raymb1

Arranger keyboards are for Live Performance. None of the tools you mentioned... Cakewalk, powertracks... can do what a $100 arranger can do... autoaccompainent...

ok so basically if i wanna play piano + have fun i can still use the PSR-3000 right?
and if i'll wanna buy in future a RD-700SX, would it be able to connect the PSR-3000 ? can they work together?

I can't answer if the Roland will work with the PSR-3000....I've never tried them.
Ian

In using an arranger kybd, how does it read the notes you hold down with your left hand? Do you have to hold down the root of the chord also? How does it handle altered chords such as C13#11 etc? I've looked at the websites of a couple of arranger kybds and not a lot is described about the above. Later, Ray

I recognize the last name your artist list scott, but I don't know the rest of them

My dad used to be the Technics' distributor from around mid 80s to early 90s. I saw a shift from buying electronic organs, during the big "Lowrey" era back in in mid to late 70s, to buying arrangers throughought the 80s. People's view of arrangers there in Asia is a bit different..people just love the idea of one-touch-button orchestra and those with money, either buy it for themselves or for their children. Lots of one-man-band entertainers also bought arrangers for smaller gigs, for bigger gigs they rent the GN series from my dad's company and bring their own arranger also.

It is not common over there for people to hire a band for weddings or for company's party. People don't really pay much attention to the music, as far as they're concern it's more of something to accompany them while they eat and mingle and they are not much of a dancer either during these functions. SO, people hire musicians with arrangers more than 'live' band because it's costing them less money.

Also I think America is a bit 'prejudice' against arrangers, like they associate it with those (sorry...I am trying to make a point, this is not MY view) cheesy old-lounge player with pasteled color tux playing cheesy elevator music. Also I went to a couple Technics' dealer in town, they are some of the most stuck up people I've known in business. They looked down on me until I told them my family is in the business and I know how much mark up they actually have on their keyboards.

What would it take to awaken US market as far as Arranger Workstation are concered...

hmmm... good thing some one brought it up,

very close to what I'm ALWAYS thinking all the time, exept that I don't have just arranger workstations concerd, but all kinds of keyboards pianos, Arrangers, Music Workstations, organs, synthesizers... etc,
cuz nowadays guitars(and Bass and Drums) are more popular than anything...
I'd rather fight to make all kinds of keyboards more popular not just arranger workstations... because... I don't know how to explain this to you...
ok, a Guitar player can play basicaly an Acoustic Guitar, Electric, 12-string... etc..
almost the same thing with keyboards, all keyboard players, or i should say all Arranger keyboard players i know around here where i live, we play piano, Arranger, Sequence/Record... we don't saparate that bad, Even some proffessionals played on my own VA-76(one of 'em even played with styles a little bit at my house)well there are some Pianists that only play piano... But still,
Another thing is, that Workstations have an arpegiator, and there is Karma, that are similiar to Arrangers but just fall more into "pro" category..
I hope You understand what I'm trying to get across.

And Some nagative thought:
Don't forget that whenever we're playing with styles(Auto Acoompaniment), those styles were made by some other musicians, and it's like we are using some one else's work.(Unless we are using self-made styles)Even if Arranger Workstations will make it to a pro level, probably of them Arranger Keyboards will be sold without styles, so that user can make them himself



[This message has been edited by Vadim (edited 02-14-2006).]

Hey ...

Check this out too while you're at it.
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/012768.html

Thanks,

AJ

What most people here are perhaps mistaken in thinking is that workstations are for 'professional' users. Trust me, most workstations purchased in the US are NOT bought by working, professional musicians. They are bought by hobbyists and part-timers, as are the arrangers. Yes, the vast majority of professionals use workstations, but their share of the total market is still small.

The difference lies in focus, NOT ability of the keyboard.

Workstations sell well in the US because they market to the young, hip buyer with lots of disposable income, and they achieve it by sounding contemporary. You will not find any loop phrases or arpeggio patterns in a Triton or Motif or FantomX that sound old.......... no waltzes, no fox-trots, no schlager, no bossanovas, no enkas, none of that older stuff.

Only hip-hop, rap, techno, industrial, pop, etc.. The average potential keyboard player wants to play something that sounds like something he just heard on the radio, NOT at his/her grandparents' house.

He/she is going to buy that keyboard, take it home and find out that, once they have heard the built-in loops enough, the damn thing takes great skill to program their own loops to that level, but by then they have already PAID for it! If they had have had the choice of an arranger with the same sounding loops and arpeggios, once they got it home they would be able to manipulate those loops MUCH easier than the workstation, and had a much better musical experience.

There are VERY few features of full workstations that do not appear on high-end arrangers (and most people sequence on computers now, NOT the built-in sequencers of arrangers OR workstations), sampling is standard on most arrangers (and most workstations STILL use USB 1.1 for data transfer, so they are way behind the computer curve too), they have expansion slots, top of the line sounds, and MIDI capabilities. Were it not for the OS, they are close to identical.

But...............

The styles in most arrangers bite in the contemporary music area. Fact.

What the major manufacturers need to do is hire the guys that program the loops for Triton/Motif/FantomXs to make styles for the arrangers. Re-brand the keyboard to distinguish it from it's Mom and Pop brethren (the Roland MosDef? the Korg Blockparty??!) and ONLY have contemporary styles on board.

Of COURSE you can add in the bossanovas afterwards if you are so inclined, but at least no young soul brother is going to head for the door if he accidentally gets into the OLDIES bank while he is trying it out in the store with his homeboys!

The contemporary keyboard divisions of most of the majors have learned this simple lesson. How long will it be before the arranger divisions wise up to the fact that their target audience is dying??

Hi Diki,
Maybe you are right, maybe not!!
Because I intend to live another 25 years and I suppose many other keyboardplayers do
the same.
Another fact is some musicstyles will return
after a long period. The music goes on and
on.