Hello people!

conclusion: Roland VA-7 misses important things to buy it. Shame shame shame!
I just registered and want to join this group. I am looking for a new keyboard so I tested everything except the Ketron X1 so I think I can give a good impression about the VA-7. My personal favorite is still the Korg i30 because of the beautiful looks! It seems to me that everybody forgets about that. It looks professional, with not many buttons, touch screen etc. The PSR9000 looks like a childinstrument in that way. The only problem is that the Korg hasn't got speakers!

Ok the truth about the Roland VA-7, you have been wating for that! About one week ago the instrument came in a local stoor (The Netherlands, Apeldoorn) with a demoplayer demonstrating the instrument. After that I played for about 1 hour with it.

first impression:
The sound that is produced is unbelievalble. The drums are indeed the best ever heard. It is a life drumplayer sampled completely. There is NO difference between real drums and the styles on the keyboard. The first downside: there are not many styles that take these drums out of the background: the drums in the styles are almost always background, so more concentrating on bass and accompaniment which is a shame, cause the drums are really PERFECT. If you e.g play the hihat, you can actually hear the difference between end of hihat working to the middle of the hihat by using the touchresponse. But like i said, you need to ajust the volume every time to listen to the drums.
Than Variphrase: this is incredible. You just cannot believe your ears!! I mean this. You can actually sample your voice, like on other synths, but by playing the notes, Roland managed to take out any wave, so that there is a sample left without pitch: you hear one tone. That means if you take a C and then a F, the pitch is the same, but the voice actually sings in an F now, without fasting the wave! This means you can finally PLAY with samples. You can play chords etc without changing the rate. When you sample BORIS in C you hear Boris in C. When you press the lowest C you dont hear BBOOORRRIIISSS anymore (like other keyboards) but you hear BORIS in low C !
You just have to hear his too believe this. If you press C and D and E (chord) than you actually hear 3 people saying BORIS!

There is a beautiful flute: you play some notes and then you hear voice breathing in some air! Than continue playing as if it's a real man playing flute. What a great detail Roland!

Total sounds of 3649 is impressive.

second impression:
But there is a BIG downside of the instrument which prevents me of buying it. Roland made some VERY big mistakes according to me: you all watch out! The ammount of 128 (+64 ZIP) styles looks normal, but is below average. Looking at the fact that they have more than 3 thousand styles (1500 NEW ones) they could do the same great job at the styles, but not. I tried to look for a variety of Blues and Dixie, but not enough, at least not what I liked. This is a simple example. Like always there are no oriental styles (when are the boys realizing that it CAN BE important like GEM does). The biggest problems are these:

1. You cannot acces Transpose and Octave UP anymore by a single touch on the keyboard. Roland thought it was easier to press first the touch screem for the correct menu and then once again to transpose! In life-performance for me this means: cannot buy the Roland!! Why did they do this? This counts for more functions. No more easy one button: now need two presses for the same function (always by touch screen on menue).

2. The 4 variations can ONLY be accesed via the touch screen!!!!! This is real crap. If you have a menue screen open (for example the tanspose button screen) you CANNOT change your variations without pressing (again) 2 buttons! EVERY keyboard should have the basic functions on a click ON the keyboard and NOT in a menue! For live performance this means FAST DEATH OF A KEYBOARD.

3. One other big lack: you cannot press FILL to variation or FILL to original anymore! There are only two fills. One normal one (to variation) and one to basic again but this is ONE button! This means you need to HOLD the button if you would like to return to your Original! I just couldnt believe this! Where other keyboards have 4 FILLS (even a Gem from $800) but this $3000 Roland has only ONE button with two functions. This is just unacceptable. I just need 4 Variations with 4 fills EASY accesible, because that counts in live performance. There is no BRAKE MUTE or Tempo Change button easy accesible hahaha.

One last matter: Roland says you can now make out of 2 styles one style. You use the bass of the one, the drum of the other etc. Is this braking news? NO! The KN-6000 had this possibility 2 years ago. Creating one style out of 200 styles!!

I can conlude by saying that the drums are perfect. That cannot be anymore better and that the Variphrase options (playing voicesamples as chords) is something that cannot be believed without heard. And a LOT of sounds available.
But: The Roland VA-7 cannot be used in LIVE performance, which for me means the death of a not yet born keyboard.

