How long are the songs users record here on the forum.. I'm asking this because the issue of that new recorder I'm getting allowing a full song of 8 tracks at 44 khz being 3 mins and 6 secs with a 128mb smart media card.. This afternoon I got a CD in the mail my wife ordered for me THE QUEEN OF SOUR HERSELF....., MS. ARETHA FRANKLIN.. That's my lady there.. Anyways this CD is a 2 disc set and has 30 of her greatest hits.. I looked on the back and 14 of those greatest hits were under 3 minutes long. Even her top hits like RESPECT which is only 2 mins and 26 secs long... How long does everyone here record for?

Squeak

Squeak, are you going to be recording tightly constructed radio hits or do you want to jam? If you compose, in what style? Three minutes is a serious limitation for many uses. I checked my songs and they range from 2:20 to one that ran over six minutes which included more guitar solos than needed, but I was having fun, and sometimes that's the point. The question is ,what are you wanting to accomplish? By the way, you can maximize track-minutes by sequencing all your keyboard parts and just recording a two-track stereo mix. Then it's down to how many guitar and vocal parts you want or need to add.However, you may find that guitars and some vocals sound better double-tracked, and unless you are a gifted singer,you may want to record several vocals and keep just the best parts. If $299 is the limit then you can't beat it, but a hard disc recorder with virtual tracks and much more recording time is very nice and not TOO much more money. Good luck and have fun.
Bill

Squeak,
My average instrumentals are 6 + minutes, average vocal piece about 4.5

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jam on,
Terry
http://imjazzed.homestead.com/Index.html

Then of course, if you're gigging and you're requested to play a particular piece that you're not really fond of...then it seems to go on for hours!!!!

Squeak,

That's a pretty tight format, too tight for a lot of songs. I would reconsider if I were in your shoes.

Cheers,

Gary

Very few of my songs are less than three minutes. I have a couple of instrumentals that are over 7 minutes long. Most though rage from 4 to 5 and a half minutes in length.

Personally Squeak, I would never limit myself to a format that restricts me in that way or causes me to use less tracks in order to gain time. If my budget prevented me from going much past the recorder you are looking at, and I was concerned about time constraints ( I would be ), I would either consider a better "used" digital recorder, or I would seriously consider using the comp and buying a good piece of software. My modest setup in my previous computer consisted of N track studio. It is VST capable, and it cost 50 dollars with add on Fasoft effects .. ( before I spent another 25 to upgrade to 24 / 96 ) I used it on a PII ( 300 mhz / 128 mb ram ), with a SB live card and XG works. On that modest setup I easily could get 6-8 tracks ( no lemgth limitation ) without clicks, pops or other issues. The VST capability means I can add effects as I go.

Today I have Sonar, yet I still prefer N track for audio ( but Sonar is always my first choice for midi work )

AJ

[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 02-04-2003).]

I can see where some people run into problems with a 3 minute limitation. However this unit does take any size smart media card, so eventually I'll be buying a 256mb card. A 256mb card allows just over 50 minutes of high quality 16bit 44.1 khz recording, and twice that in the lowest record grade... I think 50 minutes is more than enough.. Found out today that there are 1 gig cards now (but they're new and cost like $500.00) May be a while before I get one of those, but a 256 is in my reach

Squeak

Squeak.
As Aj pointed out I would reconsider. You can get power tracks from PG music for under $100. and not be limited except by your hard drive size. The 1gig card at $500.00....take that money if you were to spend it and you could buy a real decent digital hard disc recorder.

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jam on,
Terry
http://imjazzed.homestead.com/Index.html

Hello Squeak,
My songs average at about four minutes (which is usually about 3mins 50 seconds too long for most listeners )

I think smart media cards are starting to come down in price anyway and will continue to do so, so it should not be that much of an issue. I certainly would not let that put me off buying if I really wanted it. It is not as if you don't have the option to upgrade!

I don't quite understand your reluctance to use a pc based prog for recording seeing as you already have the hardware. As AJ says NTrack Studio is phenominal for the money. I tried with a yammie four track once and only used it twice before going back to the pc for recording. Then again I am not a techie and I know that you are so maybe it is horses for courses as they say
Best to you
Tony W

For many years there was an "unwritten" law that radio stations wanted records (remember them?) to be less than 3 or 3 1/2 minutes. A few songs became big hits despite that (Lyin' Eyes, American Pie, El Paso, etc.) and then it became not so important. If you get away from popular or country music, and into other genres such as Jazz, then the rules change.
Powertracks Pro is about $30. and gives you almost unlimited recording options.
DonM

I am the entertainer, I've come to do my show
You've heard my latest record spin on the radio
It took me years to write it, they were the best years of my life
If you're gonna have a hit you gotta make it fit
So they cut it down to 3:05


from "The Entertainer" by Billy Joel

Just made me think of these lyrics.

