AJ / Ketron

don't mean to double post but the Ketron forum seems to be in hibernation :-)

question:
when we buy the AUDYA,
is what we hear what we get as far as sounds?

is sound expansion, sound upgrades an option?

and how would this work? via chips?

since styles will seem to be created by users and Ketron, i was just wondering on sounds,

hoping to see AUDYA with tons of "modern" sounds

having the AUDYA expandable with lots of new Styles and Sounds will make this the ULTIMATE ARRANGER, at least for me...

Not to be a spoilsport, but....I am very leery about buying high-end, new-technology, gear from a relatively small company. I came close to being involved in that scenario with the Mediastation. Luckily (for me), Dom never responded to my email request for the proper purchasing procedure. Although Ketron is fairly well established, it's certainly not in the same league with the 'big three' in terms of R&D, bug-fixes, OS enhancement, style development, timely repair and tech support.

At the likely price-point, the initial sales volume is likely to be very low. Low sales = low profits = low motivation to do any of the above. I'll start thinking about an expansion card once I see the first bug-free production model.

It's a great concept; they should sell it to Korg or Roland for production development (that way, Roland could sell you an expansion card for it for $1000 a pop).

chas

I agree with Chas lets wait till its released and Player tested before we all jump to conclusions & dreams. Sometimes you wake up & realize that's all it ever was....

Chas..when you have contacted me??
I never get one email from you ( or maybe you wrote me under a diferent names?)
I have problems with my spam filter..every day will spam about 700-1000 emails...
try to contact me under my web site.

Anyway, Qranger now is reported as the COOL QT application from one bigger worldwide software manufacture: http://trolltech.com/images/customers/coolapps/Qrangersampler.jpg/view

I know that we don't have now ready cool audio styles but soon someone here from SZ will shown you some amazing with the MS styles.

ROM groove samples is not the right way for the ultimate arranger.
we are a small company for sure, but I'm really motivated for create new software and hardware technology.
Need time, but we are anyway more fast than any other musical brand company...remember that I dont make only the Mediastation.

Dom, I did try to reach you (twice) through the email portal on the Promo site. I thought, at the time, that this was a good deal for what appears to be a very good keybed with excellent controller capabilities, expecially as it's own VST/VSTI host. I still think so (at the Promo price). My purchase inquiry included a request for a shipping estimate. I am still interested, although to a somewhat lesser degree since the latest production delay (what is the current delivery schedule?).

I still think that the 'open-end' approach is the way of the future but like most of us, can't afford to finance the development effort. I am personally less concerned about the style quality although I agree with Diki that that (styles) is what will 'make it or break it' commercially. At the moment, I have just purchased a new Roland Fantom G7 with which I am somewhat underwhelmed. Frankly, I think the technology that you employ is probably considerably ahead of the Fantom but what can I say, it's a Roland. They not only have the resourses to finish a mostly-finished product, but they had the market savvy to 'snapshot' it's development at a commercially viable stage (ie. good enough for the early-buying suckers such as myself).

Keep us informed. I'm sure even the most strident naysayers will admit that the MS has promise. Good luck.

chas

I think you're under rating Ketron a bit. The company has been around for over 20 years, maybe closer to 30. Ketron has been more involved making arrangers than synths. They are called Ketron Labs but marketed by Solton a few years ago, they've since dropped the name Solton. Ketron were the ones to really stepped up the game for other arranger companies. The were the first arranger to release keyboards with the live drums concept and there whole concept of grooves started over ten years ago. The company saying is "The Best Natural Sounds" and up until the pa2x's & tyros 2 etc. There sounds were as natural as they can be. I can only believe that the Auyda will be one of their best arrangers ever. They have not disappointed as of yet in sounds and styles, but they did lack in other areas like usb, mp3 player, etc. There not as big as the big three, but I've never had problems with repairs, os updates are fairly current and they knocked the socks off the big three a few times in the past. I would would not have any problems buying a ketron over a Korg, Roland or Yamaha, thats what they do, arrangers....