Sorry for making this so long, but all the positive things I heard are probably from people who havent played the instrument!
On demo it is good: but first check it out!

If the above things dont bother you (transpose, fills, easy acces to certain function): BUY THE THING! NOTHING IS BETTER!
But I think it is all about live performance.

Big shame....

Ilija Petkovski

hi Ilija !

thanks for your impression....

but i must desagree with you in some meters...

"My personal favorite is still the Korg i30 because of the beautiful looks...."

>>> i never thought buying keyboard because the looks.....

btw korg triton has touch screen and some of my real pro friends play with it live !!!!!
every day !!!!!!
its a meter of habbit and ability......

"The sound that is produced is unbelievalble. The drums are indeed the best ever heard......"

>>> ISNT IT ALL ABOUT????????
sounds and modules are the main stream
in music industry
pepole and manefucters spend alot of money
on this TO GET THE VA-7 SOUNDS YOU NEED
g-1000+xv3080 +sc8850 +vp9000
...a lot of money ISNT IT???
and you STIL wont get the va-7 styles...

than
" Than Variphrase: this is incredible. You just cannot believe your ears!! I mean this."

>>> with this i totaly agree its a revolution!!!

"Total sounds of 3649 is impressive."

"The ammount of 128 (+64 ZIP) styles looks normal, but is below average. Looking at the fact that they have more than 3 thousand styles (1500 NEW ones) they could do the same great job at the styles

>>>> (i think you ment tones....)
128 styles + 580 on zip + all the backlvl
styles (g-1000 e serias.....)
all the convertesd from x1 psr9000
(i have more than 10,000 difrent ones...)
with the orient ones...
btw isnt it a workstation arranger...
you can make a lots of your own
like i made o lots of orientals....

>> morping of styles you had in the g-1000...

>> transpose , vartion
is a meter of habit and use
touch screen is real great even for live prformance !!!!!!!!!!

"....FAST DEATH OF A KEYBOARD"
>>> this the market will decide !!!!!!!!!
mean while the interst and the orders of
that keyboard NEVER been in roland
SO GREAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(i get that fact from dealers of roland
all over the world)

"but all the positive things I heard are probably from people who havent played the instrument!
On demo it is good: but first check it out!"

>>> i agree every one need to check it !!!!
but all the poitive things I GOT IS FROM
CHECKING THE VA-7 AND FROM OTHERS PRO....
btw the demos of the va-7 played live !!!!

" If the above things dont bother you (transpose, fills, easy acces to certain function): BUY THE THING! NOTHING IS BETTER!"

>>> your kiling keyboard with the best sounds
ever made for few functions .

YOU NEED TO CHANGE YOURS HABIT LIKE
IN KORG TRITON
AND YOU GET THE GREATEST LIVE PREFORMNACE
EVER WITH THE BEST SOUNDS EVER !!!!!

WITH THE ONE AND ONLY ROLAND VA-7 !!!!
****************************************
EYAL
http://www.egroups.com/group/va-7



[This message has been edited by eyal (edited 06-05-2000).]

Sorry, still not convinced until I play it. You can post 1000 posts a day about how great it is and how good it makes toast and breakfast in bed, but if I dont experience it myself then I am afraid its all hype..

DannyUK

dannyuk

please read the posts !!!!!!!!!!!!
you will see ...."but first check it out!"

than....
>>> i agree every one need to check it !!!!


so.. we checked it

hope youl check it soon
and you see whay me and lots of others says

"...BUY THE THING! NOTHING IS BETTER!""

eyal
http://www.egroups.com/group/va-7

I am really sorry Roland fan. A keyboard can have the BEST features ever but if it doesnt work in LIVE performance it can't be bought buy those who need it for LIVE performance.
And who said something bad about touch screen? The Korg i30 has also touch screen, but the moste needed functions (fill, variation, brake mute etc) can be found ON the keyboard and not via e menue which you need to press a couple of times.

