I always like to hear what other arranger users come up with in the way of features that don't yet exist, but you would LIKE to see added to your arranger's OS.

So, nothing that already exists on any arranger... What's something new, something groundbreaking you WOULD like to see...?

I would like to see separate, physical volume controls for splits and layers. There's nothing worse than having to search thru screens to find faders. Put them in a row with the master volume. I may have seen something similar on a keyboard or two, but nothing consistent. That would help me a lot.

Basically, the more dedicated (even a/b) buttons, knobs and faders that eliminate screen pages would be helpful. Minimize numeric pads in favor of alpha dials.

I would like a mic volume control on the panel.

funny, my old korg is35 has both of those features above..
on a ca. 1999 keyboard..

I want a module based on the PA800 or Tyros 2 or G-70.
Jerry

Isn't there a G70M? And the G70 has a mic volume control knob.

And I'd like the bottom manual of the Hammond XK3 (is that right?)to have an arranger. Then maybe I'd buy one.

[This message has been edited by cassp (edited 07-13-2007).]

Cassp . . . I slightly echo keysvocalssax's comment above. Grab a used i30 - sliders for Drums, Perc, Bass, three accomp tracks, lower kbd, first and secondary lead voices, plus master volume slider immediately to their left. Plus a mute/play button at the bottom of each slider. That's true on-the-fly mixing.

The WERSI OAS arrangers have what you are wanting and more. Multiple Volume sliders can be programmed for sounds, layers, splits, styles, style parts, real drums, etc. There are also two dedicated mic volume controls on the front panel.

Built-in wireless midi and audio.

A light weight, state-of-the-art, detachable, 6hr battery pack (maybe 1" thin and covering the entire bottom of the keyboard).

A 61-note keybed expandable to 76 or 88 keys with a snap-on module. Key feel, from synth action to weighted, could be dialed in from the front panel.

24 sliders, 36 buttons, 10 knobs, 1 touch screen, and 3 rotary dials, ALL PROGRAMMABLE, so that the entire control surface/user interface could be customized to the users own preference. Each control would have a small (but legible) lcd display beneath it describing it's current function.

OS that would instantly recognize (and correctly play) any style or soundset from any manufacturer.

Songbook feature that would include and automatically supply the chords for the harmonist (in the correct places in the song, of course).

Instant keyboard disable mode so that you could pretend to play without arousing suspicion while the midi file was playing.

1-button instant solo generator that would respond to the left-hand chords. This would automatically mute the right side of the keyboard so that you could pretend to play the generated solo.

State-of-the-art pitch correction for the crooners among you (you know who you are).

Entire unit would snap apart into two sections, each weighing less than 20 pounds.

Although manufactured in China by an anonomous international conglomorate (except for keybed, made in italy), unit would come with interchangeable corporate logos of the big three (4?) to be decided by user.

Price would be under $1000.

chas

Whoops, forgot the chord sequencer.

chas

I would love to see the added capability of adding more then one voice selection to left hand part so that you could if you chose to, layer left hand voices, just like it is possible with right hand voices.

my thoughts

The WERSI OAS arrangers have multiple right hand voice layers (four), multiple left hand voice layers (three), and even the optional pedal board allows two voices to be layered from the OAS system. That's quite a lot of layers and makes for a rather large sound should you decide to layer that heavily.

[This message has been edited by Ensnareyou (edited 07-14-2007).]

Roland also 3 to the left and 3 to the right..also 6 across the whole ..

I'd like to see wav/mp3/midi integration and other Midjay features. Think it's coming.

Glenn

Actually i dont really need new features for the arranger keyboards of today as a very large percentage of them i would guess are very nearly unused before a next instrument is purchased judgeing from the movement of instruments on this board. But what i would really ove he manaufacturers do is provide say a 5 disk dvd set that shows the features of the instrument from a musicians point of view. This probably wont ever happen because actually learning all the functions on your instrument would prevent us from buying the next "new thing " that has 80% of the features that we had on the last "old thing " that we did not use then and probably wont use now !

For me , definately the only thing i would need from the manufacturer is s series of instructional DVD's.