[This message has been edited by mc (edited 12-10-2008).]

still waiting for a simple answer to my simple question:

will the AUDYA have sound expansion capabilities?
or what you hear is what you'll get?

thanks Ketron (AJ) or whomever knows....

Yes Ketron is a smaller company but it is an established smaller company. Dom's seems to be a startup. That is a big difference. Many of us have used Ketron for years and have been very satisfied. The Audya will be terrific.

Tom

I know this has been talked about before but it has been quite a while.

Just how many sounds does one need? Why is sound expansion needed by anyone? How many different pianos do you need?

In the past most performing musicians on this forum came to the conclusion that a performer really only needs about 20 GOOD voices.

Practice, develop your chops, learn to play a sax like a sax player would, not a keyboard player trying to sound like a sax.

If you can do this with 20 GOOD voices you won't need anything else.

I think the point is fairly moot anyway because most voices can be edited.

Tom

Whoah!

Chas can you expand on your Fantom comment (off-topic or not). I recently saw one in the flesh and had a (quick) play on that wonderful keybed, and saw just the other day some Youtube promo videos that quite frankly blew me utterly away!

What's wrong with the Fantom??????

Tom,
YES...you are right on...give me a few absolutely great voice...WITHOUT quality issues and I would be happy. Of course I am talking about the bread & butter voices, we still need all those others for various times, but the bread and butter ones need to be near PERFECT...Yes, It can be done, audition a Kurzweil PC3...you will hear quality sounds. The reason we seem to want expansion is because the manufacturer's miss the mark on those quality sounds. Of course it's subjective... You know what I'm saying.

The software synth sounds available are remarkable! It can be done in our arrangers too. MEMORY IS CHEAP! When will they wake up to that.

Of course we can add the soft synth to our arranger...maybe that's the answer? But then we have a PC to deal with all the time.

Lee

Lee,

A quality sax voice played like a piano will still suck. A middle of the road sax voice played like a sax player would play it will sound great.

Tom

it's not how many sounds one needs,

it's the type of music one plays

if i need my AUDYA to play lots of cutting edge dance, techno, pop tracks, i don't think the AUDYA will cut it

now if we have a "modern" sound expansion which has 808, 909, in-your-face bass, raw techno-ish sounds, then that would be awesome

if we have a middle-eastern sound board then those needing those sounds would have them

if we had a latin board with tons of great brass, percussion, etc. you get the picture,

i just feel that Ketron has the Best bread-and-butter sounds, now we need expansion options,

i mean, why wouldn't you want perhaps a better sax, better organ, better accordion, super articulated voices down the line,

you wanna play the same sounds for the rest of your life?

breath some new sound into your repertoire,

having new sounds is like getting a new keyboard at a fraction of the cost...

no, 20 great sounds does not cut it for me..
maybe you guys use a dozen sounds, not me.

that's why i hate seeing other bands, duos , trios play,
they swap between 3 or 4 sounds the entire night

how about exploring your keyboard?
use different sounds.
stop being lazy and playing same stuff with same sounds,

yes we want expansion board, we want more sounds, we want better sounds...

do not limit the keyboard,

if we could have thousands of styles to choose from, let's have 1,000's of sounds to choose from

if the AUDYA is gonna be the ULTIMATE arranger,
then it better have the ULTIMATE, cutting edge sounds for ALL types of music... not for the type YOU play, but the type EVERYONE else may play

thats my .02 cents

Tom,
OK, I give...how do you pay a sax like sax should be played...on a keyboard?
Lee

Wrong? Probably nothing. Mostly, I just find it uninspiring. It could be that for my needs, all the nice 'workstation' features are wasted on me. I find the 'bread and butter' sounds no better than my SonicCell, the GM2 sounds the SAME as the SonicCell, the keybed no better (if as good) as my ancient A70, RAM expansion uses hard-to-find last generation memory, pianos that are average (hundreds of pianos but none I'd classify as excellent), at best, organs that are sub-par, drums that, in my opinion, are not as authentic-sounding as those on my PA1x (again, lots of kits but I tend to stick to standard or jazz kits), need mouse for easy and quick navigation, no touch screen (I, for one, love them), poor navigation for live performance unless meticulously set up ahead of time (probably like most true WS's, too complicated for life performance), LOUSY implementation of USB drive for storage and transfer, computer is a must for full utilization, long learning curve, no direct HD support, did I mention 'uninspiring' sounds.....the basic patches (single mode) are, ummmmm, basic. Of course, layering is dead easy and sampling is fairly well implemented if you're already pretty familiar with sampling technique.

