http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVTA2wvX4A8



www.AudioworksCT.com
203.876.1133



[This message has been edited by frankieve (edited 05-03-2009).]

Very nice Frank Thank you.....
appreciate it. Hope to see more in the future.

Very good and clear review.
Thanks Frank. I look forward to hearing some of the styles. The positions of the mod wheel and USB inputs seem very odd. But, overall, a very interesting looking board.
Eddie

Yikes! Not only did Ketron give the Audya USB 1.1 (an archaic spec) they then go ahead and put the connections in "harms way" on the front of the keyboard right by the User's left leg?? Everybody and his uncle moves his body around when playing a keyboard (when sitting OR standing) unless your a classically trained Pianist and even that's iffy. Which makes me wonder who is running the show over there in Ancona Italy?? It's apparent their employees either have NO musical background experience i.e. they are just lame?? engineers who don't know what they're doing, OR they're bringing people in "off the street" who don't know what they're doing either. The USB placement if VERY disheartening in my opinion. >> Oh..? where's my thumb drive??? On the floor?? GREAT!!! >> I can't just quit playing (before a live audience) an pick up my thumb drive - which has fallen on the floor because Ketron's design engineers are apparently clueless!! Ouch! Buyer Beware!! Or if you do buy an Audya "be very, very, still when you play it." [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img]

Also, it would have been very "easy" for Ketron to make the XLR Mic volume controls more intuitive. Okay, so you have the "knobs" that stick out right? What they could have done is make the knobs "pushable" where you push them once and they "retract" i.e. "go in" making them 'flush' with the keyboard casing after you've set them to your desired preference. Push them again and they would "come out" which is where they're at ALL THE TIME because of Ketron's lack of foresight in my opinion. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/frown.gif[/img] And which makes them extremely vulnerable to disruption and unwanted movement as it currently stands.

Another bummer is the buttons don't line up??? [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/confused.gif[/img] That will take some getting use to no doubt. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/mad.gif[/img] And as Frank has already attested too. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/wink.gif[/img]

Okay, so we now know the Audya is apparently a design disaster [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img] ... what can you tell us in the way of any good news about the Audya Frank? [img]http://smileydatabase.com/s/128.gif[/img] [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img] Oh yeah.. you did mention the Styles were brought up to a "new" level right? [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/smile.gif[/img] That is good news if it is indeed true. The proof will be in the pudding of course. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/cool.gif[/img]

Hey, that would be a good "side by side" test if you don't mind Frank. Put them all through a rigorous "Styles" test and let the world judge the results. If the Audya comes out on top then at least we know the "sound" and "style" engineers from Ketron are credible eh? [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img]

I know, I know.. I realize I'm being a little rough on the Ketron crew. [img]http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Happy/happy-082.gif[/img] Unfortunately, they are somewhat deserving of it don't you think? [img]http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Happy/happy-073.gif[/img] My opinion of course...

All the best,
Mike

Thanks Frank,
Just what we needed. If possible please compare the styles per catagory - that will help a lot to see if the keyboard fits our particular gigging needs. Or which one of the four does so.

hammer

Nice 1st episode Frank!

The additional fill buttons was new info to me, should make it more flexible, specially
if the buttons are assignable as well.
Regarding the USB connectors, yeah, not ultimate place to put it, but there might be a
way to make it personal, just connect a USB hub and place it where you want (as long as
the Audya are compatible and do recognize a HUB), or connect a extention cable and place
the USB stick where you want it.
Your remark about the styles sounds good, as we know that Ketron SD1 sure contain real
great styles, Audya has better?
And the manual, yeah, pretty good for a beta test version of Audya, don't you think?

Anyway, looking forward to see/hear your comment when put it up against the KorgPaX2,
because due to the heavy prices where I live, I doubt I will buy a Audya before it comes
at the 2nd hand market as long as I know I can add both Korg and Tyros3 or another couple
of top arrangers for the same amount of money..........

Cheers
GJ

[This message has been edited by Gunnar Jonny (edited 05-03-2009).]

WOW! Who at Ketron decided to put the USB connections there!!!!????? Frank is right in that they should either be in the back or on the top panel. Hell.., anywhere but where Ketron put them. It's odd those soft keys on the screen don't line up. However.., that seems more of a cosmetic issue than one that would seriously hinder operation (just would take some getting used to I guess).

Why in the hell is the master volume so far to the right? I still don't like the location of the style controls being in the middle of the keyboard under the screen. Sure that's a comfortable position if your entire solo is at middle C.., but realistically the controls to either the left or right make much more sense. I'm glad that Ketron added a data dial to the Audya too (as Frank said.., it's about time) Welcome to that last 20 years of quick data selection and entry Ketron.., glad to see you finally got here.

