Hey, just going from what I see in the real world...

I don't believe I have a single acquaintance running a contemporary computer system in a ten year old (yet alone twenty year old) computer case.

Perhaps you all HAVE considered these points, but no-one ever mentions it. Just thought I would... If all you listen to is the guy trying to sell you something, you only get one kind of information.

The concerns with upgrade and bugfixes often needing updated specs is from direct experience. I just thought that might have some value. My mistake.

The major concern is that all future upgrades and their integration and all bug fixes and all repairs .....lay with the future of Liontracks and its future has to be built on a profitable business model. If this is the last keyboard that you are going to buy then it all depends on liontracks future to survive. something to be aware of.

In this case Spalding I have to disagree with you.

An open keyboard is a combination of programs from many different companies (The number is determined by what YOU put in it) which are combined into one unit interface.
If any open keyboard manufacture went under tomorrow (Hopefully not) then the only thing that would cease is development of the interface, the rest would carry on as normal. (Parts are available off the shelf)
It’s known as not having all your eggs in one basket. (Technics owners know what that’s like)
In addition it is cheaper to buy up the rites to a software development program, rather then a liquidated company.

Yet another advantage of an open system

Regards

Bill

Hi Diki

All open keyboards use their own be-spoke case, which can easily be modified to accept any new hardware that comes along, therefore the analogy with a standard computer case does not apply.

Regards

Bill

Thank you Bill,

It was what I wanted to say earlier, but changed my mind, when I figured...why bother!

Some folks will see only what they want to see, and then only believe half of it.

Dennis

Diki, You make a valid point. In recent years we saw the AMD CPU socket configurations go from 754 to 939 to AM2. Each change meant a new Motherboard would be needed to keep the latest cpu's.

There are 2 factors that may affect the comparison of upgrades to a 10 or even 20 year old personal computer to a Mediastation of the same age.

1) You do not necessarily need every upgrade that comes along. While I understand the software is continually improved and new releases come out periodically, some users hold pat with older versions of software that they have become comfortable with. Not upgrading doesn't take away from what you already have, it just doesn't add to it either. 10 or 20 years from now, barring any hardware failures that I cannot fix, my MSX should still play the same sounds it plays today.

2) Upgrade path is better with the MSX than many PC's. If you have an older PC you have to weigh out the benefits to upgrading versus buying a new one. The low price that new PC's sometimes have make upgrading the old seem less advantageous. If you are replacing everything but the case anyway why not just buy new.

With the MSX you have considerably more invested into the case and components than a cheap PC case. You have the quality Fatar Keybeds and the Pro grade XLR outputs/ inputs and the TFT Touchscreen. It should almost always be a lot cheaper to buy a new CPU or a Mainboard + CPU than a new Mediastation or any other high end music workstation. There is room inside the mediastation for any standard ATX mainboard. Currently supporting the AM2+ Phenom 2 Processors.

If a new mainboard design standard is adopted in the near future, there is a good chance even it would fit in the msx case. Many computer advances are in making the chips smaller. I can't imagine a new standard that would be too big to fit. The ports that extend from the mainboard through the rear of the MSX are covered with a small plate that can be easily machined if necessary to fit a new configuration.

So while nothing is ever truly 'future proofed' the Mediastation is in a pretty good position to go a long way.

Spalding, you mentioned, "that all future upgrades and their integration and all bug fixes and all repairs .....lay with the future of Liontracks and its future has to be built on a profitable business model the advances being tied to Lionstracs business success".

That is true. If Domenik goes out of business tomorrow, I may never get another feature added onto the MSX OS. I could only load new software that uses standards that the MSX already supports (Vst, Asio, Giga, ect..) But even this 'worse case' scenario doesn't leave me very limited, and from what I know of Domenik's commitment to this project, i have a feeling he will take good care of it for a long time to come.

Richard

Excellent post, and well argued Richard.

Dennis

Thanks Richard. A good point well made. My point was only in Midens enthusiasm that this would be the last keyboard that he would buy :-) Also i think you all play down the skill it takes to integrate existing and new software to use on a musical instrument that a musician would play and not a programmer. Dom also struggles with this concept.

Just to remind you read through this thread again featuring Dom talking about new features that he has managed to provide on the medistation
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/016814.html

Dom used programmers to integrate various software sources for the MS and then released these integrated systems as updates to the end user. If the end user could have easily done it themselves then why the hell bother with so many updates ???? It is not true that if you bought any music software package off the shelf that you could use in conjunction with any other software effectively without getting into some programming .

Dom summed it up himself in this post he made in June 2008

"Mediastation is a PC based system, with GIGA sampler, VST and other sounds PC engines and NOT a ROM+DSP based systen like the all embedded keyboard.
With the ROM+DSP engine, you can control and levelling perfect the all sounds/styles, under a PC open system, this is like impossible.
Each GIGA, VST...have a different sounds and volumes engine, depend how many oscillators, voice... you open and every time the global volumes will change and not levelled.

So..with the MS you have to choose one compromise system, IF you like to open so many VST, GIGA, Synth's, you must also accept this all compromise..
in my MS Pro I just have installed one AMD Athlon XP dulacore 5200+, 8Gb RAM system and I have open and played about 1300 Voices.
This was just for testing the Linux OS, but of course the globally volumes OUT had changed totally! Was not a stereo HiFi CD player...
It is a compromise... you have to choose what is better for your gig's.
For play some Bossa Nova with a nice guitar and sax...I'm the first to tell you to buy one Tyros 3.
the problem is that my clients do NOT want this...this is my problem.
cheers"

You see you are oversimplifying the challenges that having atruly open system entails. All i am saying is stop sugar coating the sale.....

And i am still happy for you Miden and lookforward to when the technical chat can stop and the music making begin

Hi Spalding

Don’t know about the Mediastation, but once you load in the VST to the Wersi OAS system, then the setup becomes no different to adding an expander module to a hardware board, (But without having to configure Midi and Input/Output) and can be done by any musician, even if he has never seen a computer in his life.
Its not sugar coating, its fact, just go and try one, and you will see that it is no different to the work you had to do to set up the Akai Piano samples you loaded into your Korg.

Regards

Bill

Hi Bill I bought the Xprodata expansion card designed for the Korg PA1X precisely for that reason. In the end i wanted sounds that were balanced and EQ'd for the instrument that it would be used on in conjunction with the other sounds i would be using . It sounds terific and saved me a bunch of time setting up each sound so they balanced with the rest of the onboard sounds.