, reliable, light in weight, has good sounds and versatile styles. The important buttons are lighted, and along with the huge display allows you to play in the dark. It accesses styles and songs from user memory, hard drive or floppy instantly. My second favorite would be the love/hate relationship I had with the Solton (Ketron) X1. If only the buttons had been in the right place. . . It had a great "live" sound. The weaknesses, besides the misplaced fill, variation, start and stop buttons, was the operating system was difficult to learn. There was zero dealer support in my area, and I worried about reliability, even though I had no problems with it. Two keyboards that were WAY ahead of their time was the Yamaha PSR8000 and the Technics KN2000. Either could still be used today, despite begin a little antiquated as to storage, speed and size of the styles (two variations). The 8000 was the first kb I had that let me eliminate the vocal harmonizer, outboard mixer, etc. I could still use it today and not be that handicapped. The Korg PA80 was another kb I both loved and hated. The size and weight was right. The sounds were wonderful. I liked in particular the harmonica and acoustic guitar. I liked the way the organ rotor was assigned to the Joystick. The styles were great except that there were virtually no CW styles, but the fills, intros and endings left a lot (everything maybe) to be desired. The midi playback was particularly strong, although I don't use much anyway. Also, the on-board vocal harmonizer was useless to me. There was only one pedal input besides the dedicated volume (or was it sustain?). I didn't like the OS on it either, but then it is easy to be spoiled by Yamaha's OS. Of all the others I've had, the Technics KN5000 was pretty good, and the Yamaha 2000 and 2100 were also good, although not in comparison to the Tyros. I'm looking forward to seeing the next offering from Ketron (if that ever happens). They seem to understand that some of us don't want to lug around 50+ pounds of kb. My least favorite was the Roland G800. I didn't like the heavy weighted keys. Made my fingers hurt. Physically, it kept breaking. The Joy stick spring broke after two weeks, the buttons began sticking after a couple of months. It weighed something short of a half-ton. The registrations wouldn't remember key transpose (at the time at least). The OS required going through many menus, and the display was smaller than the one on my wrist watch. It DID sound great though, and had some neat features like assigning two sounds to the right hand and setting the volume pedal to increase one and decrease the other as you pushed it down. It also had some interesting key-split options. I enjoyed using the Joystick when it worked. I think I prefer the joystick to wheels. The G800 was also had one of the first sequencers (as far as I know) to record directly in GM (or GS) format. The Technics had to be converted as did the earlier Yamahas. Wow, that was longer than I expected. DonM
_________________________
DonM
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#167527 - 01/04/05 06:51 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 12/04/99
Posts: 836
Loc: Lancaster UK
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What an excellent topic! Starting with fave first... Tyros, I am so glad I (eventually) took the plunge and bought the Ty. It really is my dream keyboard at the moment. I would prefer it to have a digital out and more modern storage facilities (like they put on the 3k) but apart from that I have not one complaint! 9000PRO, I kept this board longer than any other board I ever owned. I loved the keyfeel and the four sub outs. Playing it was wonderful and I half wish I had kept it alongside the Ty (but that would have been greedy!) KN6500, Enjoyed this board but it was to be my last technics board after years of technics ownership. (unless you count the KN7000 fiasco.... see below!) KN6000, I thought this was massive jump from the KN5000 at the time. I remember the sound system blowing me away in the shop and I just had to have it!!! Kept this board until the 6500 (above) came out and upgraded just for the sake of it really. Not a lot of difference between the two boards. Technics KN5000, One of my first 'real' boards. I felt like a million dollars when I bought this board. I had never spent as much on an instrument before and I adored it. Played one recently and was surprised how much I felt it had 'aged'. Roland EM 2000, stunning sound but I could not settle to it. I loved some of the styles, especially the accoustic piano stuff, but the menu system and OS in general was imho abysmal. I could not get used to it at all. Only kept the board about six months. Bought this after the KN5000 but went back to technics with the 6k after it went. Korg i40m, Like Scott says modules are just not practical. Trying to get at the buttons when playing was nightmare. I loved the VH feature on it though. Very simple to use. I hated the OS and the way of loading styles with a vengance. Even the roland was childsplay compared to Korgs way of doing things! It is the one thing that puts me off auditioning the PAx. Technics KN3000 Down at the bottom because it is so old now. I quite liked it at the time though. Technics KN1500 ditto I am not counting the casio's and 'toy' yammies I kept buying when arranger technology was in it's infancy (and for that matter so was I ) Best wishes Tony
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#167531 - 01/04/05 09:03 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Hmmmmm, yeah I'm gonna go with the Casio Rapman and the Casio SK-1. Those were some pretty heavy boards there Geez remember the SK-1 and how (expensive that little booger was for the time?) Squeak ------------------ Disclaimer: These are the opinions of Squeak_D, and offered voluntarily by said member of the SynthZone. If any member disagrees with any opinions posted by Squeak_D and chooses to post a reply, he or she waives their right to moan, complain, cuss out, or be disrespectful in any way shape or form. Basically if you ain't got something nice to say.., well you know the rest.