Holy crap could this $5,000 arranger scream HOME KEYBOARD any louder with those HUGE picture icons to the left above the keys. I know that's a personal cosmetic issue.., but IMO it just screams of cheese in the "looks factor" with those huge icons above the keys.

Frank..., what's the panel made of? Is it metal or plastic? Hard to tell from the vid.

Very cool to hear Ketron has taken the styles to "the next level". Can't wait to hear those..., as well as some patch demos too. I know we gotta hear it yet.., but so far I'm not seeing a $5,000 arranger keyboard.

I will say however.., there's no damn excuse for ANY keyboard maker to release a keyboard with a manual like Frank showed in the vid. I think that just reeks of piss poor business operations. Releasing a keyboard that costs this much with nothing more than a "glorified starter guide" is unacceptable. I think that's pretty shotty to leave a lot of the "figuring out" up to the consumer in this way. Sure you can beta test it for Ketron.., but the bloody thing should at least have a complete manual. I like the Kinko's reference Frank



[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 05-03-2009).]

The fact that he keyboard has USB 1.1 indicates that they use last years PC hardware technology as the backbone of the instrument.

This is kinda sad...


But if it sounds good, and is easy to use.... why not... I am wayting for a sounds demo...can't wayt actually...

And i'd love to seen if there is any easy accassible interfacing to controll a laptop running my vst's over USB or Midi...

This would give you the best styles... and best sounds in one instrument.

curious what is on the usb stick that could or would not be copied into a folder on the hard drive ?

My guess:
Styles, lyrics etc. Load and copy from, and of course save into, or siply use as additional storage.
GJ

True, so why put 2 of them side by side?

------------------
www.AudioworksCT.com
203.876.1133

True, so why put 2 of them side by side?

------------------
www.AudioworksCT.com
203.876.1133

The worst thing about this synth is its fron USB PLUG, right to the left of your hip, if you
leave the stick in you can easily brake the stick and the plug itself. Its sticking out.

Right-angle USB plugs are readily available and inexpensive. That should solve any problems caused by the drive sticking out.
Hope I can get an Audya soon.
DonM

Excactly Don...
http://www.ideativeinc.com/flexusb.cfm

Or even better:
http://www.supertalent.com/products/stt_usb_detail.php?type=Pico#

I do how ever agree that the position of the USB sockets is stupid, but hey, why would one ever use it whilst playing? The main purpose is just to transfer data to and from the HD.

The biggest design fault on this keyboard is the alignment issue with the display buttons, this is simply the work of a mad man. When I tested the board I kept clicking the wrong buttons, but I guess it just takes some time getting used to.


[This message has been edited by Morten Jonassen (edited 05-03-2009).]

Or use Apacer models like this:
(Turnable 180 degrees)



[This message has been edited by Gunnar Jonny (edited 05-03-2009).]

another weird thing is the high mod wheels

For me personally, it will not be a problem with the mod wheels. Instead of moving your hand 8 inches to the left you just move it 8 inches upwards, makes no difference to me.

There are a lot of opinions about the position of these controllers however, in the end it is a matter of personal preference.

Frank how many have you sold ss far I would assume all your stock is answered for after such a long wait?

Just for a reminder and a wake up call to you guys and gals. If (since) the Audya has the archaic USB 1.1 specification: how can it run any VSTi's, let alone stream any audio over its USB interface?? Let's say you want to hook the Audya up to a computer via its USB and you want to transfer or load some audio data into the Audya from the computer or vice versa? Does anyone want to wait around for eternity while the audio transfers or loads? I know I wouldn't.

The Audya is also suppose to have "two" Wave/Mp3 players right? Even loading data off a thumb drive into the hard drive will take a coon's age, let alone then having to recall (load) the data "from" the hard drive back into RAM. And the RAM is soooo paltry how is it possible to load even a relatively 'moderate' amount of audio data into it at all? Which makes the Audya very live performance "unfriendly" if you ask me. I know, I know.. you can bypass the loading of data into the hard drive "prior" to the gig right? Okay, but what about 'spur of the moment' selections you might get from the audience and those selections aren't already ON the hard drive yet?? >> Excuse me ladies and gentlemen! I have to take an hour or so break .. so I can oblige and fulfill your "spur of the moment" requests that you just gave me.. Talk about nerve wracking and time consuming all wrapped up in one, eh? One one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand, four one thousand... ad infinitum (or so it seems anyway )..................... [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/mad.gif[/img] - as your audience then gets either disgusted and walks out, or the ones that happen to be left fall asleep... [img]http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/schlafen/sleeping-smiley-009.gif[/img] You choose. [img]http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/biggrin.gif[/img]

All the best,
Mike


[This message has been edited by keybplayer (edited 05-03-2009).]

