Learning a new tune is not really practice...Practice to me is learning techniques...and I am already set in my ways to put up with that...now where did I put that accordion...........

Man, this kind of stuff really bothers me. Chas is a fellow I highly respect for his willingness to articulate and stand by his beliefs...beliefs regarding music, social issues and more. I get and appreciate all his refrences to music styles, players etc.

Mo shows an admirable understanding of the music business, music history, major players, instruments, etc.

Chas, Mo and I are mostly on the same page in those areas, and, on a bandstand, I have no doubt that we would "cook" and enjoy!

That's why what I believe mostly issues of semantics is so unnecessary. When you "just play" and you're at a certain level of proficiency, you're doing variations on lead lines, playing fifths...you're practising! Maby you're not learning new material, but you're still learning and improving. It just happens that way.

I really don't see a major disagreement...only nit picking.

Why?

Russ
Russ

Hey Russ, it's not me, it's him...that ol' meanie, Miami Mo. I hate him.

Hey Mo, I hope you realize I'm just kidding and trying to illustrate just how childish this kind of stuff sounds, especially coming from old men. I apologize for whatever I may have contributed to the negative turn the post may have taken.

chas

NOW EVERYONE KNOWS WHY FRAN ONLY KNOWS ONE TUNE--BUT HE KNOWS IT WELL!

Gary



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Travlin' Easy

If you play a sax, trumpet, trombone flute etc. and you want to be successful in a OMB, an excellent sequencer on an arranger is essential, especially if you really like the lively styles on a particular keyboard like I enjoy my i30 Big Band and Jazz styles with the longer loops.

I also enjoy playing the arranger live when I do vocals. If you try to do more than one or two tunes solo on a wind instrument you'll most likely bore people to death unless you can play like Dexter Gordon and Sonny Rollins.

Charley Parker used to practice 8 to 10 hours a day at times for several years. Don't think Art Tatum got there without ever practicing. Maybe he didn't practice after 10 or 20 years of experience. If you try to practice for more then an hour or two a day and try to compete with Charlie Parker’s practice time, you’ll probably have to do as much drugs as he did and you probably won’t live very long. Sad but true. I don’t ever expect to be as good as Charlie Parker.

If you don’t practice you’ll probably play every tune in the same key and perhaps the same 20 tunes over and over. If you are trying to play a wind instrument and you never practice you’ll probably never get a professional sound. You’ll always sound like a second year Jr. High sax player which is OK for a second year Jr. High school kid but not for someone who claims to be playing for 20 years and sounds like he‘s been playing for a few months.

Practice practice practice.

What i find interesting when these sorts of debates happen is that whatever anyone says is true from their experience but let me add my 5 pence worth

Everyone has a measure of the "gift" of music (not equally so however) but what makes great players stand out is undoubtedly the aplication of that gift with focused directed practise. Art Tatum did not just sit at a piano and play briliantly, he must have practised to get to a level where he could play well (there are lots of myths about great players and their natural abilities but to the most extent they are simply that ...myths). Practise could involve playing certain riffs over until you can play them fluently or listening to music until your ear becomes highly trained to chords and progressions and harmonic content. Some people will develope more quickly through practise than others but EVERYONE can improve their musicianship if they practise the areas they want to improve. I get just a tad upset when people say they wish they had the gift to play a musical instrument. If they can hear one note diferent from another and can keep time reasonably they have all the gift they need. The rest is down to application and focused learning and practise.

And thats the same for any talent or gift be it sport music,public speaking etc

[This message has been edited by Spalding1 (edited 03-06-2007).]

Anybody know how many forms and genres of music would die out if everybody was as good as Tatom or Getz or Montgomery or any other artists like that? I mean, would bands like ACDC even exist if all the musicians were supremely gifted on their instruments?

I guess, when you think about it, arranger users are using arrangers BECAUSE they don't have a great rhythm section to play with. So ANYTHING technical that interferes with the smooth, controllable aspect of arranger play is worth complaining about. Who knows? Perhaps there's an R&D guy actually READING this stuff, and maybe fixes a problem or two with the next OS or arranger.

I can certainly attest to having heard several 'greats' bitch royally at a rhythm section (or sidemen!) that didn't perform up to expected standards. We are just doing the same.

I've spent a lifetime trying to learn each and every inflection of a horn sound, and try to translate it to the keyboard and bender. I am a reasonable trombone player, and understand about phrasing, breathing, a host of horn techniques that can be translated to synth sounds and sax samples, to make for a realistic and authentic heart-felt solo. I've spent decades practicing to do the perfect pedal steel sound, or lead guitar scream. Practice does indeed, make perfect (or as close to it as technology allows).

UNFORTUNATELY.... my favorite arranger manufacturer dropped the ONE feature of their arranger line that allows me to utilize those skills..... the ability to have the arranger's chord sequencer repeat whatever whacked out (or standard!) changes I just came up with, and now go and use what I have practiced.

So, in fairness, I am not whining because of my lack of skill, but because I DO have it....!

Hold your hand(s) up if you consider yourself to be fully two-fisted players....... Doesn't it just make your blood boil to see that perfectly good left hand get hijacked to a job a monkey could do?!!

So, cgiles, while keeping your practice regimen up is always good advice, trying to get a manufacturer to re-introduce a feature that ALLOWS that practice to be used is also 'good advice'.

So correctomondo, Chas...you really hit the nail squarely on the head.

Ian




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Cha d’dhùin doras nach d’fhosgail doras.

On the subject of practice

Someone once asked Pable Cassels the great cellists: Why at the age of 94 do you still practice? His reply was, " I'm starting to see some improvement".