So the Roland has superb sounds, but the use is NOT okay. I cannot understand how you can defend such an expensive keyboard with superb features but with a bad interface. Why dont you think: well they spend so much time on everything, why not make the other functions easy to use? Why is it good on old Rolands? Why did they need to change strategie? I know you cannot answer that question, so I dont understand your point of view. Something that has always been good with Roland isnt anymore. No matter how good the rest is. I am sorry but Roland should really be ashamed.

Ilija

What's all the fuss about transposing and fill-ins?

Can't you use a pedal or footswitch to apply these?

With my old psr9000 I still had to trigger fills from pedals especially in pianist mode in full flow, where a third hand would have came in handy!

Then you also have a D-beam and Ribbon controller at your disposal. Surely these can assigned as further triggers!

If the VA-7 actually sounds as good as you say it does, (I have played it too) then it seems a bit harsh for you to just abandon it so quickly.

Brian.

What's all the fuss about transposing and fill-ins?

Can't you use a pedal or footswitch to apply these?

With my old psr9000 I still had to trigger fills from pedals especially in pianist mode in full flow, where a third hand would have came in handy!

Then you also have a D-beam and Ribbon controller at your disposal. Surely these can assigned as further triggers!

If the VA-7 actually sounds as good as you say it does, (I have played it too) then it seems a bit harsh for you to just abandon it so quickly.

Brian.

Eyal,

Its OK, I have taken another headache tablet so I can reply to your posts once more !! (hehe). j/k, your posts are fine !!!

You have suggested to me that I have to 'read the posts' but the posts tells me exactly everything I am not interested in, things likes hype, its the best in the world, buy this, buy that, get this, its a must, its a sure thing, listen to the amazing demos, the demo sounds great, download this and hear it, and whatever else. This is NOT what I call a constructive or a balanced judgement on any keyboard but merely a personal view.

Most people who play something and find its so great normally say something like 'I have played so and so today and its the best thing I HAVE heard'. From my own experience, I will say 'The Solton X1 is the best keyboard I HAVE played or heard so far', then place a constructive account into why i think its so, normally arguments FOR and against, and not just FOR!!!. Its different from saying something like your choice of phrases, eg,

'YOU GET THE GREATEST LIVE PREFORMNACE
EVER WITH THE BEST SOUNDS EVER !!!!!'

or

'"...BUY THE THING! NOTHING IS BETTER!""'

These are biased views. But most of your posts contain good information that we are interesting in reading about, eg, the features and other associated attributes that are interesting, eg, like the Variphrase. But if you refrain from reminding us that we need to throw all our keyboards in the bin and rush out to buy the VA-7, then your posts make for perfect reading!!!

DannyUK

Brian,

When are you getting your VA-7? Also, when you tried it did you notice any SMF playback? What about the lyrics or any other info on the screen?

How powerful is the sequencer? Creating songs is very important.

DannyUK

Hello Danny, eyal, Ilija,

I read a lot about the VA-7 and heard the demo CD many times (I have it at home: attention eyal - I have already heard the demo!).
I have to admit that the demo sounded very very nice and I enjoyed it very much, but on the other hand I absolutely agree with Danny, that the most important impression I will get after playing the keyboard.
Your postings, eyal, are fully unbalanced (as Danny wrote), because you have been writing poems, how perfect the VA-7 is, which incredible sounds it has and how perfect the demo sounds etc. But you have never written about user interface and how it is easy to play (I sort the keyboard how they can play ALL songs, not only the demo ones). And you have never mentioned how easy is to change a variation together with instrument or transpose together with variation changing, how fast a instrument can be chosen, if you can change variation and "one touch settings" together between two beats during live performance and so on. These are the features I use 90% of my live playing time.
I have not played the VA-7 yet, but after having played the G-1000 and EM-2000 (which are two most user-unfriendly keyboards I have ever played), I am a little bit sceptic.

At the end: 3649 instruments!!! That is sooo funny!! How many from them are you able to use? How many will you ever hear? Are you able to remember how these 3649 instruments are sounding? (I know, I have problems with 331 instruments on the PSR 9000). Are you able to recognize at least one fifth of these instruments? In Germany we say: "You won't see the forest because of the trees!"

