Wow! That really is a blast from the past..

Those drums are unmistakably from a Yamaha totl arranger. The Tyros was a slight bump up in quality in my opinion and the T2 a slight bump more up in quality. >> If the T3 drums sound anything like the 9000PRO, T1, or T2 drums Yamaha can forget about referring to the T3 drums as "new". They may as well call them "re-hashed" instead.

Notice in the Clarinet demo the background Brush/Jazz Drum Kit. It seems Yamaha attempted to keep them way in the background at a lower than normal volume. But what I did hear of them was very similar sounding to the T1/T2 Brush/Jazz Drum kit in my opinion. Which is a bad sign, right off the bat, to their claim of all "new" Drums on the T3 in my opinion.

Let's face it, Yamaha's T3 gold mine is NOT America, Canada or even Asia, for that matter. Yamaha's T3 gold mine is in Europe plain and simple. And if our friends over the pond aren't too particular or judgemental in how they perceive a $4,500 keyboard's Drum Kits are suppose to sound (as far as quality goes), then Yamaha evidently will see no pressing need to put in stellar sounding Drum Kits in their new Flagship arranger - the innocuous T3. Innocuous, it seems, to the Europeans anyway.

But again, if they do rake in the dough with the T3 over in Europe, they will most likely have satisfied their 'status quo' in projected T3 sales, and apparently could care less how Americans, Canadians, or Asians feel towards the T3's less than stellar (in other words - not up to professional standard) Drum Kits sound like, if indeed, they turn out to be average - again. In other words, as long as they can please the majority of Europeans they will see themselves in Fat City with no real worries to speak of. >> I could have said: Americans, Canadians, and Asians be damned; but that would have been a little harsh, although, may very well be Yamaha's corporate perception of the situation. Hopefully not, for our sakes, right? And instead, we will find out that the T3 drums are indeed a big improvement over the T1/T2 drums. Time will tell all as they say.

We shall see, or rather "hear" for ourselves soon enough, I reckon. >> That is, if Yamaha gets with it and produces a demo or two that showcases some of the T3's Drum Kits. Again, we shall see what Yamaha will unfold in the next month or two or three as far as sound demos go... I'm not gonna hold my breath waiting in anticipation though. It's off my short list no matter what.

Yamaha's loss my gain I suppose. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/wink.gif[/img]

Best,
Mike


[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 08-17-2008).]

I don't think I've heard anything from an authoritative source that ever claimed the T3's drums were ALL new (your local dealer probably knows less than you do, for all his spouting off!).

No doubt SOME drums will change. A few new kits, at best. Hopefully, punchier and more dynamic. But expecting a wholesale change is sheer lunacy! That's what the Yamaha lovers LIKE (or they wouldn't have bought one!), and Yamaha aren't THAT stupid to completely change everything.

Sad thing is, Yamaha only have to change the sampler to something that could read Akai sample format, and you could have your fill of great sounding drums. But while it remains a closed format, and Yamaha do next to nothing to address the lack of available content for the format they have all to themselves, they lose customers to keyboards with punchier sounds.

I'm starting to question just how smart those guys actually are... First, the 76 phobia, and now the 'closed' sampler. It's almost as if they are saying 'Go away, all you pros! We don't want your money, it's much easier ripping off 'home' players'

Actually Mike the Tyros 2 sells better and more in the Asian market, then in Europe.

Bill

Very interesting Bill. I thought for sure Europe was the biggest market for high-end Yamaha arrangers. Could you provide some statistics that show Yamaha sells more totl arrangers in Asia than in Europe Bill? I always heard that Europe was Yamaha's gold mine when it comes to the likes of the T1/T2/T3, etc.

Here are all the countries contained in Asia:

Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Bhutan, Brunei, Burma (Myanmar), Cambodia, China, Georgia, Hong Kong, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Israel, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, North Korea, South Korea, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Laos, Lebanon, Malaysia, Maldives, Mongolia, Nepal, Oman, Pakistan, Philippines, Qatar, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Sri Lanka, Syria, Taiwan, Tajikistan, Thailand, Turkey, Turkmenistan, United Arab Emirates, Uzbekistan, Vietnam, Yemen.