I haven't touched this thing for a week and it's fairly new; that tells me a lot about how I feel about it. Sadly, I'm not inspired enough to want to learn it in-depth, which, no doubt, would lead to a much greater appreciation for the instrument. It's probably a great board for producing Hip-Hop, Rap, funk, maybe even Rock. For jazz, latin, etc., there are probably better choices. I go back and play some of the multi's on my ancient Triton Classic (w/Moss) and it blows the Fantom away (especially El. Pianos) in terms of 'Phatness' (balls, if you will).

Of course, this is just my opinion. I probably haven't given this beast a proper shot. You know how it is; some keyboards you just like, others just leave you cold. I didn't return it 'cause I tend to be a packrat, but I probably should have. It doesn't help that I'm not sure what I'm looking for (Nord Stage, maybe?) but when I go into my 'studio' just to relax, I always reach for my Nord C1 first (and usually stay there). Also, I have consistently refused to add other voices for gigs (maybe I just want to keep it pure). Maybe I only like Organ and piano, maybe I'm stuck in the past, maybe I'm nuts (my wife votes for number three). Who knows.

chas

Lee,

You have to think like a sax player. If anyone has heard Don Mason play the "guitar" on his keyboard you would know what I mean. He plays it and thinks like a guitar player.

Tom

Hi everyone,

Allow me to chime in here - I've just finished listening to the demos. Wow!!! Wow!!! Wow!!!

They make all other demos of any kind that I have obsolute. I'm a BIG Yamaha fan, but their sounds and effects come nowhere even close to what is presented in this demo.

If this was a true arranger keyboard, I would have dropped all my Yamaha aspirations in favour of it.

Unfortunately, I'm just an average arranger keyboard player and as such a synth would not mean a lot to me.

But, as for Ketron - I want to compliment them. Any company that could create something like this is in a league of their own and do not need to present excuses for being small. Well done Ketron!!!

Henni

Hi all,

I've search the net for more info on the Audya - it seems to be able to function as a true arranger as well:
http://ketronmusic.co.uk/products/ketronAudya.html

Do yourself a favour - listen to the live guitar demos and the new age style. This thing is currently really blowing my mind!!! Price = 3800 pounds.

I know where my next money for a new keyboard is going. I'll always love and have a Yamaha in my life (Yes, if I can afford also a Tyros 3), but as for this thing; I just HAVE!!! to have one.


Henni

3,800.00 GBP = 5,708.31 US
U K Pounds United States Dollars

WOW,

way too expensive,

it's gotta be under $4,000 US for me to consider

Chas! Take it back!! If you're not happy with your Fantom G7 then return it! It's been less than 30 days right? If you're firm with them they will most likely not charge you a re-stocking fee either. I highly recommend if you're not happy with it to take it back and get you're money back. Guitar Center has a NO QUESTIONS ASKED 30 day return policy. Take advantage of it! And then get something that will make you happy... >> I agree with you that the Jazz kits on the FG aren't spectacular. And 75 acoustic pianos are wayyyyyy to many. With that many you would think there would be at least one or two that would be superb huh? Tweaking them can really help immensely though. If you're up to tweaking them that is. I know a lot of people don't want to tweak anything, they just want to play. But that goes contrary to the true nature of what a "work"station is really meant to be I suppose.

