My KN7000 will someday need to be replaced, as you all know. I have decided to execute a preemptive strike and go to software. I have ordered the Muse Receptor http://www.museresearch.com/ .

After reading threads from Frank L, TAPAS,AJ, Rikki, and others, I think I am aware of the many problems with this approach. Nonetheless, in the meantime my arranger is alive and well.

Until such time the developers start making applications more suitable for the performing musican, I will endeavor to learn this approach, as many of you think this is the way of the future.

I am not up to speed on many basics of MIDI manipulation of modules, and would ask you good people for some help.

My Receptor is coming with a 160 gig hd, and 1.5 gig of RAM and can handle many major VST's like Colossus,Ivory,Garriton, etc.

Eventhough heavy, my arranger has extensive(i think), MIDI implementation . I can use Kontact maybe and achieve the ability to change banks and patches to use with my KB ?, or should I use a dedicated controller too. CME maybe ?

MIDI playback should be superior if I load a GM soundset. Maybe Garriton Bandstand ?

Superior lead instruments. Colossus ?

The bottom line is I will have to get through a large learning curve and put up with some drawbacks, but I need to know what VST's I would need to be somewhat compatible with an arranger style of playing, and sometimes playing over MIDI's in a performance setting.

As most of you know, Frank L is recuperating from his hip surgery, and he offered to help me later.

Thank you in advance for any help you can give me.

Bernie

Bernie, I am happy to see you move towards a software based arranger system....you will never look back. You will be very surprised at the very high quality of the sound and flexibility of such a system. Yes there are drawbacks....large learning curve....control surface not as good. This is all outweighted by the high quality sound, especially the emulation of acoustic instruments. No hardware based system comes anywhere close to these sounds. Talk about super articulation voices (SAV)....well I have used such voices for years....it is called keyswitching in my software world, e.g., keyswitching from growl to breathy sax, up bow down bow violin and so on.

There will be times where you will through up your hands and say why did I do this but if you stay with it you will be rewarded big time.

Thanks Frank
I guess the first question is the necessary software to start off with.

Hi Bernie
The KN7000 Midi spec will never be as good as a dedicated Midi controller, but if it does what you want, then it will save you money by not having to buy a separate controller. (You can always get one later if need be)
The learning curve will not be quite as bad as a full computer based system, as you will not need to worry about the computer side of things, as the Receptor acts just like a hardware expander, but you are not tied to the instruments the manufacture gives you. (If the facility is available I would get a larger screen to use with it, as it will make life a lot easier)
BTW I started off using hardware instruments (Mainly Organs) and then moved on to a computer software based system, the flexibility being brilliant, but the amount of wires and setup can be rather trying.
A few years ago I moved over to a Wersi Abacus, (A normal looking Arranger Keyboard, but controlling an internal Windows computer, so you don’t notice its there) which has allowed me to have all the advantages of a Computer based system, with the ease of use of an Arranger Keyboard, and I can say without any doubt, that there is NO WAY I would ever go back to either a pure Hardware or Computer based system.
A tip I can give you however is that if you cant seem to get it to do what you want, don’t stick at it, but have a break from it, (Make a Cuppa, Have a beer or whatever) and when you come back you usually find you can sort out the problem relatively easily.
Hope this helps.

Bill

Thank you Frank and Bill for your encouraging replies. Does anyone know about the Kontact format ? What should I get first ?

Bernie

Hey Frank, How are you doing?

Are you getting around already?

Hope everything is alright..


Speaking of soft arranger..I recently started to use the Roland DisCover5 on the job[a non arranger keyboard, but a great sequence playback unit with the best harmonizer I ever used]..
Yesterday I set up control keys to use OMB7[arranger software].
I am using Hyper Canvas for the soft synth..
It looks like I can get by with this set up...
I also have Jammer Live ready if I need it..

Fran, I am still on a cane but getting around. The good news is there is a whole lot less pain. It is the first break in pain during the last 3 years. It will be nice once I can again resume normal activities after about 3 months.

It looks like Fran is getting closer and closer to a software based system. Who would have thought?

Bernie Kontakt is considered by many to be the top of the line sampler. There are some issues with it but NI is hard at work to resolve them. There are other good samplers as well, GigaStudio, etc. So it is a matter of checking out the various samplers and how you may wish to use them. I use two:

Kontakt for lead or melody voices
Bandstand for my auto accompaniment

If you can go with a little lower quality of sound then you could use one sampler for both lead and auto accompaniment. I say this since for auto accompaniment you need a sampler which quickly loads instruments but at the expense of slightly lower quality of sound. It needs to quickly respond to program and effect changes.

