I've been setting up the Roland G70 with the Bose L1 and ran into a SERIOUS phase cancellation problem.
When I run left and right outputs to two inputs on the Bose, both high and low-end cancellation occurs, bigtime.
This was not a problem on the Tyros 2.
However, when I run from the L/R combo output from the G70 into one channel on the Bose, it sounds terrific. with no loss of anything. Organ still turns, the effects seem to work fine.
So maybe it isn't a problem, since I only have to use one cable and now have 3 channels available on the Bose.
Tonight is the first test under fire. Cross your fingers for me!
The T2 is on its way to Tony Rome's house.
DonM

Good luck Don....try to record something for us....keep us posted !!

Rock the joint amigo!

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

Good luck Don!

[This message has been edited by cassp (edited 10-24-2006).]

Sounds like a non-problem to me. Even an advantage...plus now you have a spare cord.
Eddie

Don,

It sounds like you are good to go, with an extra cord for backup. I'll bet that there are many of us who would like your opinion and comparison of the G70 to the other boards.

Tom

[This message has been edited by Tom Cavanaugh (edited 10-24-2006).]

It sounds to me like the Bose has some kind of internal phase problem. I can assure you that with a normal PA, there is no difference between sending a mono signal from the G70 to the PA and sending stereo and panning to mono with the mixer.

Would anyone with a Bose L1 system care to check for mono/stereo phase compatibility? I'm sure many would be interested in the result......

Diki,

I never experienced phase cancellation using the PSR-3000, Don didn't have a problem using the Tyros2, and there are lots of performers using the Tyros that have not experienced any problems at all. To my way of thinking, it likely has something to do with the way the output is processed by the G-70--not the Bose L1.

Cheers,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

I thought I remember seeing posts by you that it took some experimenting to find a GM mono piano voice that was good enough to your ears to use after doctoring that sound and that you couldn't use the stereo phased Grand Piano sound. Or did I dream that

BTW, I still look forward to trying out the Tyros 2 with the L1 and sub when I get the chance. There are a couple in town. I am hoping it is as good as I think it will be.

One of my biggest grips with all keyboards is the grand piano sound. Wile I consider the ones Yamaha uses as default, they just never seemed full enough for my personal taste. That's why I went to work and created my own grand piano voice using the PSR-3000's onboard software. It has been downloaded several thousand times by a lot of other folks, and many now use it as their default piano voice. I never had a problem with phase cancellation--I just wanted a better piano sound, thus the post you read several months ago.

Cheers,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

Well, the first night with the G70 was acceptable. At first, the headwaiter told me there wasn't enough low-end, so I cranked it up.
Then it met with his approval.
Later on a regular came in and sort of did a double-take and began listening intently. After the song (Honky-tonk Women) he came up and told me he loved the new sound, and that the drums and bass sounded fuller and more live than usual. He didn't have any reason to know I was playing something different except he was used my T2 sound.
I couldn't record anything because I broke my Creative Labs Jukebox 3 recorder. The hardware on the input pushed inside the recorder so I couldn't plug it in.
I do have another one just like it, so I'll try again next time.
DonM

Don ... read this too late to wish you luck, but I KNEW your talent would rise to the occasion ....
t.

Thanx Don.....but what did you personaly think?

I,too, am very curious on your night with the G70....You can read all you want about keyboards which is better, which is bigger, etc.etc... But when a seasoned musician works it at a gig, they have first hand experience

Ron

Well, I liked it better than I expected. I have to adjust the amount of reverb on some of the sounds, particularly Grand X Piano. I was at Hank's today and played his other G70, and his lead sounds were much cleaner, not drowned in reverb as much as some of mine.
I miss some of the operational functions of the Tyros 2, expecially the multipads and Break/fill.
Overall, if I didn't have to move it so much, I could use it just fine.
As I get more comfortable with it, I'll let you know more.
DonM

I was wrong about the phase cancellation. Evidently when I hooked it up with cables from the left out and right out into two channels on the Bose, I was using stereo cables (balanced) and that was causing the problem. I had a mixer in between, and somewhere along the line signals were getting duplicated.
Tonight I hooked up two unbalanced cables into two channels on the Bose and heard nothing but good stuff coming out.
Sure wish this G70 thing didn't weigh so much. There's a lot to like about it.
DonM

Don,

I had the opportunity to look at the DVD of the Shreveport Jam and realized why the G-70 seems so heavy to you--you got older! Your hair has changed a bit more toward white since I saw you last. I have the same problem, but every few weeks I have a serious conversation with Miss Clairol and the little hair I have left goes back to medium brown (gotta look good for those older gals). Believe it or not, you're not alone in this aspect of getting older. My Bose seems to have gained weight since last year. That 32-pound base unit felt more like 52 pounds when I lifted it on the Rock "N" Roller yesterday. Guess we both need to go back on the exercise programs and shed a few pounds.

Good luck, and I'm glad the problems have all been solved with the keyboard,

Gary

Gary, the G70 is WAY heavier than the L1, and it's also very big. It won't fit on the stand I like to use, so have to use an x-stand.
I've sure gotten a lot of compliments on the way the G70 sounds though.
I'm losing weight again, but I have earned the grey hair. Didn't bother Kenny Rogers. I don't care about the old ladies, and Clairol won't fool the young ones!
DonM

Don , have you tried the guitar mode on the job..If so, what do you think?

Also, did you get use to the fill options?

Inquiring Roland minds, want to know..

