I still think we will NOT see a 76 arranger from Yamaha for a different reason than the gang here is talking about.

Rivalry between divisions! That's why I never (well never is a long time)expect one.

Upper Yamaha management has made a decision.

Think about it... why not make a 76. Virtually no R&D cost and the additional $ to build it is very small. They could certainly sell quite a few and have all the bases covered. Get a few more happy customers...so Why not.

My theory makes a lot of sense, don't ya think?

It's simple to me...it's easy to do, it would be profitable...so why not do it.

Big Boys in Japan say..stay in your own court! You are home keyboard division!

Lee

Your "theory" is just that, Lee...a theory.

I'm of the belief, as are many others, that there is not enough demand for 76 keys for the arranger market...if there was, Yamaha would be making one...it's that simple.

Ian

Yamaha did take the chance on a Pro76 arranger (9000pro)...obviously it failed & they have moved on brilliantly in taking the LEAD in the arranger KB market. They KNOW what they are doing & millions will buy their arrangers in the future as always.

Same old tired, rehashed excuses...

So Yamaha rule the home market? Whoop-te-do! What none of us understand is why they don't want to rule the 'pro' market AS WELL...

Basically, if all it took would be to place the already tried and tested S900 and stick it in a box with 76 keys (and they already have those actions made), basically a trivial thing compared to completely re-designing an entirely new arranger (heck, you wouldn't even need a different assembly line ), why on earth WOULDN'T Yamaha do it..? Sure, they are now making products for the customers they currently have, and extremely successful ones, at that. But why not get the rest of the market (small as it might seem, all evidence here to the contrary!), if it could be got so simply?

I don't buy any of this... Divisional rivalry makes no sense, and leaving untouched a potential market that could be won with a minor case redesign also seems dumb. Dominating a market is a commendable practice, business-wise, but STOPPING when you only dominate 'part' of the market seems a bit contrary to accepted practice. Winner take ALL... Isn't that the mantra of capitalism? Just because Ford dominate the pickup market doesn't make them give up on sedans... or sport cars, for that matter. Even though it is a MUCH smaller market.

I guess it's a wait and see thing...Yamaha obviously does not feel the need to make a 76 note keyboard, and whatever their reasons, they feel they are the right ones.

20-25 people on a niche forum that want 76 keys, most of whom wouldn't buy a Yamaha arranger no matter how many keys it had, aren't going to jump start a company into launching a new product, especially when they are already making one that satisfies the vast majority of users...including many pros.

It's not going to be "build it and they will come"....it's going to be more like "show the need, and they will make it".

Ian

Ian,
Yes, of course it's only a theory... but a darn good one. The arranger has grown up!
It's not that little toy cheesy sounding thing of the past! It's now a wonderful great sounding instrument with many PRO features and sounds. Some of the sounds are better than the synths(Motif).

Like Diki said, it would be trivial to build one so why not?

Divisional rivalry makes no sense, you kidding, I worked for a very large company, IBM... you bet it goes on every day.

At IBM, I attended many meeting where we talked about product/marketing etc involving our customers and we treated the 'other' division like competitors! Both divisions had products that could basically solve the customers problems. We each had our own sales quotas and pot of money.

Example: The motif can now do styles as such. Not the same as we do with T2, but it is styles (phrases). I heard it demoed last weekend at Sweetwater Gearfest. Sounded a lot like styles to me. Why would PRO synth players want that? The line is getting closer and closer between arrangers and synths (workstations)

Lee

Perhaps you guys do have a point, Lee, but gearing up for any new product is not as easy as you guys assume.

I still believe it's not going to be "build it and they will come"....it's going to be more like "show the need, and they will make it".

That's my theory, and I'm stickin' to it!

Lee, I've pointed out many times that, if the divisional rivalry theory was correct, the WS MotifXS line would NEVER have got the SA technology. The arranger division invented it, were the first to implement it, and if divisional rivalry would stop the arranger division from making a 76, it would stop the WS division from acquiring SA technology.

Roland do NOT stop making a 76 arranger, simply because there is a KR-series 88 note piano/arranger. They are utterly different products (as a 76 S900 would be compared to a CVP) and do not directly compete, price-wise OR feature-wise. Same with Korg. ONLY Yamaha have this hole in their market line, and I do NOT believe it is anything to do with divisional rivalry.

Personally, I think it is laziness, and complacency. "We're #1. Why try harder?"

Mind you, that's what Roland USED to say....

I've been lurking here lately reading the posts about tyros3 as I will probably buy one. It feels like a time warp and I'm reading the same posts right before tyros2 came out. Same wishes and complaints, and a few attempts to trash a board before it even gets out. I've been buying arranger keyboards, mostly yamahas, for 30 years and nobody has ever polled me. I have always liked 61 key boards and DO know what I am missing not haning 76 keys. I wouldn't like any board any longer than 61 keys. I AM that home user that yamaha caters to................ -charley

Yes, Charley, you are Yamaha's target user...the home player, but many pros have discovered the delights and advantages of using Yamaha arrangers in their work and play.

61 keys have always been fine for me too.

Ian