[This message has been edited by Frank L. Rosenthal (edited 03-06-2006).]

Bernie,
in my opinion (amateur at home playing for myself), Hypercanvas provides a very quick and acceptable solution to GM/GS/midi file player/simple accompaniment needs. Driven by my own keyboard's styles, the sounds it provides have "freshened" my sound palette.

Its sound quality is inferior to more modern approaches, (on the other hand it has a more "dirty" sound and that may be of benefit sometimes) but I find that it is very quick to understand and tweak, and the interface is (again IMHO) flawless.

Along the same lines, HQ Orchestral is a very good solution foe orchestral pieces with very good orchestra instruments and Superquartet casrries a good selection of everyday Piano, Guitar, Bass and Drums voices (some with velocity-triggered affects such as slides etc) with better quality than Hypercanvas provides.

Drum and Bass Rig has a fair selection of basses and drum sets, quality easily surpassing everything Hypercanvas has to offer, but they are WAY more demanding on the CPU.
(Two instances of hypercanvas play at 15-20% on my CPU, add Drum & Bass rig and skyrocket to 60%, just substituting the bassline and the drum channel.)

Key Rig has a selection of piano sounds, (adequate IMHO), a simple? (never tried to operate it) synth, a Hammond module and a GM module which sounds crisper than Hypercanvas but IMHO lacks the "integrity" of the Hypercanvas. (Hypercanvas sounds tend to complement each other in a mix, they seem like a "collection" of sounds rather than a "bunch" of sounds thrown together. But it is good.

Bandstand is supposedly superb, carries very big samples but...... it doesn't sound like it to me, either by headphones or with speakers. (Others here share the same opinion).
Also, it responds to GM program changes, but it takes A LOT of time to change. A simple change of style in my setup, takes maybe 20 seconds to completely change all the instruments in bandstand, and since you probably will play it live, it won't do, I think. Faster (more dedicated) setups will give you faster responses but not "point and click" fast. Some loading will be required.

Luxonic Ravity is a synth module with very good capabilities which exceed my knowledge of synths by 95%. It has a good selection of basses and synth leads and other synth sounds that sound very good to me, but is probably geared towards modern music (house, techno etc).

The B4 Hammond demo I have heard and played sounds very good, but for me to even attempt criticizing that sound would be immoral, since I havent even seen a live B3, let alone play one. Others here know better of the real thing and the softsynth also.

Of the others, Kontakt and the more expensive sound libraries like Garritan and such, I know nothing.
Hope it helps somehow.
Please share with us what you find about the Receptor.
Theodore

PS if you manage to take advantage of the style buttons, variation buttons etc on your arranger it will be a godsend. you just continue playing in a platform you know and take advantage of the better sounds where available.

NI, realize the issues with respect to loading times, etc. with Bandstand and will provide a fix in the future. When ... who knows. I happen to like the sounds of Bandstand but for me I would like to have some continuity with Kontakt and Bandstand. It would be nice to beable to use instruments from kontakt in Bandstand. NI will take a look at this. In addition, Bandstand may beable to load other GM/GS/XG wavetables in the future. Some fairly good wavetables include SGM180, Papel 2006, etc.

So in closing I hold out hope for a very good quality system from NI. I think they got caught in rapid grow of new products and can't keep up with the required fixes and customer service.

As I have said many times the feeling is amazing to set down and play a great jazz piece with a Bardstown/Steinway Piano, Scarbee Bass, Bardstown Jazz Guitar and dirty keyswitched Sax (VRSound, VSL, etc., Colossus Drums and so on. Oh does this sound so good!!!

By the way, Colossus is a very good GM wavetable plus many other high quality lead voices. Not fast enough to load for midi or style files in a live situation. It may be fast enough to use in a coffee shop, book store or high class night spot jazz session. It just depends on your application.

If you stay with it and use your imagination you will always and I mean always find a better sounding system when compared with any workstation or arranger keyboard.

Thank you, Theodore, for the most enlightening responce. I was hoping more from Bandstand. There is some freeware bundled with Receptor, and will get my feet wet there first. I am hoping for faster changes if I preload multies in RAM. Also, there is a 30 day trial period on the prestige plug-ins.

Frank mentioned a compromise on quality for style sounds, and better quality for lead. I am sure he is right. At any rate the fun shall begin Thursday, and will report my findings as I go along.

Thanks for you help
Bernie