Correct but incorrect...there are not 122 note all sounding the same....duh theres always some trying to be clever !

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Diki:
[B]Firstly, let me point out that the organ has 122 keys (two manuals). Don't try to tell me you never used the second manual...

Al ... I realize that the example you gave may have been just that, for discussion purposes ... but my technics kn6000 has "Panel Memory" buttons that allow me to set certain registrations for various songs and save them ... If I need the full kb for something, especially in the beginning of a tune I can set a Panel Memory for that, play what I need to play and then by pressing one PM button I go to whatever other 'set up' I need ... Does whatever board you are playing have something similar?
t.

Tony,

Yes the Pa2xpro has Performances which I can setup up the keyboard. But there are many other piano pieces that you can't play on 61 keys and sound right.

Al,

Have you every tried doing a Glissando using the Full fingering mode of a 61 key keyboard--it works just fine. It's just a matter of setting the fingering mode to full, which allows the full width of the keyboard to be used.

Cheers,

Gary

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Travlin' Easy

Hi,
if I was a die hard yamaha fan, just because they only have 61 keys wouldn't put me off. I was a technics user for many years, only had 61 keys also.
I use full chords & pianist mode. I also have 61, 76, & 88note keyboards ( 88 notes is my piano, to which I midi my keyboards or my laptop/omb arranger software) if I want the full piano experience haahaa. Mines only for home use so using a piano as a controller isn't a hassle.

Personally, bring back arranger modules, only they obviously weren't popular either.

best wishes
Rikki

I am left wondering what government is subsidizing Roland, Korg and Ketron (MS too), who apparently seem to be able to survive in business despite making the FATAL flaw of offering arrangers in other than 61 note sizes..?

Surely they CAN'T be making a profit?

This is what drives me crazy. The 'apologists' somehow seem to be able to ignore the fact that every other arranger manufacturer OTHER than Yamaha make a 76 as well as 61's. And I'm pretty sure that they would also be the first to say that the main reason that Yamaha's dominate the market is NOT that they don't have a 76 in their lineup. In fact, ask any number of Yamaha user why Yamaha are THEIR choice, and you will get almost as many answers. And not ONE of them will be 'because they don't make a 76'..

Sorry, but the only tunnel I see around here are loyalists defending Yamaha in denial of the facts. You've got to at least offer a reason that actually fits the facts. We all swim in the same ocean... If other companies can produce 76's without going belly up, then so can Yamaha. I KNOW you are not trying to tell us that Yamaha are to 'weak', 'timid' or 'uncaring'...

I'm a pianist but I like the Yamaha arrangers therefore I've got a 3000 with 61 keys. I'd love a 76 key version but that's life.

Nevertheless I don't see that it would cost Yamaha a huge amount to use an NP30 or DGX keybed with PSR 900 electronics; as someone has pointed out in a previous thread the Yamaha CVP "ensemble piano" range are arranger electronics with a piano.

I suppose I have to agree with the "if there was a big enough market they'd make one" theory.

Maybe what we need is a DGX 520 "pro"!

Here is the problem with the point the Yamaha apologist are making.

They say that Yamaha has “the most successful arranger keyboard on the planet”.
We can assume that they are talking about the T2.
Well, if that were the case, then there is no need for the T3.
Why mess with success. Even worst, the changes Yamaha are probably going to make with the T3 is going to be to the Sounds, Styles and he OS. Ironically, those are the selling points for the T2 and for the T2 success. So why would Yamaha take a chance and make changes to that winning formula?

Yamaha is taking a very big business risk by making changes to the Sounds, Styles and OS of the T2 and making a T3. Where as it relates to a 76 key T3, there is no risk to Yamaha because people do not buy the Tyros series for the number of keys so an extra 15 keys would not prevent them from buying. Yamaha can only gain from having a 76 key T3 because the persons who would not buy a 61 key T3 would buy a 76 key T3.

What company would not create a product that would present no or very limited risk (any new product would always have some risk) but creates a product that changes the very core of their product?

O I forgot we no the answer to that; YAMAHA.


[This message has been edited by to the genesys (edited 03-28-2008).]

Still full of holes Diki...you forgot to factor in the amount of profit...the margin...and it's a very imortant part of this situation.

The G70 and E-60 have been sales duds here in Canada...and from what I understand, they haven't been exactly jumping off the shelves elsewhere, either.

That should be warning enough.

Since you and a few others have been saying how wonderful these instruments are, the reason they aren't selling is because they have 76 keys.

OR...perhaps they aren't really all that they are cracked up to be....which is it?

You sure have a tough time grasping reality....a company does not get in a market that THEY (not you, they have much wiser marketing gurus)do not feel will bring them a decent profit.

I think you are just perpetuating this thread solely for your own amusment...you can't possibly be THAT narrow minded.

Ian

posted 03-28-2008 03:11 AM
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"Here is the problem with the point the Yamaha apologist are making.
They say that Yamaha has “the most successful arranger keyboard on the planet”.
We can assume that they are talking about the T2.
Well, if that were the case, then there is no need for the T3.
Why mess with success. Even worst, the changes Yamaha are probably going to make with the T3 is going to be to the Sounds, Styles and he OS. Ironically, those are the selling points for the T2 and for the T2 success. So why would Yamaha take a chance and make changes to that winning formula?"

Your gonna love this answer Genesys ! The motive to make the T3 is ......wait for it....Profit !!!!

Heres how the magic works. You make a keyboard , you sell it to avid loyal customers. you wait a couple of years until the sales cycle has matured and your sales are saturated i.e slowed right down to a trickle, you repackage the same keyboard with a few extra lights and switches, you sell it as an upgrade and your market ( Who largely never got to grips with the technology of the first keyboard) sell their ~"old" keyboard and buy a brand spanking new one TOTL one (Which in fact was their old keyboard dressed up a bit !

Now tell me thats not bloody genius !!!

But that just the theory. does it work in practise ?

Korg pa1x to korg pa800
Korg Pa1xpro to Korg Pa2x

Yamaha Tyros 1 to yamaha tyros 2

Roland G70 to Roland G80

Seems like this idea is catching on !!!

But are people really fooled into buying the same instrument repackaged again ? surely it cant be that simple ???? Ask some of the members on this board who have multilpe purchases of repackaged keyboards and "up graded" with virtualy no change in keyboard functionality just a few new sounds and still dont understand the instrument that they have bought...

I have probably said too much. now the secrets out we will all start making keyboards and some of the smarter ones here will clean up with a 76 key version....or will they ?

You tell me ..........

last bit

Yamaha spend thousands of punds/dollars/yen on R&D , they came up with the highly techoological advance of SA voices. Thats brilliant. They also thought about continuing to bolt on speakers to the keyvoard that to a pro user is next to useless and risks being broken if set up and broken down regularly (funny thing is it works quite well for a home user who has the instrument permanantly set up ) and for the finishing touch they shaved off some of the edges to give it that space age stealth bomber highly "technical" look whilst the inner workings of the instrument remain largely the same as the T1. But with all that RD budget blown they missed a trick didnt they . I know what you are thinking....76 KEYS !!! Its just soooo obvious !!

Please dont take offence at my heavy sarcasm. Its English humour and meant to be light hearted

[This message has been edited by Spalding 4 (edited 03-28-2008).]

[This message has been edited by Spalding 4 (edited 03-28-2008).]