You all maybe forgeting the Vancouvering/Moog project that ended poorly it was a windows based arranger digital piano.

How very true Graham.
What REALLY frightens me is that Bill Gates knew that his MS-DOS had serious shortcomings before he first marketed it. He did it to get on the market before a contemporary competitor and that is why all MS software has inbuilt resident bugs.
The frightening thing is that his software is used in just about all modern technical ware including services and defence etc.
cheers
Eddie



------------------
Eddie from Rotherham
www.yamahakeyboards.info

my mail is virus-free thanks to Norton Antivirus2002

I agree that Windows should stay in a PC. So what I described IS as PC. A PC in the shape of an arranger keyboard. A musical home entertainment center that can be used as a PC and as a musical instrument.

I'm not a personal fan of Bill Gates but the reality is that Windows is the standard for PC's and thanks to the fact that there is a standard you get your moneys worth when you by a PC. You may not have noticed it but you have been paying way to much for keyboards. If you compare what you get in a keyboard with PC's it is 20 years behind. Take a keyboard between $1000 and $1500. Look at the display and compare it with a PC. Where is the hard drive? 64 Kb internal memory versus 512 MB in a cheaper PC.

All the projects described before seem to have been experiments by people who didn't have the budget to do it right. I expect a firm like Sony or Dell to launch this product. They have the marketing and production power to get the right product in all the shops for the right price.

Jos

PS: Mike where I live people drink Beerenburg in stead of Jenever




[This message has been edited by Jos Maas (edited 09-01-2003).]

Jos,

In my opinion you are comparing 'Appels met Peren' !!
I have no idea where you think the latest technology has arrived in the upper class keyboards.
Modern keyboards do have harddrives, several Mb's of memory, flash-able OS'ses, pretty good displays etc.

You are messing up the 'core businesses' of two totally different machines :

a. Arranger keyboards = creating top quality sounds/styles.

b. Media Stations = handling all kinds of media-tasks. (creating music is only one of the features)

For a musician it is the highest priority to have good soundquality. A hi-res screen has a very low priority for him/her.

I own the B4 (Native Instruments) and like it very much, but an arranger keyboard in a PC ?

"20 years behind " ? ....... you'd better visit a music-shop/guitar centre very soon.... and you'll have to correct your statement I guess

Proost !

Roel,

A lot of the guys posting messages here have keyboards costing $4000 or more. But that is not an avarage keyboard. I'm talking about keyboards in the range from $1000 thru $1500. If you look at the specifications of such a keyboard you really have the specifications of a 20 year old PC.

When I'm in a music-shops I'm always amazed that the revolution that has taken place in the PC world is not happening in the keyboard world.

What I described is a Media Station as you described it, but in the shape of an arranger keyboard (with 61 normal size keys). When there will be a machine in the shops for $1200, that you can use as an arranger keyboard with a 600*800 color display, a hard drive, unlimited memory, that can be loaded with any sequencing and arranging software and softsynths, and can also be used as a normal PC, then people will buy it! They could easily sell a million of those! And they can sell it for such a low price because it uses standard PC parts (except for the black and white keys).

And there will be heavier models for (semi)professionals too, equiped with high quality soundcard synths.

So I understand that you won't spend the night in a sleeping bag before the music-shop to get the first one when it arrives. But it will arrive!

De mazzel!

Jos

It isn't just average boards or arrangers. The Motif, Yamaha's "flagship" workstation / synth, which came out maybe at the end of 2001 (?) still employs "simms" as the memory storage for sampling. Two PC's ago I had "dimms" for internal ram. Two PC's ago was early 1998. Many other recent keyboard offerings were still using floppy discs instead of smart media / hard drives / etc for media storage.

It has had me wondering at times how long the "latest and greatest" boards are actually on the "drawing board" before they are released.

AJ

[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 09-01-2003).]

One thing I would like to see the new boards go back is this!
When you change a default setting, it would remain that way until changed. I could do this on my old PSR-510! (Example) On my 2000
when I set the Grand Piano to a duo setting.
next time I use it it's back on the trio default setting. You can program it in song setup in the reg.
Nobby

A.J.,

Another good example that they can't keep up with the development in the PC industry. New mainboards for PC's appear every year. But Yamaha and the others stick to there own mainboards. If they want to switch from simms to dimms they must redesign there mainboards them selves and they are obviously reluctant to spend the costs for that. So that's one of the reasons arranger keyboards come with stoneage technology.

Nobby,

If you had problems like that with a PC/Arranger as I described, you just would have to install another software arranger. Instead of buying a complete new keyboard.

Jos


[This message has been edited by Jos Maas (edited 09-01-2003).]

I agree with you in this point : A hardware upgrade-of mainboards or CPU would be nice.

For example :
I was told the SD1 (Ketron) uses a 64 voice DREAM/ALMATEL soundchip. DREAM already has a 256 voice-soundchip available including 256 Mb (!) flashrom inside.
The reason brands do not implement the very latest technology is 'costs' and not wanting to 'please' all customers so they have all they want.
It is a strategy to slow down the progress en launch a new model every 3 years, so they keep customers happy.

I myself am willing to put some extra money to upgrade or increase CPU power / memory / polyphony...... if available

Roel

Roel,

You would like to get the same flexibility and price versus quality in an arranger keyboard as you get in a PC. But there are a billion PC's in the world that all use the same hardware components and software. How do you expect the makers of the Ketron SD1 or any keyboard to compete with that. They will have to make the same costs for research and development for there hardware and software and devide that over the much smaller number of customers. They will never be able to compete unless they build an arranger keyboard that IS a PC.

You want a new Dream/Almatel soundchip? Just plug in a standard soundcard. That's how it goes in the PC world and that's how it soon will be in the arranger keyboard world too.

Jos