Well, why don't you do something about this? Seems pretty dumb to me to have what you claim is the cutting edge hardware, and just leave it at that. You are already probably pretty aware that the majority of the market is FAR more concerned about the styles and sounds than they are the architecture. Why not give them what they want? (Oh, the horror! )

Or is developing hundreds of thousands of lines of code easier (and more fun) than making great styles?

Enjoy what you are smoking...

Diki . The problem is making the styles is the one bit of the process that requires more than just writing technical lines of programming . This element requires musical skill , great ears and feel and takes time and money and ooooodles of talent. Money because no one musician can make great drum patterns, guitar pattens sax riffs, etc. And to get world class styles you will have to hire world class musicians , studio technicians , sound engineers etc.Yyhis does not come cheap and Dom understands this perfectly which is why he does not try to compete with yamaha, korg etc on styles. Its clear that Liontracs simply does not have deep enough pockets to compete on this front . But they have computer based skills and the hard ware bought at trade prices is relatively cheap. So Lion tracs is stuck really. All they can do is use converted styles and mess them together as best they can and add another technical feature that hopefully someone with both nusical and technical ability might some day find useful.

And still the question goes unanswered (ignored?)

sorry double post

[This message has been edited by spalding (edited 07-04-2008).]

Diki:

You come across as a really unfriendly guy. What's going on? Do you have hemorrhoids or something?

Why diss Bill's board? I mean I get your argument that you are better off financially upgrading and selling your Roland/Yamaha/Korg than buying a Wersi, but there's no reason to be insulting people and their equipment.

I think that Wersis sound incredible. Doesn't mean I can afford one or that I think that they are worth their value. If I were incredibly rich, I would buy one.

I just don't get the gratuitous insults.

Beakybird

Probably because of "mine is better than yours" got 'em going again.

As far as straying from the 800, NO WAY. Loving it more each passing day.

Sorry, guys, gigging like crazy...

Donny, sorry, got an NDA for right now. You won't have heard of any of these guys, anyway. It's all emo and hard alternative, stuff you would never in your life actually listen to!...

And for the amateur doctors out there... C'mon guys! What's so sacrosanct about Wersi? Just because it's twice as expensive as anything else out there gives it a free pass? Somehow, we can manage to be brutally honest in our opinions of Roland's, Korg's and Yamaha's, but it's hands off of Wersi? PLEASE...!

I've listened to most of the stuff posted here done on Wersi... OK, maybe it's NOT the arranger. Maybe it's just that the only people that buy these things have a soft spot for old theater organ styles, who knows? But if you can't hear the Blackpool organ roots of much of this, that's not my problem...

But what gets up my nose (well, you can pick your orifice of choice, Beaky) is the constant litany of 'get a Wersi, you cheap sons of guns, and all your problems will go away' (as if the future is already here), despite the lack of any evidence that it will...

Wersi's are twice as expensive, nearly twice as heavy (WHAT? only Roland gets a lambasting for weight?) but, to my ears, nowhere near twice as good as any TOTL closed arranger. Once again, MAYBE it's just the players...

And on a final note, I have a warning... I am getting rather fed up of being personally insulted on this forum by people I have NOT been personally rude to. Look at this thread, there is not the slightest insult to anyone, only my opinion about their arranger. Completely objective, nothing personal at all.

Then firstly, Bill comes in with his '7. Stop thinking everything revolves around Florida beach music and sounds, because it doesn’t, it’s just a very small part in a very big ocean.' Now, I don't know about you, but you see any reference to Florida beach music anywhere? Personal reference #1 And now Beaky's hemorrhoid reference. Look guys, all I ever talk sh*t around here is arrangers. That's what the forum is about. Positive AND negative impressions about arrangers. No-one wants to talk about MUSIC, for Pete's sake, no-one definitely wants to post any music (heck, that's not why we bought an arranger, is it? We just bought them for the specs ). No-one wants to talk about technique, arranging, medley construction, audience techniques, etc.. NOOOO.... all we want to do is blather endlessly about our precious bloody hardware.

Well, OK, then. That's what I'm doing.... But I'm talking smack about your bloody arrangers, NOT you personally. Just lately, I've been getting some pretty personal retorts to comments about arrangers. Just WTF is your problem? It's a bloody keyboard, not your grandkids. Why get so personal in defense of it..? Let's try to keep this forum on the polite tip, if we can. But I am warning you.... I get any more of this personal insults for comments made about an arranger, I'm coming back at YOU personally, OK?

