Ian and Cassip,
I have owned only four keyboards since I started playing again(I walked away from a professional career in 1975) - a Yamaha Motif, a Korg PA1X, and I currently own and gig with both a Tyros 3 and a PSR3000. I have tried the S900 several times but just don't get the "buy me now" urge for it. Everytime I take out my PSR3000 I wonder why Yamaha can't produce a Tyros 3 product in a PSR3000 size instrument.

What got me started thinking about this was a special gig I played doing only "DJ" work. Yea I know, real musicians don't to "DJ" work. But what happened was I have a regular senior gig I play and the residents are all from small towns around Dallas. As such, they are really into hard core country music. So I decided to put together an hour of the really old stuff - things you don't even hear played on the classic country radio anymore. Well, the residents absolutely loved it and responded with enthusiasm and applause after every song. Kind of surprised me actually.

But the real kicker was me leaving the house without a keyboard. All I had was my laptop and one of my Bose Compact speakers. Talk about a light load. So I got to thinking about the available keyboards out there and posted my question.
My personal conclusion was there are not any really high end sounding keyboards in that weight range and I was wondering what all of you thought.

Hammer

Well Hammer, I guess we'll have to wait and see if the next PSR S-Series is a Tyros3 in a lighter cabinet.

Should be due out in the late fall, perhaps, or first of the year, but that's just a guess...might be called the PSR-S950.

Rumor has it that it will have after-touch, and SA2 sounds, as well as a bunch more SA1 voices, a master compressor, and well over 400 styles.

So, maybe you'll get your wish.

As for the time being, the S900 is perfect for my needs, and I'm not sure if I'd go for a new S-series...but, that depends on how "new" the new is.

I'll take a module of any of the afore mentioned arrangers and/or an Audya module. My first choice would be a Korg PA2X Pro. My second first choice, Audya, Roland G-70 and the Yamaha Tyros. Saturday, I used both the PA800 and the Ketron Midjay Plus - great combination sound-wise, style-wise and feature-wise.
Ciao,
Jerry

[This message has been edited by Jerry T (edited 06-11-2009).]

BBBB...I really don't want to hijack this thread cassp, just answering some questions, hope it's Ok?....BBBB...The Best thing to do is go and Try the Privia PX-320 Stage Piano out for Yourself,and read reviews...I have not spent a whole lot of time yet with it... Everything it offers...But what I have tried I think it will meet My Wifes needs very well and Mine also...My wife is a Pianist only...I will use it if needed with an arranger...I have Arthritus in My fingers and hands, playing Hammer action Only for a long length of time is out of the question even on light touch...I'm 60 plus...I'm Ok with short term use,etc...For Me, We have owned Technics Stage,Yamaha Stage P-80,Roland RD-150 Stage,RD-700GX,RD-300GX Piano's...I'm VERY Happy with the Piano's in The Privia...Nice Samples...Long Decay...I use it Through a Mackie 1202 Mixer and Near Field Monitors.....Map price is $599 I offered $519 Delivered...Got It!

My Next choice, more than twice the money, But compariable weight,etc Yamaha CP-33 About $1100 or so...(Friends have One)Never played one but has same Sampled Piano as Pricey CP-300...As soon as our Home renovation is finished I'll be adding an Arranger again also...Good luck Harold

Well, I guess the thing is, it's easy to get a list of those arrangers under 30 lbs.. Manufacturer specs are easily Googled.

But which one is 'BEST'? For a start off, hammer, you ask which is 'best'. Well, naturally, you are going to get a predominance of TOTL arrangers, as they ARE the 'best', at least compared to their own line!

But then you go and complain all we are recommending is TOTL (except for the S900). But that's what you asked for! The 'BEST'...

There are so many 'bests'. Best bang for the buck (probably S900). Best 'live band' sound (toss up between Korg, Audya - still in beta, though - and Roland, IMO), best all rounder (as in, good for live band as well as OMB), the G70 (IMO).

But under 30 lbs., your choices get limited. As Donny would probably say... the 'best' arranger is the one YOU are the most comfortable with. Seeing as how you are familiar with Yamaha (and own two already) that is the OS you are probably best sticking to. And the T3 is only 10% over your limit... a measly three pounds more. For the 'best' TOTL Yamaha they make, surely that's worth it?

For those that think that weight can be shaved from keyboards without losing anything, think about this... Let's say that the individual keys themselves in a G70 weigh ONLY one ounce more than the keys for a regular synth action. There are 76 keys. That's FOUR AND THREE QUARTER POUNDS of extra weight. Little things can add up. Little things that make a dramatic difference to how something PLAYS.

