Russ is right. This IS a fascinating topic...and although MAC, Bill, and Diki are all right, it doesn't mean that Donny's post is entirely wrong or doesn't have value (gasp). The guys in the band CHICAGO will get MAC and Bill's points, the Sex Pistols or even the Rolling Stones, will not. All the study in the world MAY make you a competent player but without 'ears' (read 'talent'), you'll never be a GREAT player. Nor will it guarantee you commercial success. Knowing how music 'works' will always augment talent but is no substitute for it.

A lot of it has to do with your musical goals. Although there are some great musicians in Country music (especially in the Nashville studios), the genre' itself is not as demanding as say, playing avant garde' jazz. There is never a legitimate excuse for not learning music theory and we shouldn't excuse the kids that don't want to 'pay their dues', but we probably do need to de-complicate the learning process because you really can scare them off. JMO.

chas

Wow! Excellent insights into what Becker and Fagen are up to. I'll be getting a hold of that book and I know I'll get a good handle on this once I've grasped a few tricks. This has to be very satisfying stuff to play. As I said in my original post, there's such subtlety and musicality in Steely Dan's material. Thank you very much, gentlemen.

Oh, and my 'return' key no longer seems to be on the fritz.

If someone is determined to learn Steely Dan BEFORE they have even learned to read music or learn the basics of chord theory, I'm afraid there's not much you can do about making it not daunting.

The thing is, if you take the time to learn the basics BEFORE you try that complex a music, you WILL be a good enough 'walk the walk' musician to play it. Or, you could take the Dnj approach, and simply sing over a commercial Steely Dan SMF... THEN it would be easy enough, wouldn't it? No knowledge or chops needed at all.

So easy, a caveman could do it...

Here's a few Steely Dan song suggestions for Donny to 'walk' on:

Only a Fool Would Say That
Change of the Guard
The Fez (make a change from a chicken hat )
Daddy Don't Live In That New York City No More and of course,
The Royal Scam

I'll bet he'd prefer "With a Gun', though Well, 'Don't Take Me Alive'!

(We could play this one all day! )

I'm not a fan of Steely Dan...don't find him interesting at all...sorry.



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 09-18-2009).]

Steely Dan (The Duo, not the man) has always been in that special list of acts that were so unique, you could tell it was them more often than not as soon as the tune came on the radio.

Steely Dan, Stevie Wonder, Kansas, ELP, ELO, The Police, Elvis Costello, Stevie Ray Vaughn and The English Beat are just some examples that come to mind. There's plenty more...

------------------
Bill in Dayton

Yeah.... him and Lynerd Sknyerd and that nice Jethro Tull and his band

I think we should all chip in with some musical facts to help bring Donny into the 21st century. Please add to the list:

Fact - Elvis Costello: NOT the love child of Elvis Pressley and Lou Costello.

Fact - Jonas BROTHERS: Not really African-American.

Fact - Celine Dion/Dionne Warwick, no relation.

Fact - Don Cherry: Not a virgin mafia kingpin (he's a jazz trumpter).

Fact - Little Wille John (R&B singer fromn the 50's & 60's -"Fever"): did NOT get his nickname from a vengful English ex-girlfriend.

Fact - Grateful Dead: not Fran's usual audience (after end of first set).

.....and many more things you should know before posting your next gaff. Just trying to help .

chas

Thank you but after loking at this pitiful list I think I'll stay in the dark ages.

Brilliant...and, very funny...you are at the top of your game, sir.

Ian

The Dark Ages are a bit further back than you think. Entertainment was a rather painful affair:
http://www.medieval-castles.org/index.php?cat=31

------------------
Bo pen nyang.