Best, Mike

Dont forget to add the cost of a good case

Yeah, I should. But I feel like I haven't really given it a fair shot. Very curious as to how you feel about yours. Happy? What was the intended usage when you got it. Does it fullfil that need? Have you learned it in-depth? What do you see as it's greatest weakness? Would you purchase it again?

chas

Reading the specs there doesnt seem to be a sequencer on the Audya. Is that correct ? and are any of the demos that feature on the website actual styles at all or just sequenced songs ?



[This message has been edited by spalding (edited 12-12-2008).]

I've got to say, chas, I have sat down and spent probably a couple of hours on the FantomG8 so far. It isn't calling out to me, going "Buy me, buy me!" yet

Very little is, to be honest. Nord Stage, perhaps. Nord Electro3, possibly. Right now, there's nothing but incremental change in the products, nothing groundbreaking, and FAR too many of the WS's are trying to incorporate multitrack audio recorders and sequencers that are pale shadows of a good computer system. Such a waste. That's why I like Nord so much. No sequencers, no audio recorders. Just great, authentic sound.

Take back the FantomG, and take a look at software. Get a dedicated computer JUST for VSTi's... Take a look at Omnisphere, BFD, Trilogy, Ivory and others. You want the best sounds possible? You want the same stuff the pro's are using? Most of them (even some live!) are using VSTi's right now. You won't be gigging out with this stuff, so portability is not a factor. You seem happy enough just with the C1!

Stop looking for a 'one keyboard to rule them all' solution, and get down with the specialist stuff...

Just my opinion....

...which I value. In fact, 'though I should be depressed, I'm actually kinda happy (in a perverse way) to hear someone (whose opinion I value) confirm (affirm?) my feeling about it. I gotta go check the receipt date. If I do take it back, I'll probably not be able to walk back out of the store with nothing, so I now have to think of some kind of replacement. Maybe I should just hold onto the cash and hold out for a new Audya, or maybe wait for Dom to collect all the parts and freeze the OS on the Mediastation .

Here's what I've been thinking. Get a more modern, up-to-date, full-featured 61key (don't faint, remember I already have the A70) controller (there's even one that comes in RED) and use that to drive both the SonicCell and softsynths. Why 61? To possibly sit atop the C1 and drive the SonicCell at a gig. I tried using the lower manual of the C1 for this but frankly, although it will work (after a fashion) it makes a lousy controller.

Anyhow, if I take it back, this will reinstate the SonicCell as my 'Roland' soundsource. I probably would have been better off with one of those new GW8's. Ahhh, so many choices, so little cash.

chas

Uh uh, looks like I'm screwed. The date on the receipt is 11/07/08; six days late. Oh well, I'd already bought a 1 Gb mem and upgraded the OS. Now, I guess I'll have to dig in and learn it. Ahhhh, easy come, easy go. I will NEVER listen to another internet demo again. Uh, what's the URL on that Audya....... oh nevermind.

chas

Internet demos are only the START of something for me...

Despite how good the G70's demos were, it took me two whole afternoons of playing the G70 at the store (50 miles away) before I bought it. It has to scream "BUY ME!" at least on two different days before I trust my instincts.

This has worked out well for me in the past. I have yet to buy anything that I did not use for several years, without any regret.

(Plus, I still digged that MotifXS demo better than the FantomG's ones, too )

Just sell it, chas... if you are not loving it by now, why force yourself to keep it? Find a store with a Nord Stage, and do a trade

Anybody interested in a Fantom G7......cheap?

chas

http://www.craigslist.org/about/sites

Chas my friend! Go ahead and take the G7 back to Guitar Center anyway. Tell them the situation (you might want to call them first and explain the situation to them beforehand on the phone). If they say "we can't" because it's been over 30 days, then kindly ask for the "store" manager. Explain the situation to the store manager and tell him you would really like a refund on your FG7. If he says okay but we'll have to add a re-stocking fee then that is up to you whether you want to accept his offer. Hopefully he'll just say: "okay, bring it back and we'll refund you for the entire amount.

