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#247485 - 11/09/08 01:07 AM Re: Wow - check out these demos
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
You can have a look at the available Ketron disks on the Ketron Italy website (link below). They don't have, however, sampled grooves but just midi sequences, usually based on popular songs.

Ketron website
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Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#247486 - 11/09/08 01:37 AM Re: Wow - check out these demos
chony Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/10/04
Posts: 1247
Loc: New York
Rikki --

I though you were on the Pa2x? You changed - or you have both? And which do you prefer? For what reasons?

LOL. Lots of questions...

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#247487 - 11/09/08 05:02 PM Re: Wow - check out these demos
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi Chony,
I've had my SD1+ for 3 years, PSR1500 for 2 years & my PA800 is now 1 year old.
If I had to make a choice & keep only the one, it would be the PA800.
Only reason , my hobby (obsession)for many years has been working out how the style creation functions work on different types of keyboards. Not that MY styles are actually any good (haahaa) .
Unfortunately creating a good style requires musical ability as well as knowing which functions & buttons to press.
Unfortunately I lucked out on the musical side.

Currently for me the Korg has the best style creation/editing functions out of the 3 keyboards I currently own. Haven't owned a Roland in the last 5 years, so can't make a comparison.

Some of the sounds (to my ears ) are definately better on the SD1+ than on my PA800. The "live drums" & the ability to incorporate a wav drum audio loop into a style is what drew me to the sd1+ in the first place. A function I'd never come across before in any other of my keyboards.
I'd luv an explantion on what Live Drums actually are??
I came up with this theory after I played around with the Groove function on the PA800. I tend to think a Live Drum is a rom based, sliced , audio loop ie you have your audio component ( drum loop) & your midi component (style track). Because of the midi side of things you can actually use the same Live Drum set & create different drum patterns based on the one Live Drum set.

Also, SD1+ uses 2 drum tracks, a "Live Drum " track as well as a normal midi drum track. The midi drum track also helps vary the drum patterns in a style.
Unfortunately the wav drum loop files loaded by users don't work the same way. The drum loop will time stretch so it can be used at different tempo's, but, it will only play back as is.

On the other hand, don't know if you've actually used the "groove" function in your PA2X? the Korg actually time slices a drum wav loop, so you end up with your audio & midi data. Depending on the loop you've used, you can manipulate the midi data & come up with slightly different drum patterns based on a single loop.
My PA800 is limited to 64 mb's, wheras the PA2X can be upgraded to to 256mb's. I've had to keep my loops down to a minimum. I've created a few brush swish grooves, mainly because they sound better than midi brush swishes. Also I share any styles I create,& trying to share audio can cause hassles.

best wishes
Rikki

best wishes
Quote:
Originally posted by chony:
Rikki --

I though you were on the Pa2x? You changed - or you have both? And which do you prefer? For what reasons?

LOL. Lots of questions...
_________________________
best wishes
Rikki 🧸

Korg PA5X 88 note
SX900
Band in a Box 2022

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#247488 - 11/09/08 05:18 PM Re: Wow - check out these demos
Kingfrog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 1099
Loc: Myrtle beach SC
You can do the same thing with a Laptop and a Korg Roland or Tyros. Except you have complete and total control over the looped samples and all elements thereof.

The SW out there to create voices is amazing and if you are going to go that route you would spend far less and have much more use from a Notebook, some great Software and any Arranger.
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Yamaha Tyros 4
Yamaha Motif XS8
Roland RD700
Casio PX-330
Martin DC Aura
Breedlove ATlas Solo
Bose MOD II PA

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#247489 - 11/09/08 05:20 PM Re: Wow - check out these demos
Kingfrog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 1099
Loc: Myrtle beach SC
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
Here we are, banging into the wall that is 'live loops'...

You see, they are just that... loops. So forget about editing them, forget about creating your own rhythms from them, forget about importing styles from other arrangers and having them access the same kits, forget playing SMF's and have them access the same kits, etc., etc..

They are what they are, and that's all they are (or ever will be). But hey, they sound GREAT...!

Trouble is, of course, once you get used to 'great', you want 'great' all the time... and the loops are not infinite. There's only a limited number, and then you are on your own. Importing your own, slicing and dicing, matching fills to grooves, matching volumes and EQ's, these are all very complex tasks (it ain't like Acid or Garage Band!).

AFAIK, Ketron NEVER added one more 'live loop' style after they released the SD-1, so you better be content with what you got. Anybody, with skill and patience can sit at home and edit an existing style into something quite different and unique. We are all used to editing MIDI styles... move a kick here, a snare there, change the 'swing' value, etc., etc., soon you have a totally different groove.

But loops can't do that. As I have said many times, I would MUCH prefer the ROM space taken by loops (it's considerable) just given over to MUCH better multi-velocity drumkits recorded in a room (which is what makes the 'live loop' stuff sound so real, anyway), like EZ Drummer, BFD, etc, and just have great drummers play the drum pads to program it...

At least THAT way, you will still be hard pressed to tell it's not a 'live loop', but you get back the ability to edit, change kits (can't turn a brushed loop into a sticked loop), change the groove, change drum sounds WITHIN the kit, etc..

All things we take for granted, now...


I agree.If you are going to use prerecorded loops get a notebook and have complete and total control of your voices.
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros 4
Yamaha Motif XS8
Roland RD700
Casio PX-330
Martin DC Aura
Breedlove ATlas Solo
Bose MOD II PA

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#247490 - 11/09/08 06:38 PM Re: Wow - check out these demos
Diki Online   content


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14269
Loc: NW Florida
Dan, would you chime back in and clear up whether those 'Sound and Style' disks you pointed me to are actually new loops, or are they simply styles that use existing loops already in the SD-1...?
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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