- Brian

Squeak, you can bounce your tracks and free up a track and memory. for example if the bass and drums mix is tight and sound okay, bounce them to a free track..this will free up memory[you can not undue the bounce]..

Brian ... As I scrolled through the posts I was mentally preparing my response and the I came to yours and saw you beat me to it!!
The comments on the time of a recording being dependent upon type of music, how it is used etc. are right on ... When I was doing general business (weddings, dinner dances, etc.) work many years ago you could do a song in your own style. Often we would be playing and as long as the dance floor was full we would go from one song into another. While I still can do that at a lot of the piano lounge type gigs I play, the wedding crowd today wants to hear it 'just like the record' ...
I am currently putting together a recording (at the urging of my dear wife of almost 40 years) and I would think that most of the tunes are in the 3 1/2 to 4 minute range. I want to do another of mostly jazz tunes (unfortunately I am not a 'jazz player', but I love the music), and I would expect those to be longer, as I will attempt to affect horn, guitar, flute etc. solos via the kb ...
squeak ... how much does that 256mb card go for?...
t.

You all know that refers to "Piano Man" right? (maybe that was too obvious)

Thanks everyone for your responses... Also I completely understand where everyone is coming from with PC sequencing. I have no dislikes about that set up, but I don't want to have to power up a PC everytime I want to record. There are a lot of good programs out there for that I know wouldn't give me any real limitations in length, but as someone stated earlier there's always the options of upgrades.. That's how it is with this Fostex. I'm not limited to the 128mb card... I can upgrade to any size I so choose, and here's the best part. FOSTEX SUPPORTS THEIR EQUIPMENT!!!!!! They recently released an OS upgrade for this unit free to all owners.. It's on their website and all you have to do is hook it up to your computer via USB, and that's it...

Fran,
You're right about the bounce feature. That's why I'm buying this.. If it didn't have a bounce or as they use to say "ping pong" feauture, I wouldn't buy the things. When I get the 256mb card it's going to be crazy in my home.. Because I'll have 50 minutes for one song Anyways computer based sequencing is a great way to record, but sometimes I'd rather not fire up the computer to record a song. This unit has complete, and I mean complete and total hands on control.. Every function has a botton or knob on the face.. No menues or anything.. It's such an easy unit to use...

Cheers,
Squeak

Holy Crap! Check this out.. This is what someone posted at the Fostex Forum regarding the price drops on the smart media cards.. Now mind you this post is for a 512mb card..

512MB CFC: BIG Price Drop!
I just pulled the trigger on a Viking 512MB compact flash card for my MR-8. Amazon.com is selling the card for $159 plus a $50 rebate!!! Final price = $109 (no charge for tax or shipping)! After I have a chance to give the card a spin, I'll provide a full report.
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$109.00 is not bad for a 512mb card. Gives you an idea on how the price is on the 256mb card.....

Squeak

Just saw on Amazon that you can get a 256mb card for $69.99 (after $20.00 rebate) That's a good deal

Squeak

512mb card will give you 1 hour and 36 minutes of 16bit 44.1khz recording time, and twice that in the extended mode..(which again the extended mode I think is above cassette tape 4 tracks quality)

Squeak

Squeak,
I have a hard disk recorder (Roland VSR880) and the time allotted for total recording is AVERAGED out to a "time per track".
I'm not positive, but I think that time is in a lump sum, just waiting to be used, so if you didn't need all 8 tracks - it's very possible to record longer than the average. It only uses ACTUAL time, as far as I know.
At least, that's the way the Roland works.

UD,
Fostex has it set up so that you don't waste any of your time for recording.. When you record a track it only records when you're playing, and doesn't record when you're not.. Your first track could be a full 3 minutes long, and you're second may only total out to be 30 seconds or so, but even if you start recording from the very begining that track will only contain the 30 seconds you played and not a full 3 minutes so yes if some of your tracks are shorter you can get longer recording time per track..

Squeak

I'm not good enough to make a song vocal or otherwise more than 3 minutes.. As it is takes me a week to make up a song a day to do lyrics and a six pack on friday night to record.

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I don't steer the ship, I bail out the water.