I would think only a handful would be interested in something like a Tyros3 but I could be wrong Bill. It would seem to me that most of those countries would relish a Korg over a Yamaha any day of the week because of Korg's propensity to include a wide range of Asian type sounds and the ability of Korg's arrangers to change tuning scales to those preferred and listened to in that part of the world. OTOH, Europe would tend to use many of the traditional tuning scales and/or traditional sounds in my opinion, and therefore the T3 would be more highly coveted in Europe. I realize that Yamaha probably sells a lot of T3's to their own Japanese people but is it the same T3 model with the same name that Yamaha ships over here to North America and to Europe? Would Yamaha still call it a Tyros3 for the ones they sell in Japan?? I tend to think it would have a special name or branding but (if they actually did sell it under a different name in Japan) it would be considered the same basic instrument I suppose with the same basic innards. But I digress...

So you say they sell more in Asia huh?

Statistics or some kind of proof to back up that statement would sure help in solving this puzzle if there are some stats available Bill. Thanks.

Best,
Mike

Hi Mike
Yamaha music education is massive in a lot of Asian countries (They teach from very young) on all sorts of Yamaha instruments including keyboards and Electones. (Yes they are still made, and like the keyboards they sell them by the truck load)

Another point to note is that in all the keyboard music completions around the world, most are dominated by Asian players.

Type Yamaha Music followed by the country (Not all countries are represented) into Google to see what’s out there. (This includes the Yamaha keyboards which replace a lot of the Western styles with Asian styles)

You think Yamaha is big in music, but you don’t realise just how big until you look all around the world. (Roland and Korg are just cottage industries in comparison)

Hope this helps in your quest.

Bill

I would still be interested in the stats on the TOTL arrangers. Let's face it, these things are voiced for Europe, in fact, YamahaUK have a strong part in styling and voicing them (remember Andy [The Insider], one of the main demo guys for it is from UK), and the ROM styles have barely a trace of Asian influence.

When Yamaha DO voice an arranger for the Asian market, they release a special model (S700-OR e.g.), so that definitely seems to indicate the Tyros is firmly and squarely aimed at the European market (and a rag thrown to us poor US players!). There CERTAINLY isn't a T2-OR, now is there...?

Just because Yamaha are strong in the music education field does not in any way equate to arranger sales in a demographic where they don't actually produce a keyboard for that area's music...

Actually Diki the reason Yamaha music is so big and Brand loyalty is so great, is because of the Yamaha music education system.
If you remember in the 70s Yamaha were a joke in the music industry both here (Europe) and in the US, however when they introduced their music schools, parents started buying Yamaha’s to match what their kids were learning on in the schools, then of course they moved onto the parents, showing them that they as well as their kids could learn to play, which meant even bigger model sales.
All this culminated in the 80s when the sales of Yamaha instruments was such that most of the competition from Europe and the US was wiped out, leaving only the really big companies, (Like Lowery) and small premium niche market manufactures (Like Wersi) still in business.
Only Technics offered any real competition. (And that was because they introduced the Technics Music Academy)
The tactic was not new, as Yamaha had already done this successfully in the Asian markets.
Whether you like Yamaha or not, their marketing, sales and brand loyalty is unmatched by any other, no matter where in the world you go.

Bill

Sorry, Bill, but Yamaha were no joke in the industry, at least not the pro one! Maybe in the organ community..?

Ever heard of the CS-80? Ever heard of the CP-70?

Yeah, I know... Jokes

I agree with you, Bill. I still think the VIMA concept is gonna creep into arrangers soon. Not that I'm thrilled or supporting the idea, it's just that the concept is still alive in the Roland camp. Besides, almost everyone is adding mp3, wav and other play features to their arrangers now.

If you look at the VIMA concept, other than the karaoke features, it's OS is almost identical to a current Roland arranger...

There are no multipads, there is no sampler, there is the same number of intros, endings, variations and fills, the voices sound the same... It's a great big yawn.

I have simply no idea why this concept doesn't just bring a laugh to us all here... It's just a revamped KR series, with some karaoke bells and whistles. BTW, it isn't exactly setting the market on fire, either, so only a suicidal Roland would take this as a vision of the future (wouldn't put it past them, though... they do seem to be trying hard to play Russian Roulette with six bullets )

Only a home organ player could love this boondoggle, and I have a feeling it's because they seem to prize furniture over musical instruments It's big enough, for sure!

The karaoke stuff, or at least, MP3 players, have ALREADY been integrated into current Roland arranger OS... V2 for the E80 adds this feature almost for free. It doesn't require a wholesale shift in function, even if it is early days and could use several improvements (tempo and pitch change, for sure!).