My future requirements for Yamaha PSR Arranger keyboards are:

1.All sweet,cool,live and mega voices to be replaced by SA voices.
2.MP3 player with atleast 64 MB internal storage.
3.USB Wav recorder cum player.
4.LiveDrums
5.Master compressor
6.Dual microphone inputs with individual volume controls.
7.Registration buttons to be increased from 8 to 10.
8.Adjustable LCD display.
9.Arabic/indian styles and instruments to be included.
10.sponge feel key action.

SUNNY.

KARMA on the OASYS and M3 is light years beyond the abilities of any Arrange Keyboard. But it's implementation is not suitable for live arranger users methods of control.

I would like to see this technology developed so that it could be controlled to change in a grid format like Arranger keyboard currently do.

All that would be left to do at this stage would be to create GE's suitable for the Arranger market as the currently range of GE's are more suited for Dance Music.

Why KARMA ?.
Because it' generates the note data in real time. It does not use patterns. Because of this, you have an almost unlimited supply of configurations for creating a Style.

Regards.
James.

Me too James. Been thinking and talking about that one for a while myself, pretty much since the inception of the original Karma, but I'm not sure how much interest there would be in it.

AJ

OK, I'm reading a LOT of posts from people asking for features that already exist. Maybe on higher level arrangers than they own, but most of this is stuff that exists...

I really liked chas's suggestion for completely reconfigurable front panels. If you don't like the layout, change it! I'm not sure that the LEDs would really be necessary (and they would add a lot to the cost) because, if YOU went to the trouble of reconfiguring the front panel, you would probably remember exactly what you had done, but it is a great idea... And, it is ALL software. So easy enough for some manufacturer to implement. Probably every last one of us has sat and scratched our heads and gone 'why on earth did they put THAT button THERE? That's stupid...!" This would at least solve that problem. Nice one, chas...

OK... here are a couple of mine...

I LOVE the 'half time' button on Steinberg's Groove Agent drum software. One press, and whatever pattern you are playing gets a half time treatment. This is NOT just slowing the tempo down to 1/2 speed (for those of you that don't know what a 'half time' change is), but basically, the hi-hats or ride and probably percussion stay the same, but the kick and snare elements go to half time. It's a common trick for drummers and bass players, but I've never seen it on an arranger.

And I would still like to see the fills increased to one per transition. In other words, a completely different fill for each and every transition, AND a rotating fill-to-same. In other words, when you fill back to the same place, there are at least two fills that alternate. Getting away from the repetition of arrangers would be a lot easier, and I believe that style creation would be easier if you didn't have the problem of designing fills that transition smoothly to multiple destinations. IMO, that's one of the hardest things to do well on a style.

But anyway, keep them coming... Ideas that don't exist on ANY arranger, yet.

Who knows, maybe someone is reading this at an arranger manufacturer's R&D department...!

Yes, yes yes. And yes again!!!

Every upper level arranger should have a database and systems manager that is either USB PC/Mac based or video linked to a monitor.

Roland or someone else needs to reissue a ProE feature-packed 37 note arranger keyboard.

The Wersi OAS and Lionstracs Mediastation both support WAV/MP3/MP4/MIDI/Video and much more.

It appears most of the features people are referring to, the Wersi and Lionstracs already have! Perhaps one should pony up more money and buy one of these instruments instead of the usual suspects (Yamaha, Korg, Roland).

The Wersi OAS 7 even has Open Art Arranger software which allows direct playback of Yamaha style files with no conversion. The Wersi also includes the Tyros II sound set so you can sound exactly like a Tyros II if you want. I'm not really sure why you'd want to sound like a Tyros if you own a Wersi, the Wersi sounds are far superior in my opinion, but they are there if you want them. I believe the Mediastation also has a Tyros II sound set as well.

The other advantage of these instruments is the ability to load nearly any sample you want (AKAI, GIGA, Kontakt, etc.) as well as nearly any Plug In or VST you want to use. The sound possibilities are nearly infinite.

The future of what arrangers will be has been around for quite some time... The Wersi OAS has been around since 1999/2000. In time all new keyboards and arrangers will be open ended, it's called progress. No matter how hard Yamaha, Korg, and Roland try to keep selling embedded systems, eventually they'll have to follow Wersi and Lionstracs lead and change to open architecture. Korg's Oasys was a good start but Korg could learn a lot from Wersi.

