Hello,

I have tried to record some samples on my 9kpro.
Since there is only 11 sec of rec. time I have tried to use loop in wave edit menu but
I still couldn't "fake" continuos sound after 11 sec.
Loop start is quite noticable so you can hear the "transition" after 11 sec.

Can you have smoother transition between
loop "end" and "start" ?
Is there any other way of making continous
sound from 11 sec sample ?

Thanks !

Denis

Denis,
11 seconds is a heck of a time for a sample!
Since I don't own a 9000 pro, can you tell me if the screen shows you the wave in all its lenght? If this is the case, it should be much easier to find a good loop analyzing the waveform and choosing two points that are at the same level (I mean two "peaks" or two "depressions"); otherwise, if you have to go by ear, try to find a loop that matches the natural vibrato of the sound. Start with a long loop and press the "find" button (all samplers have a button to automatically find a good loop) until you are satisfied with the result.
Let me know and maybe I can help more.
Andrea

I'll try that.

Thanks Andrea

Denis007,
I agree with Dreamer in that if you're having trouble finding a loop point by ear, it would be easier to do it by looking at the waveform. From what I was told by Yamaha the 9000 pro's sampler is almost indentical to that of the Yamaha EX series. I used to own the EX-7 and I used its sampler a great deal. Question...., what are you sampling that is 11 seconds long? Like Dreamer stated that is a rather long sample. You can actually find the loop point by ear, but it takes some practice. The only time I used the visual waveform in my EX's sampler was when I had a really thick sample that had a lot of activity within it.

Squeak

Hello,

Squeak, Andrea,

I have to admit I don't have any experience with samling.
The 9kpro is my first chalange.

First thing that I have noticed is that you both think the
11 sec is quite a lot for sampling a sound.
In that case I assume that shorter time is sufficient for recording and then
if I want to make the sound longer than the actual sample I have to apply the loops ?
Is that right ?
I have tried to make a shorter sample (3 sec) but I just get more frequent breaks
since they will show up every 3 sec instead of 11sec like before.
If I have a sample which is 11 sec long there is a bigger chance that I will not reach the
end of the sound so I will not hear the break at all.
That is not a case with 3 sec samples but you would probably agree with me that having 11 sec sample just to avoid break point is not very elegant solution since I loose my precious memory
for other samples.

How long is sufficient recording time for a simple sound which achieves its
final form right away ?

I am trying to sample some lead sounds from my Cs1x.
The sound is pretty much unchanged from the begining but
I need to keep its continuity since the original sound can be played as long as you
hold the key.

I have tried to play with loops but I couldn't make it very nice.
Even if I chose auto detect on the keyboard it doesn't remove that 'transition'
break.
Yesterday I have tried a software which allow you to edit wave forms and
it is much easier to find "better" spot for the start/end of the loop.

On my 9kpro I have indication of the signal level of starting and ending loop
point but even with same levels,the break is significant.
I do not see the wave itself so maybe that's why I can't match it like with the
software.

Could one of you confirm that I am not missing any steps in sampling but I just
need more practice to find the "right spot" for looping.

Here is what I do :
1. Record (0 - 11sec)
2. Edit wave sample and apply a loop
3. Save it as custom voice

Is there any step which can make the transition smoother ?


Thanks a lot !

Denis

Denis,
Question for ya...... When you sample the sound and then try to edit it and set the loop point. Do you find the break in the sample to be at the end or is there a short delay when you press the key? I'm asking this because of the possibility that your trigger level might not be set low enough. If you sampled it for only 3 seconds and your trigger level was set to it's lowest setting and if there was any break it would be in the end. It's confusing to me because of the problem you're having looping a 3 second sample... It does take some practice and the manual will only help you so much. You'll learn a lot more by messing around with the sampler itself. Also, when you sample this voice, are you trying to use it across the keyboard as a user voice? If so there's going to be a lot of work involved in making the voice.. It's not hard, but you'll have to do a lot more than one 3 second sample. It depends on the voice and how much there is to it. You might be able to reduce it down to one second. If you can get your hands on the latest January 2002 edition of KEYBOARD MAGAZINE, there is an article in there that explains in full detail how to sample a voice and map it across the keyboard. It's an excellent article and it covers a lot...... Again my suggestion to you would be to dig into the sampler and practice as much as you can.... Samplers are a little tricky if you're not familiar with them.. Especially the ones in keyboards... I know a lot of people who buy separate samplers like the Boss SP-303 Dr. Sample, because they are a little easier to use. Your keyboard has a great sampler, but its learning curve can be a little steep for a beginner......

Squeak

Denis,
if you try to sample a synthesized sound (like a synth lead) you should choose a starting point for the loop AFTER the decay phase of the sound, when the steady phase begins. Unless there is a heavy vibrato, the sound should then be uniform; otherwise try to set on your synth the vibrato speed and depth to zero.
A short loop should do the trick; set the loop end point about one second apart from the starting point and then keep pressing the "find loop" button until you are satisfied with the result. If there is still a "pop" or "click" then try to apply some crossfade transition to make the noise unaudible.
If, on the other hand, you cannot get rid of the vibrato, then choose a loop that matches the vibrato wave.
The final step is to cut the sample shortly after the end of the loop, to save memory and hard disk space.
Like for everything else, experience leads to perfection.

[This message has been edited by Dreamer (edited 01-07-2002).]

Hello,

Squeak_D,

I have set automatic trigger level below my input signal which means right after
I press a key, recording starts.
If I listen the sample without loop it has constant sound all the way till the end of sample(3 sec)
and then it stops.
The "click" happens when I apply a loop and it apears at the start point.

Regarding the custom sounds ...
Before recording I need to set the range for my sound.
It will automatically "spread' the wave sound across the range so I don't have to do anything.
Is this good or bad ?
I can assign different samples to different part of the keyboard but I can not put one over another.

It looks to me that I just need more practice.
I'll try to get the Keboard Magasine too.

I want to thank you and Andrea for help !
: )


Denis

Denis what type of sound are you sampling? There may be a possibility that the start point of the sound might be slightly differnt from the end where the sound peaks.. (hope that makes sense) It could quite possibly be the type of affect that the keyboard your're sampling from has applied to that sound... Try this.. Turn the effects off on your Cs1x for the sound your're sampling.. Also before you turn the effects off, check and see what effect the Cs1x has assigned to the sound, check the reverb, chorus, and whether there is a system or insert effect applied as well. Write these settings down too. then check the effects on your 9000 pro to see if there is a similiar effect (which there should be) Yamaha is pretty universal with effects in regards to their upperline synths. If you sample just the raw voice with no effects into the 9000 pro and edit the sound by setting your desired loop point, and then use the internal effects of the 9000 pro you should be able to get the sound you want with the proper looping.. Just find the effect or the one that's closest to it and match up the numbers. Just transfer the settings from the other keyboard into the 9000 pro manually. Hope this helps...

Squeak

Denis,
try to change the starting point of the loop moving it towards the end of the sound.
If the 9000 pro supports crossfade, try to apply it; crossfading is like using sandpaper on a rough surface: it should "smoothen out" (does that word exist in english?) the click you hear.
Good luck
Andrea