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#167532 - 01/04/05 10:11 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2195
Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
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I still have my PA80 an probably will for life ( it's life or mine ). I still like it's sounds and it's styles vs the other arrangers I've had or played. Tons of sound editing power vs most of the other offerings I've seen, which is a big plus for me. Great midfile playback machine as well. It's major weakness has already been mentioned, the fills on some styles are a terrible match to the main variations. Over time, I've managed to correct some of this on the styles I like to use, while adding and tweaking about 100 other brand styles ( mainly Yamaha and Roland styles ). The good news is that the factory styles can be modified and / or changed.
PSR2000: Liked the sounds and the OS quite a bit. Hated the key feel and didn't care for the blandness of some of the styles. Weaker in onboard sound editing than the PA80, but packed with enough good sounds to work with. I had a very bad experience with my first 2000. It's OS was as buggy as could be, and it resided longer in the repair shop than it did with me. My second one was flawless.
Casio MZ2000: Excellent sound editing capabilities. The sounds for my tastes ranged from excellent ( sax, organs, a few electric guitars, synths pads and leads ) to rather poor ( acoustic and electric pianos, acoustic guitras, woodwinds, bass sounds ). The styles sounded very thin compared to every other arranger I've tried. The sliders were cool and very useful. It's approach to midi ( it's own propietary format ) was poor, but the style creator was kinda cool.
PSR740: Key feel was again an issue. This board felt very cheap, not just the keys. The pitch wheel felt like a toy. The vocal harmonizer was poor. Still, it had some very good sounds and the styles were useable. I thought this was going to be a huge step up from the 530, and with 4 variations per style it was, yet in some aras, it really wasn't that much better.
PSR530: Bang for the buck. It'll always have a special place in my musical heart, but compared to today's arranger gear it's rather light on features and styles. Still, for the rather small amount of sample rom it had, it sounded pretty good. It was my first real new purchase ( PSR85 doesn't count ) since I purchased the Korg M1 ( now that was a real love / hate relationship) , and I liked many of the sounds on the 530 better than the M1. I'm kinda sorry I sold it. It was a cool board to take out into the backyard and just jam on.
A Technics late 80's model ( maybe a 920 ? I can't remember the model # ). Very crude by today's standards and even vs the 530. No pitch wheel. Still, for it's time some of the sounds weren't all that bad. The styles don't compare to today's stuff, but in it's day it ws kind of cool. Very light in the bells and whistles dept. I traded it for a small soundsystem. The guy I traded it to still has it.
PSR85- ( early 90's ? ) Supposed to be a stepup from the PSS and Casio toys of the 80's. Not even as good as the KN whatever it was... Poor styles, poor sounds, but my daughter liked it and she still has it.
PSS480. A K-Mart toy from the late 80s. I still have it, and my granddaughters enjoy it immensely. Terrible PWM sounds, very bad styles, mini keys, yet I kept it as a nostalgic piece ( kinda like the Casio sk-1 is to a lot of people, though my sk is long gone ). It had some crude synth editing capabilities, and well... that was all I needed to hook me.
I also had a few Casio toys in the 80s. I don't remember much about any of them.
I guess if I was ever considering a new arranger ( I'm not .. but who knows what the future holds ), based on what I've seen out there to this point, I'd probably pick the Tyros. Love the sounds and OS / layout. Key feel is fair ( at least a bit better than the PSR line )
AJ
[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 01-04-2005).]