Just a few things to take into consideration for all those who are considering on buying thee most expensive "beta" Arranger keyboard ever produced on the planet. Look honey! I have thee most expensive arranger keyboard ever produced! And it's still in beta too!?!?!... With a Kinko's put together beta Manual to go along with it.. Ketron should be very proud of themselves right about now. Uh... really?

All the best,
Mike

Audya's multiple play back feature is not really new... A lot of the technology was born on the midjay. I am certain there are Midjay reviews for everyone to read to get some feedback.



[This message has been edited by DanO1 (edited 05-03-2009).]

Tell us more about the sound of Ketron vs. Yamaha, Roland and Korg...

From harmony central
http://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Keyboard+And+MIDI/product/Ketron/Midjay/10/1
http://emusician.com/elecinstruments/ketron_midjay_bonus/
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/012050.html

[This message has been edited by DanO1 (edited 05-03-2009).]

Here's what really bothers me about the Audya that most likely has a lot to do with the unreal price tag. Frank in his vid basically points out "hey look there's a MidJay inside". Ketron forces you to buy their Midjay as part of this keyboard. That unit alone (as small as it is--with no keys either) costs more than a PSR-S900.., and in some cases costs MORE than a Korg M3!!!!!!

Ketron should have kept the Midjay section as an OPTION. Take out the Midjay features on the Audya and how much do you think that price would drop? There should be two models.. one with Midjay and one without. They combine their extremely expensive Midjay unit into their top end arranger.., and slap a $5000 price tag on it.., then release it with a Kinko's inspired starter guide. Buyers then expected to drop five grand on a keyboard that doesn't even have the manual finished yet.., perhaps Ketron is still learning how to use it themselves

seems that the Audya is getting beat up.

I was going to go some style samples tomorrow to really show how well this machine can make music.



------------------
www.AudioworksCT.com
203.876.1133

I don't think the Audya is going to really let people down in the sounds and styles department. I think many of us here agree (even those of us taking jabs at a few issues about the Audya) that Ketron does make some greating sounding gear.., and killer styles.

This is valid observation. Introducing a product without a manual is not a good move. But here's the deal imo, it really has everything to do with the value of the dollar more than anything else.

I know for a fact that Ketron & CMC had no intention of marketing this keyboard for $5K. I am certain the price will eventually come down if the us dollar improves.

If people think the Audya sounds better than their current product, than they will buy it.


I think the reviews about the Midjay by non arranger / professional writers of music gear publications says a lot about where the Audya came from.

They could have criticized. They could have said it sounds bad. They could have said many things, but criticize Midjay, they did not. They accually thought it was a very cool tool.

There are many micro USE SD readers that sick out less than 1/2" from the port. And some USB sticks that so the same]]
http://www.pcconnection.com/IPA/Shop/Pro...&ci_sku=7922251

Thats all I use any more .Those Huge Sandisks are huge and the U3 SW is a PIA and needs to be removed.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/574085-REG/Sony_USM4GH_T2_4GB_Micro_Vault_Tiny. html



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 05-03-2009).]

Ergonomically speaking, the Ketron Audya reminds me of that expression, "A camel is a horse put together by a committee."

I suppose if the camel...eer...Audya sounds great, that these seemingly haphazardly placed controls and buttons will be worth getting used to.

Frank, I imagine the first styles you play should be the guitar, or unplugged styles...just to dispel any doubts about how the audio/midi guitar tracks work and sound on the more complex chords.

That is one of it's main features/selling points, and is obviously where the name "Audya" came from.

Ian

I just don't see anybody in the right state of mind dumping $5000 on this thing! Sounds like another classic case of "well, we think the consumer will like this and need that".

Frank dont worry re the Audya bashing, lots of us are very interested in your explanations of both good and bad on the Audya. I personnaly feel that the price is too high, however one expects that the first buyers will subsidize the r&d to make this board better and cheaper over time, also lets not forget that perfection at this time does not exist with any manufacturer or board, so give Ketron a go as they are probably paving the way for other makers to incorporate better features, however if you bash (and asking questions and for explanations is not bashing) you will turn all makers off trying new things, it will be the the same old everything as per the norms

My flabber is extremely ghasted at the thought that this DOESN'T have a touch screen. Once used to them, the offer a degree of control and flexible layout that transcends the Yamaha inspired design.