Regards

Marek

marek,

"you can't see the wood for the trees...."
There you are, we might as well resort
to some linguistic banter, as long as the
VA 7 has not actually arrived on the scene.
This protracted discussion on the merits
of the new Roland machine is getting nowhere,
so let's call a truce, sit in the sun, and
hope for the best.
By the bye, yes I have also ordered a VA7
and surely will let you know about my
assessment.
........in due course ,that is.........

regards,

John.

[This message has been edited by john smies (edited 06-06-2000).]

People,

I just want to emphasize that for me as a student I need to work hard for months or years to spend money on a keyboard like the VA-7. It is my right to demand a perfect state of sound and usability. If it lacks this even at one point, you feel bad spending that money cause you want a perfect machine. Why Roland doesnt spend juts a couple of hours more asking people about small things? Like someone said: how does the user programm changing work during play?
Those small things turn into big trouble on stage. If we pay $ 3200 we can expect perfect machines and I dont mean the sound.

And finally: 3500 sounds was not to let the Roland G and EM users feel behind. It has the same sounds as them plus 1500 new ones.

So the trees just feel at home in the woods...

Ilija

I have Roland G-1000 and I agree with Ilija Petkovski.Some of my friends in Macedonia whant to sale G-600.But why? Simply, missing synchro stop button.Only one button but very useful and many, many buttons
VA-7 haven't synchro stop button allso.
Sorry for english

These posts concerning the VA-7 have been very entertaining. I felt no urge to join in however I have felt to comment about one observation.

I would supose, that in addition to obvious value of these forums (give and get info), it would seem that a primary reason to take the wait and see posture would be whether or not one might purchase this new beast.

Why then, have I notice that three or four people who have also taken the "wait and see attitude" have already ordered the keyboard.

Am I missing something? What happened to the wait and see after you play BEFORE you write the check?

Hi DannyJ,

Who has ordered one then?

As for me, I would not even buy one even IF it performs better than the X1. Ive been chopping and changing keyboards so many times in the last 2 years and with the X1 I have finally found one to settle with. With most of my previous keyboards, within 6 months of having them, the honeymoon period faded too quickly, eg, with the PSR8000, I30, WK8. I know the X1 is the right one because even after 7 months I am still blow away with how it plays and sounds sometimes.... I cant let it go !!! So no VA-7 for me i'm afraid, i will let all you budding musicians fight it out amongst yourselves !!!!!!!

DannyUK

`Hi you all,
The real truth of the VA7 will not be the
same for everyone. IIilja is a student, maybe
he is a onefingerplayer, it would be nice to
see what he thinks about his VA7 after playing a month. I hope your VA7 will arrive
soon.
Have a good day!

People!

I dont have a VA-7 and wont buy one thats for sure. It doesnt matter how long I will play on it. It sounds great, has superb features but it cannot be used by me in Live Performance so it ends. No matter how good it sounds. It can have 8 Variations per style! Yes cool, but if you cannot click them easily it all ends.

Like I said: havent played the Solton X1 yet, so I still need to choose between X1, Korg i30 and G-1000.

Ilija

Ilija,

I have exactly the same concerns which you have stated so well in this posting. I am also concerned with the usability of an instrument on stage, and would definitely rate this as one of the three determining factors, along with the quality of sounds and styles it produces. It is sad to see that an instrument which has obviously taken Roland a lot of thought comes short on some very obvious things (which every other manufacturer provides).

However, I am reserving my judgement on the usability of VA-7 until I find out if the missing functions can be executed through MIDI. If I can, a midi pedal with 10 or so switches can be found for around $100 used. If it works, this would be a small price to pay for an instrument which excels in sounds and styles AND is easy to use on stage.

Regards,
Alex

Hi dear friends!

This is 'great fun' to see how people 'fight' to let other people see personal opinions ;-))

At the end I think (just like Danny) still the Solton X1 is the best for live perfomance. Every gig (party) we play I love the X1 even more because of its fantastic styles.

So, no change for me (Nee John !) ......

kind regards,

Roel

PS. Ilija please try the X1 first before you buy another one. (In Hengelo ligt ie wel)

Okey Dokey

[This message has been edited by claudiu (edited 11-26-2005).]

BUY THE THING NOTHING IS BETTER!!