_________________________
AJ
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#167533 - 01/04/05 10:26 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/01/02
Posts: 1790
Loc: Medina, OH, USA
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I've only owned Ketron boards, first the XD9 and now the SD1. Seems that you either love or hate the SD1... I happen to love mine. For me, sounds and styles are the most important items, with navigation coming next, for live playing. I've never heard a KB with better sounds and styles, especially drums. With 118 buttons, you'll hate this board if you want to take it out and play it right away, but once you learn where everything is (yes, it takes awhile) you wouldn't have it any other way... never go into a submenu, anything you want with the push of one button. As for as Ketron, when they come out with the SD2, of whatever they call it, they'll once agaon have a flagship AK that will incorporate most of what the Midjay offers, plus more. No inside info, just a 'seems inevitable' hunch. Hope I'm right. Glenn
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#167535 - 01/05/05 07:18 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Lets see if I can remember my old line up. May be out of order. Yamaha DX-7: Sound quality still beyond attempted modern reproductions of this classic synth. The DX just had a warm classic sound to her. OS was a complete bit** to operate. Keys were great, midi was decent. Korg Trinity: Sounds were so so. Synth wise, top notch voice editing. Acoustic sounds were good for the time. Build quality was solid, and the touch screen was ahead of the time. It was a little slow to respond though. Limited with 32 note poly. Looked lime something from Star Trek, Yamaha DJX (original): In my opinion Yamaha's greatest attempt at a budget dance keyboard. The patterns on that model were off the block. They were dead on! Real time control knobs, ribbon controller (assignable), basic sampler--although limited created great lo-fi samples, and you could edit them and set loop points. I was not happy to see they really limited this board in the recording department. Only 6 tracks, and no style recorder (which was a shame because the electronic drum kits were really good) PSR-540: Decent sound quality, terrible construction. Looked like a video game. I liked the large screen. Recording limited due to direct disk recording. Style recording limited due to lack of copy feature. Each variation had to be recorded over again. (I can only imagine how annoying this was with the PSR-740) Midi was good. Roland XP-60: Excellent board. No complaints about this unit.. Good sound, great features, built like a tank. Semi weighted keys, real time control, voice expansion. Still worth every penny today. Yamaha EX-7: (Motif 6 was based on this one). This was a good synth from Yammie. Good sounds. Synth sounds were awsome. Acoustic was alright. The piano was a little weak in the higher registers. VERY SLOW processor. Zip drive loading was a nightmare. Sampler was good, Contruction was solid, and the key feel was good as well. Sequencing was pretty good (had a great pattern sequencer). There were actually 3 sequencers. One 16 track linear, one 8 track pattern, and one 4 track arpegiater (I can never spell that word). Sequencing was limted due to several things. Even though the poly was 64 notes, it dropped drastically when recording because of the size of the samples. There were times I maxed the poly with just 4 tracks. The memory was also limited to 30,000 events. Casio MZ-2000: Sill kicking myself in the a** for dumping this board. Had to let her go due to space--small apartment + wife + MZ-2000 and other gear= bye bye MZ This board was a HUGE step for Casio. Sound guality varied. I think a lot of us were comparing it to the PSR-740 at the time. The MZ had extensive voice editing with 4 element voice structuring. You could even set velocity curves. Effects (in my opinion were way beyond the 740 because of the editing options). It also had aftertouch. The drawbars were great because there were 9 sliders to operate them with. Although no vocalizer it had a mic/line input with separate effects to that input. Styles were as usual subjective. However the style editing was beyond the PSR-740. It allowed up to 16 bar loops, and pattern copy. Plus you could mix patterns, and it also converted patterns Construction was good. That board was huge. It also had a great speaker system (15w) The MZ didn't get the attention it should have. Casio had for years retained the title of (The Toy Keyboard). The MZ sold for over $1,000 when it was released. I thnk it went for $1,200 and up. Casio owners and the public was not ready for this model. Casio should have marketed the board better. Casio WK-3500: Bluezplayer put it best when saying "it's a junior MZ-2000". That essentially is what it is. Same sound set (polished up a bit though with re-allocation of DSP settings). It has 76 keys, decent action, smart media and floppy disk storage. Drawbars, great speakers, both pitchbend and modulation, midi is alright, styles are again subjective, One feature sets it aside from others is the ability to load new samples into the board. I currently have a Steinway sample in memory and damn it sounds good. Limited in recording--6 tracks with basic editing, no style recorder (although new styles can be loaded, presets cannot be edited). Overall great bang for the buck. This is some of mine. I think I missed a couple of them. Squeak
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#167538 - 01/05/05 08:22 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Ahhh crap! sorry about that fellows That's what happens when you try to read a post, type a reply and deal with a 2 year old throwing Cheerios at your head at the same time. Squeak ------------------ Disclaimer: These are the opinions of Squeak_D, and offered voluntarily by said member of the SynthZone. If any member disagrees with any opinions posted by Squeak_D and chooses to post a reply, he or she waives their right to moan, complain, cuss out, or be disrespectful in any way shape or form. Basically if you ain't got something nice to say.., well you know the rest.
