Yes, Ian. I should have phrased what I said better...

"In the meantime, you can listen to the GW-8 and Prelude demos to see a good reason why Roland SHOULDN'T roll out a TOTL G-series for a while..."

Neither of these really qualifies as a true arranger, unless you are satisfied with ROM settings. The E50 is still the better solution. And while the Sonic Cell is an improvement over the E50/60's engine and soundset, there are still areas that need improving. I don't know whether it is because Eric Persing left Roland some time back to form Spectrasonics, but Roland's voicing team doesn't seem to have been as dominant as they once were.

Until Roland can field something that really IS new and groundbreaking, there seems little point for new TOTL product. Hopefully, there's enough back stock to keep those of us that still prefer the things (like I said, they are still considerably more advanced than Yamaha and Korg in many areas) in spare parts for a while!

And forget landfills! A good friend of mine is happily gigging my old G1000, probably for years to come, as well. You build them right, they don't NEED to go to the landfill...

I still think Seamaster is trying to tell you something, Bill.

I think he works at a landfill.

And I thought Seamaster got his G70 at a landfill...boy, was I wrong.

I hear ya...the only new things were the SuperNATURAL™ sounds that I believe originated on the Atelier...not too shabby, but not quite up to SA1/SA2 levels.

But you're right, it would not be realistic to produce another G70 unless there are significant enhancements...perhaps a version of the V-Piano's engine that could be applied to other voices as well?

I imagine there are some G70 left...Fran had said one time ( several months ago) that he knew where there were a few.

I know there are still brand Tyros2 available in some areas...a buddy of mine bought one last week....I'm actually thinking about one, myself....depends on how good the next S-series comes out.

I like the T2 better than the T3...just a personal preference....probably why I like the S900 as well....a sweeter, more defined sound, IMO.

Did you get your little Data Base issue with the G70 sorted out, and have you had any luck with getting a nice primo backup instrument?

Ian

I talked extensively with Roland... unfortunately, there's no hard and fast 'step by step' that reproduces the problem, so they are unwilling to put man hours on it until it can be shown to be a real 'bug'. It now has happened to me twice in the four years I have had my G70, so hardly a common error, I guess. Others have anecdotally had the same problem, but again with insufficient common circumstances to make tracking it down easy.

So I have gotten into the habit of backing up on an hourly basis (depending on how fast I'm working) which is hardly onerous. Problem (sort of) solved...

I have also decided to wait until the house gig is a lock (in these times, it pays to wait - it's a brand new club) before I get my backup. I've been using my current one on doubles long enough. A while more won't hurt.

In the meantime, all you rampant speculators and nabobs of prescience, Musikmesse is right round the corner. Maybe Roland has got some goodies for you all? Maybe an S950 to tempt Ian? Maybe some more DNC sounds for the PA2/PA800? Maybe some more fills? Maybe Dom's 61 X-Series? Or ALL chords in audio on an updated Audya?

Seems pretty quiet around here under the circumstances...

I think Ian is bitter, Bill. He makes half a dozen trips to his local toy store for every trip I make to my local Roland dealer.

[This message has been edited by Seamaster (edited 03-23-2009).]

Bill, I believe Seamaster is a bit down in the dumps.

Toys vs junk....ahhh....toys win every time!

Seamaster must seek out his inner child, not be so cranky....and be grateful his keyboard is still holding up so far.

Of course, if he actually works at a landfill, there should be no shortage of spares for whatever it is he is presently playing.

Now, I must get back to my toys....I love my job!

Ian

[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 03-23-2009).]

He's got a Roland, Ian... hence, he doesn't really NEED to worry about it holding up.

If more of us here were on a ten to twelve year new arranger cycle, rather than a three year one, trust me, durability would be a MUCH more important criterion.

Yes, and well it should, Diki...considering it might be the last TOTL Roland for quite some time.

But, maybe Roland will surprise everyone and stay in the TOTL arranger arena and bring out a new G or even a new Pro E-series?

If they don't, it's nice to see it won't affect you or Seamaster.

Ian



[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 03-23-2009).]

Wrong on all counts, Ian. Firstly, I have NEVER gone from one model to the next other than when I got the opportunity to swap to a G1000 from a G800 with no hit in price. The ZIP disk made that a no-brainer.

I CHOSE to not go with the V and VA series arrangers. Not because I HAD to... because, as with most Big3 products, and especially Yamaha (IMO), there is such an incremental improvement that you are hardly buying a 'new' product, merely a refined one. My G1000 remained reliable despite an appalling schedule under brutal marine conditions, and is STILL doing great service to a friend of mine that gigs it regularly.

I see little point in upgrading until it IS a REAL upgrade. Unlike so many here I am still convinced the way to sound better is to play better. Not buy the next incremental upgrade arranger and PRETEND I have got better.

As simple as Roland have made tweaking everything in the G and E-series arrangers, I think I don't really find myself upgrading just for variety in my styles, which I fear so many here do.

You and I BOTH know the only thing that will get my juices flowing for the next Roland arranger will be the unlikely reappearance of the Chord Sequencer (RIP )...

Until now, Roland have had roughly the same cycle that Korg and Yamaha have had. One occurrence does not a pattern make. But, as happy as I am with the G70 out of CHOICE, not necessity, I find myself not panicking as much as I am sure many Yamaha users would, under similar circumstances.

I, at least, refuse to confuse dissatisfaction with one's arranger with 'human nature' Personally, I think only those that NEED a better arranger are worried when one doesn't arrive..

(This is an answer to the unedited post... sorry)

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 03-23-2009).]

Yeah, that's for sure, and considering there seems to be little in the way of anything really innovative, you really don't need to upgrade.

I chose the seemingly small upgrade from the 3k to the S900 because the SA voices in the latter were, to my ears and fingers, a significant improvement...even though there were only a few, the ones Yamaha picked were ones I use very often.

When I play the Sweet Tenor voice (which was also on my old 3K) and then play the SA Sax, there is so much more realistic expression in the latter, especially when using legato phrasing so that the attack disappears as on a real sax...when I hear the Sax on any other non-Yamaha arranger, it sounds so phony, even though only a short time ago they were probably the best of the bunch.

The same goes for the SA Concert Guitar.

So, a seemingly minor upgrade for some turns out to be a major (and happy) one for me, and many others as well, seeing how many of my former 3K clients have decided to move up to the S900.

I'm not one to just buy and not put the time in to get the most out of the instrument, but I am one who likes to improve my sound, even if sometimes it is incremental...I'd say I use 100% of my arrangers, partly because it's my job to do so, but also I have always enjoyed exploring and learning every feature.

New styles mean nothing to me since I assemble my own and have hundreds of great donor styles for parts....I'm still using styles that began on my old PSR-2700, and we both know it's not how many you have, but how high the quality is, and how effectively you use them....I can do a whole night using only 20-30 well prepared styles.

T'would be a shame to see Roland bow out, but at least, if they do, they ended on a high note and a decent instrument.

Ian

PS...Yeah, I edited my post...just turned 60 the other day...I must be getting mellow, and besides, this stuff is just small change, and hardly worth belly bumping over



[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 03-24-2009).]