Why doesn't Wersi (and Mediastation) include the soundsets from Roland and Korg's high end arrangers....if you're gonna copy soundsets why not include all those other great sounds?

Ian



[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 07-15-2007).]

I think we are getting a bit carried away here with the Tyros 2 sounds.
1. Yes the Mediastation now has available sampled sounds of the Tyros 2
2. No the Wersi Does not have the Tyros 2 sound set
The Tyros 2 (Like a lot of TOTL Yamahas) has Megavoices in its styles which are special recorded samples, (They cannot be replaced with normal samples in any format (This is why a lot of Tyros 2 styles don’t convert correctly) and what Wersi has done, is written its own software to emulate exactly how the Yamaha system works (As it is their own software code, they have therefore not infringed any of Yamahas Intellectual Property) including the Megavoices.
POINT TO NOTE in all their sales literature when Yamaha is mentioned, there is always an asterix (Or other indication) after the name, which if you go to the bottom of the page always acknowledges that Yamaha is the Trademark of the Yamaha Corporation. (The same applies when VST and Akai is mentioned in the sales literature)
I hope this clarifies matters regarding the Direct Play of Yamaha Styles.
As to Direct Play of other manufactures styles, it takes a great deal of time and effort for the development team to write the software to emulate another instrument, and so while they may be added in the future, it will take time.

Bill

The lines become more blurred......

[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 07-16-2007).]

Cass, you already have the mixer sliders to all the parts [song and arranger as well as realtime parts...they are on your G70..

Like how to be successful in the marketplace? Like how to have a nonexistent dealer network? Like how to release upgrades that have problems?

I don't think that any of the big three are going to worry about open system keyboards at all, unless one of them actually DOES turn out to be commercially successful. Wersi are hobbled by VERY high prices, and a very sparse dealer network (in the US, anyway), and the MS...

Remember, the learning curve on an 'open' keyboard, especially the MS is fierce. Given that apparently, most of the features (according to SOME) of even an embedded system get seldom used, where is the market for these expensive (some can even say overpriced) highly technical arrangers?

Most of us, I would be prepared to say, like our arrangers because we can turn them on and make music. We don't have to worry about Linux 'wrappers', Vsti compatibility problems, and configuring an 'open' system. If you are a geek, they sound perfect... If you want to just make music with the minimum of fuss...

It's going to take something to take off commercially before Yamaha etc. are going to change from a proven, viable system. Until 'open' systems are as turnkey and idiot-proof as closed systems (and by doing so, they basically turn into closed systems), few are going to want the hassle.

What's the most talked about feature on MS's (and even, to a lesser extent, Wersi)? Their ability to play Yamaha styles, without translation. Not exactly the groundbreaking, innovative stuff we've been told is these keyboard's strengths!

If you want something that plays Yamaha styles and sounds, get a Yamaha! Save a chunk of money, and run the VSTi's off a laptop... MUCH less expensive than a Wersi or an MS...

Eventually? Maybe yes, but unless the big 3 go down that route, don't expect any 'open' system to be affordable, OR easy to operate. That's what the big 3 specialize in, and unless they take up the challenge, I predict that 'open' system arrangers will remain niche products for a niche market.

yeah, I only find them every seventh time I search. Too many screens; I want sliders.

I have been familiar with Wersi (On and off) for a good number of years, (As well as other manufactures boards) and I don’t know of any that you don’t just switch on and play.
In the 90s they went very Japanese by giving minimal real time control and multiple screens, but with the release of the OAS system they went back to there roots and produced keyboards that excelled at Real Time Live Play, with no need to access any other screen other than the Main Screen when playing a song. (Remember Wersi has been making Organs and Keyboards for well over 35 years, and they have been used by Artists in venues from small room’s right up to massive Stadiums, all over the world)
Enjoy whatever you play

Bill

Let's see... nine sliders on a G70 for all realtime part volumes, plus another eight for style volumes, plus sixteen for song volumes... Now, do you want reverb controls, too, and pan and chorus...? Best of luck finding the right fader in that maze...!

I LIKE the G70 system very much... Just enough sliders for controlling each section's needs, and four page buttons for choosing volume, pan chorus or reverb. You just have to learn which color (they are colored like Hammond drawbars) you need, and I never have a problem getting to the right one...

BTW, there is NO G70M, never will be, in all likelihood.