I haven't tried the guitar mode on the job. It seems like more trouble than it's worth.
I still don't care for the endings option, but yes I've gotten used to using them. The footpedal helps, when I take it, which I usually don't.
I do miss the Break/fill and the multipads.
I like to use the multipad for drum sounds at the end of songs. Not essential though.
DonM

Don..... Break/Mute can be assigned to one of the Assign Switches, or now, in OS3 (fanfare please......) it can be assigned to the FC-7 or Footswitch. Huzzah!

This is incredibly responsive of Roland, as, to be honest, I never read of anyone other than me who requested this upgrade (at least at the Danish G70 site, the main one for our arranger AFAIK). In fact, this makes it three features that have been added with myself as the sole asker..... Pretty good, huh?

Perhaps if there is something that you think could be improved with software alone, post it at the Danish site. Who knows, you could get your very own OS upgrade feature...!!

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 11-09-2006).]

The older gals are lots of fun to be around, and I've been able to fool some of the younger gals while performing in a dark room!

Cheers,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

Diki, Thanks for the help, but I had already tried assigning the break/mute, not only to the pedalboard but to the Fade In button. They work fine, but what it does is simply stop everything, and it's not very musical. The way Yamaha does it is insert a bass drum-cymbal, or something similar at the stop, then maybe a little lead back in after the break. They are not all the same, and depend on the style. I guess it's not exactly a break-mute as much as a break/fill, but that's mostly semantics.
My work-around as been simply to stop the arranger and drums with the stop switch and bring it back in with syncro-start. It's easier to do on the G70 than on Yam., because the sync-start stays on until you turn it off. The Yam. syncro-start goes off after the arranger starts. That's useful in some other ways, but not in this instance.
I am more and more overwhelmed with the LIVE sound of the G70. HankB and I listened to recordings today that I made on last night's job and it seemed as if we were listening to a very good four or five-piece band.
DonM

send me a few songs don

DonM..... if you hit the Break/Mute, then DURING the break you hit a fill button, you get your 'pickup' into the next bar you want, with the advantage that YOU choose when it happens, not preprogrammed into the break, and if you DO want a whole bar of silence, no problem!

The only disadvantage is that, instead of it being just a drum pickup, the whole band comes in on the pickup......

I have a thread at the Danish site, on the New Functionality forum, asking Roland to change to a 'drums only' on a fill DURING a Break/Mute, which would make it perfect..... Add your name to the idea, and maybe Roland will see the light....

It's not as good as the Yamaha Break/Fill concept, but YOU are a bit more in control (for instance, YOU get to choose which fill is the 'pickup', so more variety), so for me it's a pick(up!).

That's my take on the G70 'sound' since I first heard it. Less polished and CD-like than the Yamahas, MUCH closer to a real live band. In fact I tend to not use the mastering compressor at all.... I'm trying to sound MORE live, not less!

I feel they are paying me to be a substitute band, NOT a substitute DJ......

BTW, DonM, here's the link to the request to Roland;
http://www.selskabsmusikeren.dk/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=60&topic=965.0

Its a shame most out there dont know the difference

Diki, I'll check it out. Thanks.
Dnj, you are right, but WE know the difference at least!
BTW,
I had a close call today. Got to Jonesboro, LA to do a Nursing Home show with Dean and Semilive. I set everything up and as I turned on the keyboard volume got a loud buzzing. I was using a mixer between the G70 and the Bose. I checked all connections, everything o.k., still buzzing.
I changed all cables, no help. I tried a mic in the mixer, no problem there, so the problem with the G70. I tried bypassing the mixer, same buzz. I tried using the headphone outs, still buzzing.
I tried the mic output, and no buzz, so I decided to try the aux output on the G70. By this time it was time to start the show and still no sound. I was searching for the menu to assign sounds to the alternate outs and I happened to think of one more thing. I had plugged the laptop into the aux inputs of the G70. I unplugged that and the buzzing stopped. It was a bad cable from the laptop to the G70. That explained why the mic outs and, I'm sure, the aux outs were o.k., because the aux ins were assigned to them. Also why the headphone outs wouldn't work because the aux ins ARE assigned to it.
Anyway the entire problem was Donny Pesces' fault because he lost the volume knob to the aux ins, and I always have it open!! I never thought it was a problem, so didn't bother to get another knob yet. I will Monday!!
Just joshing Donny!
After that the show was great. Dean on fiddle, Bill playing rhythm guitar and singing. We had a ball, as did the residents. We do this show once a year and it generally is outside on a flatbed trailer, but last night we had a little cold snap go through and they were afraid it was too cool for the residents outside, so we had to do it inside. Played on hour, ate lunch and played another hour.
Fun, fun, fun, since I found the problem.
We had two backups in place. Dean had his Ensoniq keyboard in his van and we could have used it with sequences, and I always have the laptop, but it was much better that we were able to do it as planned.
DonM

Hi Don.....I love to hear when Entertainers have a good time giggin...glad you got your problem fixed in time, process of eliminations works most times...would love to see a video of your show.

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-11-2006).]

Don,

Laptop humm often comes from their lousy power supplies, a problem that is easily solved by installing a three prong to two-prong adapter to the laptop's AC power supply plug. It works for me!

Good Luck,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

This wasn't hum, it was a loud buzz like from a dead short. Nothing could be heard but the buzz.
It was the mini-plug to stereo RCA cable I had connected to play break music from the laptop to the keyboard. When I replaced the cable all was good.
Thanks,
DonM