I for one would be happy to pay 2k or more for the next Yamaha S series arranger for sure...it's well worth every penny.

Fender raised their prices bigtime as well.

Not a bad thing for dealers because the margins between retail and MAP were increase a lot as well. The margins on some of the most popular gear were too thin. We took on few another guitar lines with good margins like ESP. Ibanez has good margins. So what do sales guys push? They push MARGINS. Why spend 20 minutes "selling" the Fender story when only 5 minutes is spent on an ESP with the same profit in real dollars to the store?

I had this discussion with Vox and Marshall reps. They tell us how to "sell" their products. If I have to spend a half hour convincing a kid to buy a Marshall with Internet margins vs 10 minutes on a higher margin same priced item, guess what will get the sale 5-1 equally priced Marshall amps. The $400 ESPs vs the $400 (now $650) Mexican Strats generate more profit so we have a larger selection of them than Fenders. Since Fender raised their prices, stores can now make more profit on the Std Strat so sales guys are inclined to push them unlike before. Now the same percentage margin on a $650 Fender generates far more income.

Yamaha raised their prices because they CAN. The Motif is the best selling workstation, the Arrangers are the best selling in their class. Korg lowered their prices to sell more. Roland has the most loyal fan base so they have to be really careful.
These guys know what they are doing.

This economy is bad for a lot of businesses. Music sales, although down, don;t seem to be suffering as much as clothing,toys, and many other retail outfits. Accessories and sheet music are the bread and butter during down turns.



[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 05-15-2009).]

Regarding the new S-series, $2000 for a keyboard that does essentially the same things (for my needs) as a much more expensive Tyros3, is still an incredible bargain.

MOTL arrangers, in all brands, not just Yamaha, have come a long way in the past number of years, and offer a very viable, and much less expensive, alternative to TOTL arrangers.

Ian

That's great Donny.., but what would you say to the home player? A semi-pro arranger built for the home market selling at nearly two grand is a huge chunk to swallow. Let's face it.., Yamaha's clearly not building em any better in terms of constuction.., but damn that price is going up real fast.

Cost of electronics is going down..., yet they're still pawning off repackaged hardware and asking more for it? I'll tell you this..., if Yamaha released an S-900 replacement and built it to the quality of say a Motif XS or at least close.., then it'd be much easier to take. However..., if Yamaha keeps the same home build and that cost hits nearly two grand..., I don't know man.., pretty iffy there.

For me I just think it shows Yamaha wearing their greed out on their sleeves. The old no shame in our game mentallity. Just as KingFrog said.., they raised them just because they CAN. They raised these prices well into production..., no new features or anything. Other makers are offering nice software updates with major new features for less or at the same price.

Yamaha plays catch up in some areas to Roland with the XS updates then jacks the prices well into production.

The big three aren't as safe as some of us like to think with the economy the way it is now.

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 05-15-2009).]

Squeak,

You make it seem like the S-900 series is built so badly, it is going to fall apart within a few days of ownership.

We both know that isn't true.

Used as intended (home keyboard) they are incredibly reliable, and there has been relatively few issues. When the model was first released, there were a few issues, but Yamaha looked after all those problems, and has a very satisfied customer base.

It also has a two year warranty on parts and labour here in Canada, so it's covered in any event.

The S900 is not made to chuck in out of a van every night like a pro workstation, but there are many OMB players who treat them with a bit of care and respect that get more than their money's worth out of the instrument.

Ian

I know it's not built to fall apart in your hands Ian. I know it's designed for the home user. The S-900 is a good sounding arranger.., I'll agree to that. When looking at the bigger picture it's price sure as hell does not match it's "physical build quality".

I think the PSR S series are some nice sounding arrangers.., but I don't think it's asking too much that if Yamaha's going to tack on that price tag to build it a little better for you guys.

I HAVE played the S-900 myself. I was surprised to find out how many are actually in my area (was pleased to see this too). I was blown away by the sound quality of the S-900. Yamaha did a damn fine job too at fine tuning the S-900's sound to those internal speakers (that I give them an A++ on). IMO it just felt kinda cheap "physically".

Squeak 2k is NOT alot of money in todays age for sure. If someone cannot afford new there are many alternative purchases for used gear at a much lower price.

Donny.., if Roland can sell a Juno-G packed as full as it is with features for under $1,000 (which by the way although budget..., at least has a metal upper casing) then 2 grand is a lot for a plastic home keyboard.

Don't look at this an arranger vs workstation thing. Step outside of the box and look at bigger picture. Look at FEATURES and then cost.

Even the budget Juno-G offers some serious fetures over the S-900 (when looking at features to cost).., and Roland packed all that in for under $1,000.

The S-900 sounds great for sure.., but even the the low end Juno G is built better than the S-900.

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 05-15-2009).]

Squeak we obviously have to different perceptions of what these units & features are worth to teh owner. Like I said for me I invest in gear I play it a few gigs that week, make more then I paid for it, the if I throw it in the garbage, sell it or whatever I lose nothing....if I keep going with it for a while it's all gravy after that....simple business 101.

People have an issue with plastic....The benefits far out weigh the negatives.
Plastic is LIGHT..which means its LESS apt to get bumped or dropped. A heavy metal keyboard dropping on itself can transmit far more shock to its innards then a more flexible giving plastic case which will absorb afar more of the initial brunt of the force.
I cannot think of any advantage of a heavy Metal board except for stability on a stand.
Both cases will take a thrown beer bottle LOL. The bottle with be less likely to break against the plastic case as well....LOL

I would have paid the same for my XS8 if it were made from the Tyros case....In fact I paid more for the all plastic Tyros!!


Heavy Metal cases are overrated and someday won't become a selling point.

[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 05-15-2009).]