No, of course, you still leave the majority of live controls in button and slider format... but offset buttons for onscreen functions has always been a major problem live (your eye tends to go where the screen says it should go), and doesn't allow for anywhere NEAR the density of information on one screen that a touch screen allows. Five buttons vertically, five buttons horizontally... That's not a lot of selectable information on one page. Probably means a LOT of paging around...

I think we are all missing the point as well... although there ARE workarounds for the USB placement, if kludgey and potentially damaging, the more important question should be... 'What kind of drugs were the designers ON? ' And what other bonehead ergonomic issues lie in waiting..? The front panel layout pretty much flies in the face of almost every other arranger out there. I guess everybody ELSE got it wrong, huh?

As much as I take issue with Mike for his fixation with USB2 (especially on arrangers that have NO high speed data needs), I must confess that here, with a sampler and live streaming drum loops, MP3 and Wav file playback, not having this is a real time waster. I don't see the need for it live (samples and loops will already be on your drive, and it ought to play MP3's and Wav's directly, no loading), but at home, you are quite likely to be doing close to GB sized transfers fairly often (as you audition drum loop libraries or sampler loads). Here, I agree. This thing is going to be a pig at home, loading up the HD... One can only hope that at least it multitasks, and you can get some work done while it slowly loads data to the HD...

There's too much stuff on the left side. I'm sorry, but without a Chord Sequence, who of us has much time for button pushing while our LH is tied up playing the damn chords? There are some pretty important controls there, that other arrangers place in the middle or right side. I envision a lot of having to stretch over to the left side with our RH's (and recall seeing quite a bit of that at trade show videos).

Does anyone designing for Ketron actually PLAY? I find it hard to imagine they do...

Finally, I have a big apology to make. (It happens! ). I really didn't think Frank would be as critical as he has been, with these things so hard to get and show (ask George!). He has proven me completely wrong, and my level of respect and admiration has gone up a BIG notch... I only hope that the fanboys that have taken me to task for articulating this level of criticism cut him just a LITTLE more slack than me!

Can't wait for the audio... I know it will be spectacular.

Thanks for the video, Frank.

Frank, thanks very much, what a great way to independently review the different arrangers.

Many thanks

Graham

Hi Frankav,
Many thanks for doing this, I really look forward of hearing some of Audyas styles. I am interested in some of the ballad styles. Many thanks for your work!

Frank,

Thanks for the great Audya review... and a really cool way to present it (youtube)

Since almost everyone is either hot or cold on Ketron, I'm guessing most potential Audya purchasers to be those already familiar with Ketron products. Therefore, how does it compare with the SD1 and SD5 voice-wise and style-wise?

Also, does it have one of my favorite features on the SD5... the ability to kick in fills with aftertouch?

Thanks,
Glenn

i think Frank is too busy having fun with the AUDYA to post his review on styles, and audio samples...

The more I play it the more i'm liking it.

hopefully i'll have another video sample tomorrow.

please call me, it's easier to discuss the keyboard

------------------
www.AudioworksCT.com
203.876.1133

Is the control layout starting to grow on you, Frank? Or do you find, just in general playing, that you are having to reach over more than most other arrangers?

Oh, and does your camcorder have a line in? I am sure your playing demos will sound a lot better if you go direct in (be a good opportunity to hear the mike ins on the Audya). If not, and you are all digital, you might run a Zoom off the direct outs while you shoot, then edit out the camcorder audio and put in the direct audio in a simple video editor... They should stay in pretty good sync if lined up carefully... at least as good as what Youtube does to audio sync, anyway!

I look forward to it all, anyway...

I went to see Frank again today at his shop. Did not really go as much to visit Frank but as you can image, to play the Audya...just kidding... Frank was not there, but he left the keyboard set up and ready to go.
I played, and I played, and I played until my aass hurt. The question has been answered. Yes! you can take this baby for a small gig, like a restaurant, were there is no much pressure.
You must be carefull with you timing and 'think' ahead before you change the variation, especially if the autofill is on. On a few occasions I had already changed the variation when a 'fill' occurred.
The sounds are amazing!!! All of them! And there are plenty of them.
The styles matches the level of the sounds. Each one of them is usable. I can always find a song to go along with a style.
Latino styles are superior and lively. Ballroom and ethnic styles are authentic. The only draw-back are, I believe, the dance styles; although they are very well made, there are no current styles.
The navigation during a performance may be a bit strange. When you are in 'sound' mode and want to go back to the main styles screen, if you hit the 'exit' key nothing happen. You have to select the style bank. Is there another way?

More to come...

[This message has been edited by ccantanapoli (edited 05-04-2009).]

[This message has been edited by ccantanapoli (edited 05-05-2009).]

[This message has been edited by ccantanapoli (edited 05-05-2009).]