I have been reading synthzone posts for a long time and have decided to finally get more involved. Usually whatever question I have has already been asked by someone else and I am able get all the info I need just lurking in the shadows.

I have recently become interested in softsynths or virtual instruments in a quest for the highest quality sounds available. Since many of you have already tested a number of the current products perhaps you can offer some recommendations and advice.

I need these for live performance so the times required for loading is a factor. If one uses a very fast processor and lots of memory can this “Loading time” issue be allieviated?

I have looked at the web site for East West/Quantum Leap’s Symphonic Orch and Colossus. These would be at the upper end of what I may be willing to spend $$$.

I’ve also looked into Gigastudio3, Kontact, and Bandstand which are more favorably priced. But I don’t want to make a purchase based on price alone since quality is the reason for beginning this quest. Any info you can offer will be greatly appreciated!

the advantage of getting a software set-up is the possibillity to run as many vst's as you want (harware depending numbers)

First get a good vst host/ or sequencer. I am using OMB with chainer as a vst host.

I'd use bandstand for GM sounds (its very good and affordable.

I am totally intoo NI (native instruments as base of my setup right now

Kontakt (with GPO)
Kompakt (with colossus)
Reaktor
Guyitar combo
Bandstand (general midi)
Absynth
Akoustik Piano (Not as good piano as Steinberg the grand)
FM7 remember yamaha
Elektrik piano for elektrik rhodes and such
Pro 53
B4 II for my B3 sounds

but also from other makers:

steinberg the grand for my mainpiano sound.
Steinberg virtual bassist
Steinberg virtual guitarist
Korg the legaccy collection.
Tassman for some great phisical modelling
Arturia Brass ...Physical modelling brass

All these Vst instruments together give me a very good sound.

For orchestral sounds i like Kompakt with Colossus better then Kontakt with GPO, but then GPO is much cheeper and leaves room in the budget for other things.


[This message has been edited by Bachus (edited 04-23-2006).]

Nice collection of virtuals there. I like Chainer as well. it's one excellent host that is stable as a rock.

A local musician friend has Bandstand and my experiences with it were not very good. It took too long to load patches for it ( he has a very fast computer ) to be useful to me, and in the end he and I both agreed that it didn't sound a whole lot better than the freeware SGM180 soundfont that we A/B'd it against, in spite of having approx 10 times as much sample rom.

He just got Hypersonic 2 as well, dongle and all, and I went again to his place to demo it. I liked what I heard. I don't necessarily think the GM patches were superior to Bandstand's, but they loaded much faster. Also, for me, most of the Non GM voices were at least on par with their counterparts in my Motif ES, and in quite a few cases I liked them better.

I like the NI stuff as well. Although I'm tempted to try Arturia's Prophet, my experiences with their Moog and CSV80 emulations leaves me thinking I probably am better off sticking with the Pro 53. The Arturia emulations I mention sound wonderful, but they also suck up a ton of CPU and don't always respond the way they are supposed to inside of some of my hosts.

Absynth totally rocks, and in my mind covers much of the same ground as the Roland V synth, but with more patches that can actually sit well in a mix. B4 is for me better than having the real thing, mainly because it plays so well out of my four and a half pound laptop.

FM7 does the old yamaha DX7 very well, ( you can load the old hardware patch setups into it ) and it also goes beyond it. I'd probably get it if I didn't already have Sytrus, Image Line's FM based soft synth.

In addition to these my favs are : Korg legacy collection including the Wavestation, Polysix, and M1. Finally I have an M1 that works every time I fire it up, unlike my original hardware version. I doubt anyone could ever tell the difference in sound. The Poly six emulation is also dead on ( I had a Polysix as well ). I never had a Wavestation, but man it just rocks in software.

I also like the Plugsound Fretted, drum and keyboard modules.

My favorite analog emulator is still RGC Audio's Pentagon, although Imposocar, which goes after a different sound, is right up there as well.

Some great freewares are out there too: Minimogue VA sounds fat and even has a variable control to let you emulate the oscillator drift that a FReal Mini Moog would produce.

Synth 1 is an absolute killer freebie, based somewhat on a Nord Lead but also capable of sounds you'd likely never get from a Nord.

AJ

When are they going to make a PC/LT softsynth arranger setup that will rival a Stand alone Arranger KB/Module for live gigs on stage......with enough Flexiblity & Fast Navagation for live performance including sounds, style play, smf, mp3, etc etc? Until that time I steer away from all the softsynth stuff......I havnt found anything even close yet, but Im still hoping in the future it will come to market .......am I wrong?

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 04-24-2006).]

Donny,
IMO, it definitely will come, keyboards are basically dedicated cpu, with software, ROM, hard drive, monitor, etc.. Just like a real computer. The weakness in the softsynth world at the moment, IMO, is the size of the samples. If they were compressed, or maximized, as is done in hardware keyboards, softsynths would rule. The PSR3000 has a what, 64MB voice ROM. Frank has gigabytes of voices. Hypersonic 2 looks like a step in the right direction.