If he, on the other hand, says he'll have to add a re-stocking fee you can accept it or go to Plan B: which would be to ask him if you can simply exchange it for another item (with the difference in price going in your pocket if the total cost is less than the G7 cost) - considering that you will most likely get another totl keyboard or arranger anyway, right?. That is probably the scenario he'll most likely agree to i.e. an "exchange" for a different item (instead of a full refund or a refund less the re-stocking fee on the G7) but you never know until you ask. I really think the store manager will work with you chas, especially during the christmas holiday season. Even if you ARE a few days over the 30 day limit.

>> It is very important that you talk directly to the "store" manager as opposed to a 'department' manager. You want to go right to the top if necessary.

Best, Mike

Originally posted by cgiles:



I'm quite happy with my Fantom G7 chas. Very enthused about it in fact.

There are many, many, excellent patches on the Fantom G chas but there are a few presets that are just average and even a few below average as well. I suppose that can be expected with every keyboard though, right?

What is nice about the Fantom G as far as the patches go is that you have a vast array of tweaking parameters to assist you in your editing and creating of custom sounds - whether organ, guitar, piano, or whichever ones you choose - to get that sound you want out of the patch(s). Also, the DAC's on the Fantom G are 24 bit, which gives it a nice clean, punchier sound. The wave forms, for the most part, are excellent in my opinion too chas, but if you don't like Roland's preset 'attempt' then tweaking the patch is your "window of opportunity" to do Roland's initial attempt(s) one better. The Fantom G is expandable (unlike the Yamaha Motif XS) and I'm expecting Roland to come out with some outstanding ARX boards down the road. The first two i.e. ARX 01 Drums and ARX 02 EP's were not my cup of tea, since I felt the EP's on the Fantom G, in most instances, are great already as well as the Drums too in my opinion. To each his own I suppose...

Here is a short improvisational demo I played and recorded on my Fantom G7. I kept the file in .wav format to preserve the sound quality. The patch is the Souvenier's organ patch but somewhat tweaked of course.

Organ Demo


PS: You might not like that type of organ sound chas, but the door is wide open on whichever organ sound you choose from to edit. Along with every other patch from every other category as well too of course.

Best, Mike

PS: I could go on and on and on about all the other great features and capabilities that lie under the hood and on the surface of the Fantom G, but I will spare you and the rest of the forum.

I'm sorry it didn't meet your expectations. Pity.. because I think the Fantom G has sooooooooo much to offer and then some. Again, to each his own I suppose, right chas?

[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 12-16-2008).]

The link is now working okay... Sorry for the inconvenience.

Best, Mike

Hi Mike

Interesting

Apart from the slightly over deep rotor sound, you’ve got the Yamaha Electone organ sound spot on.

I must admit though that from you posts I wouldn’t have thought you’d be into that type of sound

Regards

Bill

Yeah Mike, I've decided to keep it and peck away at it's mysteries and hidden treasures . Truth is, if I hadn't missed the return deadline, I would've taken it back; now, it's too much hassle and I don't feel like arguing with a GC dept. manager. Besides, there are one or two 'live' voices that I like and that tells me that there are potentially many more if I'm willing to put in a little time and effort. The single patches still leave me cold.

I honestly think the organs are poor, both in sound quality and especially 'playability'. This doesn't bother me as I would always use the C1 for organ anyway. The pianos were a big disappointment OTB, but there are so many opportunities for tweaking and layering that I'm sure I'll eventually find something that works. If not, then it's back to the Triton w/piano board (not really that good). I have to say, I don't share your enthusiasm of the El. Pianos. Too thin for my taste but, again, tweakable.

Saw a G7 on stage with the featured band on Jay Leno the other night, so I guess that means the Pro's find them acceptable.

Glad you're happy with yours and thanks for the organ sample. Not a voicing that I'd use but certainly sounds fuller than the preset. I haven't yet moved mine from the Rec Room to my studio, so I haven't really heard it through good nearfields. I'm playing it through the Traynor K4 at essentially flat settings so that may be part of the problem. I'll keep tweaking. Thanks for your input. I've joined a Fantom G forum but they're pretty much bigtime fanboys.

chas