Better sliders, better, bigger displays, better buttons, more buttons, all these add up. Not much individually, but added together, the pounds just keep coming... It's like dieting! Just how much less ARE you willing to eat?

Ian, I have used minivans and smaller SUV's (Cherokees, that sort of thing) for transport. Having a back door to wheel up to and slide in and out helps. Side door vehicles make this task too difficult, IMO. And, you know what? Whenever faced with a venue that DOES have a lot of stairs, so far I have been lucky that the owner/managers of these places realize the difficulty of their load ins, and if I am struggling, will lend me a barback or waiter for a few minutes (my G70 flight case has handles at both ends as well as the middle). Like I said, I haven't had something I COULDN'T get into yet!

If that new PSR coming has aftertouch, won't that change the type of action they use? But I guarantee you'll LOVE it, no matter what!

Yes your are right.

A module would meet the criteria for this post.
It is beyond me why more manufacturers and users don’t see the benefits.

Best? Contrary to what some people think, saying something is the “best” is all subjective.
For example, Some people say Roland’s G70 has the best key action. Other say Yamaha S900 has the best key action.

So, do you own a vehicle for transporting your gear, or do you rent (lease) or borrow one from a third party?

I can't see the action changing all that much, and I'd be very surprised if after-touch is offered...it is, after all, a rumor.

Besides, like anything else, it's a matter of adapting...I play five or six kinds of actions in the run of a week(or day) so it's no big deal.

I find the Jupiter 8 the weirdest, but only because I've become accustomed to having velocity sensitivity on all the other 'boards I play.

It will be interesting to see if Roland's next G-series will be lighter...I'm betting it will be a bit, and I'm also thinking it will have a different action...maybe one from one of their synths?

Of course, the G70 is fine as is, but you and I both know how companies can change things without any rhyme or reason.

Ian

Way to solve that conundrum would be to get ten people to play BOTH actions and see what they prefer...

In all fairness, a LOT of people, not just Roland owners, comment about what a great action the G70/G1000's is/was, and a lot of people comment about the flimsiness and sponginess of the PSR's... Each certainly has its' adherents (and you can play well on either), but taking the average comment over time might get at least a CERTAIN amount of objectivity to a subjective issue. You can't judge anything on what just one or two people say, but when a whole bunch tend to say the same thing, you are at least on a bit more solid footing...

[This message has been edited by Diki (edited 06-11-2009).]

A lot of people bitched about the G800 and the G1000's weight (they were only four or five pounds lighter that the G70, I think), and Roland didn't change the action then. I think enough people have praised it to hopefully ensure it's survival. The weight gain on the G70 had nothing to do with the action. Yes, I think that a return to the type of case that the G1000 had would be a good thing (it was a hair lighter, but FAR easier to keep clean and looking good), but on the whole, I just don't see it as any kind of priority criteria.

Most of the bitching comes from those with featherweight MOTL or BOTL arrangers anyway, so lowering the weight (even if it COULD be done without lowering the quality) would have little impact on sales, IMO. Let's face it, for what a lot of arranger players want in a sound, the Roland's aren't really going down that path anyway. Those that like Yamaha's aren't going to change to a Roland unless it no longer IS a Roland...

Losing a brilliant keybed to save weight won't make a damn bit of difference unless Roland get serious about some kind of GOOD DNC/SA voicing capability (the Atelier fails to impress me at all), and the integration of Guitar Mode into the style section, and gives Mega voices a run for their money. But Roland probably WILL alienate all their current users if they downmarket seriously, just to save weight. We are already used to the weight and construction, and like the Roland's pretty much the way they are. Most of the people that ditched the G70 gave several other reasons and not JUST the weight for the move...

This is pure speculation, but I think the reason they might change the action, is to save money.

The G70's keybed is not used on any other instrument...at least I think that's what you said on another thread a while ago.

Why make an action solely for one instrument, and tie up a production line?

I wouldn't be surprised if a modified E-80 keybed was used instead, or one from a synthesizer (hopefully not from the Juno Stage, as it has no after-touch...maybe they will use the Fantom G7's keyboard?

Most companies are run by the bean counters, not musicians...it's unfortunate, but that's seems to be how it is, and things get changed in order to save a few dollars on every instrument, which of course adds up when a lot of them are sold.

I think Fantom only weighs 36 lbs, so that's at least a 10 lb reduction from the G70...I know the guys I knew (only three, mind you) that had G70's, sold them because they were a hassle to transport.

I do know, that since the OMB and home keyboard market is mostly older players (50 and up), the weight (or lack of) seems to be quite important.