AJ,
Can you elaborate on Hypersonic 2. Is it better then SGM180? What about the Organ emulations? Are there voices on Hypersonic 2 that are usueable as lead voices? The demos I've hear sound relly good as accompaniment. Did you hear the acoustic bass? I think this was a voice that sounded like a super articulated voice!!!
Starkeeper

[This message has been edited by Starkeeper (edited 04-24-2006).]

[This message has been edited by Starkeeper (edited 04-24-2006).]

Donny,

If I had the technical ( computer ) skills needed, I'd consider building one myself, with all of the styles and sounds already inside, but with the option of course of adding any DX / VST plugs as well.

I think OMB is already good enough as far as navigation goes. As I said before, I find it just as easy to use as any arranger I've ever owned. The caveat of course is matching the right styles to the right sounds. It's pretty much the equivalent of importing styles from another arranger and trying to make them sound as good as ( or even better than ) your arranger's internal ones. Using all of the sound modules, samples and Vsti's I have, I can get the Korg styles, for example, to sound as good and in some cases better in my soft arranger than they sound on the PA80. This can however, take a lot of work, using several different modules / sample sets, etc, as I've yet to find any all in one soft modules that cover every type of instrument.

What really makes a difference to me are the lead voices though. My PA80 pales in comparison, and even the best Yamaha sounds lag behind for me.. and I happen to like many of Yamaha's lead voices better than their counterpatrts on the PA80.

Starkeeper,

I think SGM180 sounds come close to Hypersonic's GM set.. and I think both are very good. My SGM180 is modified though, so that also makes a difference. I like Hypersonic's GM set as well if not better than Bandstand overall. Mainly I liked that they loaded quickly. What I liked most about Hypersonic was the non GM ( lead ) voices. The basses and drums are excellent, along with many of the acoustic instruments, and there are a multitude of outstanding Digital synth patches and soundscapes. The latter is where HS2 really shines, and I always felt the Motif / Mo ES to be weak in the synth sound areas vs the other of the big 3. I didn't give the organs enough of a test drive though to say how much I like them vs other stuff I have.

Really, I think of HS2 as something like a Motif ES inside a computer, only with better sounds and effects, but also without the arps and sequencer. Then again that's what apps like Sonar, Cubase are for.... or for pattern building FL Studio, Orion, and Energy XT are for....

AJ


[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 04-24-2006).]

Thanks everyone for your responses. There are so many choices that sorting them out can be quite a daunting task. But the quest for quality is worth the effort.

Bachus, that’s quite an array of virtual instruments, I’ll certainly have to start much smaller initially but what you have put together would be a great goal to work towards. Though I haven’t heard it in person I do like what I’ve read about Native Instruments especially Kontakt and Bandstand and it seems that almost everyone agrees that B4II is the best Hammond emulation available.

I had originally wanted to stay away from Steinberg because of the whole dongle thing but I must admit that their Virtual Guitarist, Virtual Bassist, and Virtual Drummer appear to be the perfect tools to use for creating great custom styles.
I noticed that you use Steinberg’s The Grand as your main piano. I have considered Synthology’s Ivory. But everyone’s take on the perfect piano sound is so subjective. Thank you for bringing the vst host Chainer to my attention as I had not looked at it before. It looks very promising as a virtual rack to hold the various instruments.

AJ thanks for the info on Hypersonic II that’s good to know that it can load faster. Some of the titles you mentioned I am not familiar with at all but I will do some internet searches to check them out.

Donny & Starkeeper I agree with you both that a softsynth / arranger setup with the speed, stability, and ease of use of a stand alone keyboard is a definite need and surely can’t be too far in the future. To that end I’m still keeping a close eye on Wersi and Lionstracs. If the Wersi Ikarus had 88 hammer action keys it would be a definite contender for me and on the Lionstracs Mediastation, I’ll reserve judgment until I can demo it for myself.

I noticed that no one has mentioned Tascam’s Giga Studio 3. The $129.00 for the 10 GB of samples in the ensemble version seems like a good deal but I don’t know how fast the samples may load. Does anyone have any experience with GS3?

Anyway thanks and keep the responses coming. I’m learning a lot from you guys.

Bluezplayer, I agree with many of your comments. In addition, I would say to DNJ that I am so used to my setup that I can move as quickly as anyone on a hardware based arranger system. Yes the control surface is not as good but you can work around it and can get the job done quite nicely.

Furthermore, you may know that NI are working on Bandstand to provide a smaller wavetable that will load instantly in their next update. In addition, you will have the choice of the larger wavetable where higher quality of sound my be required. I will likely not relinquish my use of kontakt and very large (high quality) samples for my lead instruments. Of late I have been making use of the scripting features in kontakt (harmonizers, echoes, repeats, and so on)....very exciting.


[This message has been edited by Frank L. Rosenthal (edited 04-25-2006).]

Bluezplayer,
HS2 has an arpeggiator. It has some ready made arpeggios and if I remember well you can import midi files to use as phrases. Haven't used that though. Are we talking about the same thing?

Yes we are talking about the same thing. Now that you mention it I have heard about the arpeggiator in HS2 but I didn't even think about this when I was checking it out. Thanks for that Trident.

AJ



[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 04-25-2006).]