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#167542 - 01/05/05 10:39 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Senior Member
Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
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I misread the subject also. I thought it said favorites, so I didn't list nearly all the arrangers I've had. Let's see: PSR70, PSR6100, PSR6300 (I think), PSR500, PSR510, PSR620, PSR740, PSR8000, PSR9000, PSR2000, PSR2100, Tyros. Also: Technics KN800, KN1000, KN2000, KN5000 Korg PA80, Roland G800, Solton X1. Might have missed something but that's most of them. DonM
_________________________
DonM
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#167545 - 01/05/05 12:09 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 236
Loc: São Paulo, SP / Brazil
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I loved all keyboards (18) that I had (each one in its time and according my cash) My first keyboard was a Yamaha PSR-6300, almost twenty years ago. Today I´ve only a Tyros and it´s my preferred keyboard. It has great sounds, great styles, easy operation and IMO the best key response and the more realistic Grand Piano sound. Between these two I had spectacular keyboards, like 9000Pro, SD-1, VA-7, X1, KN-5000, KN-3000, Ra-800, E-86, and several PSR. Cheers. Armando [This message has been edited by SD_FAN (edited 01-05-2005).]
_________________________
Armando
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#167549 - 01/06/05 02:39 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 08/24/04
Posts: 666
Loc: City of Angels in the golden s...
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hmm.arrangers only?ok.
casio vl-1,some old mt series(80?) pss 170, psr 32,36(on board synth sliders want be a DX but,,)good sounds ,OK great for that time
roland e 20,15 and 16(great pianos-put yams to shame) E70 and 86(was the king for that time,hotter than I3),RA 90,g1000 (short time)and E96
yam qs300(not really an arranger),psr 510,550 korg I3,ix 300,Is 40,PA ** that's pretty much all for arranger since we can't talk about synths.
[This message has been edited by jamman (edited 01-06-2005).]
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#167550 - 01/06/05 07:02 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 51
Loc: Florida, USA
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Hello everyone!
Its been awhile since I posted so here it goes.
I'm new to arranger keyboards and have had the KN7000 for 14 months. Before that, its been organs from Wurlitzer, Conn, Gulbransen, Hammond (Aurora Classic), two Technics organs, and then the KN7000. Late summer, I picked up the PA50 and prefer some sounds/styles over the 7000 and vice versa. One local keyborad store here, in Orlando has the PA1X. What a sound! Just trying to figure out if I'll ever use everything it has to offer. At this point, I'm putting together sets (songs) and may hit the assisted living facilities in my area, or Sunday brunches for pin money. I need to ween myself from sheet music to get to the next level in playing but also find that the buttons on today's keyboards are sometimes more complicated than thoes black and white things!
Mark
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#167555 - 01/07/05 04:06 AM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 181
Loc: Holland
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This is a fun topic! My list is not as impressive as some of you posted, but here we go:
Technics KN-6000 (exp. to KN-6500): current keyboard. Acoustic piano’s and guitars not as good as on my previous Roland, but overall a better sounding instrument. Brass, saxes and flutes are very good. Good and very inspiring styles and lot’s of programming possibilities (I only use some of them). Midi file playing less user-friendly than Roland and needs lots of changing of settings to make midis sound acceptable. Impressive internal amplification and speakers!
Roland E-600 (hi Fran!): a lesser-known Roland arranger, but a very good one! Offered great value for money. Impressive stereo acoustic piano sample(s), guitars, vocals. Most of them perhaps better than of some keyboards currently on the market. Good midi file playing. Standard factory performance-memory settings poor, never used them.
Technics KN-1000: I think it represented a new generation of arranger keyboards. I had great fun with this one. In it’s time it was hard to beat and I can’t remember the competition offering anything better at the time.
Roland RA-90: not an arranger keyboard, but a module version of the Roland E-70. I used it connected to a Yamaha HS-6 electr. organ. Not easy to operate while playing, but at the time it was very good sounding with great styles.
Yamaha HS-6: ok, not an arranger but an electronic organ. I bought it together with my dad when I still lived with my parents. Had a lot of fun playing it. Played several organs that my father owned before that, but listing them would be really off-topic.
------------------ Tom NL
_________________________
Tom NL
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#167558 - 01/07/05 01:46 PM
Re: Recapping our Arranger keyboard lists
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Member
Registered: 06/09/01
Posts: 993
Loc: Belo Horizonte,Minas Gerais,Br...
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It seems that I have I music store... Voila: Korg:I3,I4s,I30 Technics:KN 800,1000,1500,3000,5000 Casio: MZ 2000 ( I cannot remember the old models) Roland:E20,30,70,66,86,96--Em1B(Brasil)Em5B(Brasil),Alpha1 (Brasil),Em2000,G800,G1000, VA7 Yamaha: Electones:Bk4,B75n,D80,FX20,FX30,HX1. Arranjers:Psr6100,6300,70,90,410,6700,5700,510,730,8000,740,B50(Brasil)9000,9000Pro,290,K1,295,3000. The small models I owned in my Music School. My Top five list: -Roland E 70 -Roland G 1000 -Psr B50 (Yamaha Brasil) -Psr 9000 Pro -Psr 3000 My best bang for buck : Psr3000 Chico
[This message has been edited by ChicoBrasil (edited 01-07-2005).]
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