If you think this kind of gutter comment is reasonable, expect to see it returned, in the future. You have been warned

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 07-05-2008).]

Once again you have completely missed or misinterpreted the points made.
As to insults, then apart from a few opinions about the way you have answered certain posts, there have been none. (Don’t keep assuming that because somebody disagrees with you, it’s a personal attack, because it isn’t)
Anyway I think it’s about time we let this thread return to its original reason.
Regards

Bill

So, is it alright to comment about YOUR hemorrhoids, Bill?

Anyone is as free to disagree with my comments as I feel to disagree with theirs. But start to get personal (which I don't believe I do) and it goes beyond a discussion. I don't mind any disagreement with my comments, and I feel others should probably feel the same. But why the personal stuff?

Is it simply too hard to stay focused on the topic, that you have to bring personal comments in in lieu of opinion? I haven't said ONE bad thing about you personally, Bill. You still haven't explained what the hell that 'Florida beach music' comment was supposed to be about. My playlist is music from the sixties thorough contemporary stuff, with an emphasis on acoustic guitar. Beatles (is that Florida beach music?), Eagles (no Florida connection there), Elton John (you are kidding? ), Stealer's Wheel (got some suntan lotion?)... Sure, I do a bit of Buffett (plenty in the interior do him!) and some reggae (no shortage of fans away from the beach, there), but primarily, what my duo does is general music from the sixties, seventies, and beyond.

Mind you, yes, it's possible that I don't play any theater organ medleys, but on the other hand, I want to stay working!

I have made NO comments about YOUR music, Bill (as I don't believe I have ever heard any. Have you posted anything yourself, at all?), merely commented on the web examples of Wersi's I have heard. Sure, not ALL of them sound like they are Blackpool Tower pieces, but let's face it, an awful lot ARE. The Wersi touts all the long wave theater organ ROM as a 'feature', and it is definitely marketed at, and demoed to theater organ aficionados. Now, there's nothing wrong with that, I've seen Reginald Dixon a couple of times, myself, back in the sixties. But it wasn't even contemporary music back then, and it has gotten less popular since those days (despite what it's fans would have you think). Can you name ONE theater organ tune that has made the charts in the last thirty years (or longer)? Techno and rave styles...? None of that crowd are using Wersi's to chart, that's for sure... Virus's, sure. But name a techno smash that was recorded on a Wersi... Europe may indeed have a vibrant techno scene, but it isn't being fueled by arrangers

But hey, maybe by 'Florida beach music' you simply meant 'everything BUT theater organ music'... Who knows..? Perhaps I AM a little sensitive (Feel free to insert WHERE )

Anyway... Yes, I feel free here to comment about arrangers, music (rarer!), anything of that nature. You want to get worked up about it, and come at me personally (this is mostly to Beaky and a few other that have been less that impersonal in the last couple of weeks, Bill), bring it on! I thought we had gotten over that gutter trash talk quite a while back, but if you want to start it again, have at it! I can probably hang in there with it if I HAVE to, but, to be honest, I'd rather keep things polite around here. And by POLITE, I mean nothing personal. But if you chose to regard a comment about an arranger as a PERSONAL attack, well, first of all, you need therapy and secondly, you need to get a life!

It's a TOOL, for playing music on (you know, the thing we hate to talk about, here!), not your johnson (or backside), and negative comments about it are directed at the arranger, NOT YOU. Jeez, guys. I have heard almost every negative thing that is possible to be said about my G70. Have I EVER made a comment as personal as



This just, to me, sounds like someone is incredibly confused about the difference between a comment about an arranger (what we are here for) and a comment about a PERSON... (and a strange hybrid love/hate comment, to boot... he SORT of agrees with me on some of the points, but apparently hates that I voiced them! )

If a negative comment about an arranger is an insult, should I not be the most insulted member here..? G70 gets very little respect here, not that I give a damn. I don't feel personally insulted by any of the comments about it (not that I have to agree with them, but it's not personal), and I certainly don't feel like throwing gutter comments at the poster. I can usually reason my way through a rebuttal. But hey! If this is the best you can come up with, my condolences.

So, it's up to you. You REALLY want to start the trash talk thing again, or can we just get back to talking about arrangers?

BTW, to return a little to the Wersi upgrade discussion (if you could call it that!), here is a price list of some of the upgrades to Wersi's, to bring them up to contemporary specs.
http://tinyurl.com/5vzpyz

This certainly doesn't look like the trivial few pennies we are led to believe...

(Was this too personal for anyone? )