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#275167 - 11/03/09 01:52 PM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
Diki Online   content


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14269
Loc: NW Florida
Quote:
Originally posted by cgiles:
Worse, they breed.

chas



Well, that's up to US...
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#275168 - 11/03/09 08:02 PM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
zuki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 4723
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
Well, that's up to US...


No, they control that too
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#275169 - 11/05/09 07:48 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
captain Russ Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 7305
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
Jim (Zuki), Chas and others. That's funny, sad and so true. The good news is, the older you get, the less it matters.


Russ

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#275170 - 11/05/09 09:02 PM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
Taike Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 2814
Loc: Xingyi, Guizhou (China)
Quote:
Originally posted by DonM:
I'm glad I never listened to the opinions of piano players when it comes to arrangers. If I had, I would have had to get a REAL job many years ago. Instead, the piano players are mostly in my audiences, still criticizing while wondering how in the world I have made a living playing music for almost 40 years while they sit at a desk all day. Why, that's impossible by only playing chords with the left hand.
And that's not a REAL drummer.
I've had drummers come up and actually be angry because I'm "putting them out of work".
Almost always, they wouldn't be working anyway because they are too loud, drink too much, show up late, etc., in other words aren't professional enough to treat music as anything other than a "gig" and an excuse to get drunk and chase women.
It's o.k. for me to say these things here, but I would NEVER go to a piano or drummer forum and say them. That would be disrespectful.
DonM



So no keyboard player should complain about DJs taking their job away either.

Uh...isn't chasing women one of the main reasons for being a musician?

Taike

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Bo pen nyang.
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最猖獗的人权侵犯 者讨论其他国 家的人权局势而忽略本国严重的人权 问题是何等伪善。

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#275171 - 11/05/09 09:21 PM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
Taike Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 2814
Loc: Xingyi, Guizhou (China)
I'm with Diki on this one. Keyboard weight is the least of my worries.

Classical Bass: up to 30lbs

Tuba: 20 to 30lbs

Marching Band Snare Drum: 15lbs

Quints: 35lbs

Taike

------------------
Bo pen nyang.
_________________________
最猖獗的人权侵犯 者讨论其他国 家的人权局势而忽略本国严重的人权 问题是何等伪善。

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#275172 - 11/06/09 02:48 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
Burkels Offline
Member

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 319
Loc: Alkmaar, The Netherlands, Euro...
Funny that Oscar Peterson was brought up. Here's a link to a YouTube video where Peterson talks with Andr Previn about exactly this: the use of the left hand by pianist, and the difference in usage of that left hand when playing solo or in a band:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55wYm8csHC4

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http://www.keyboardforum.nl
Happy owner of a Roland E-80 V2

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#275173 - 11/06/09 03:55 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Nice find. Lead to a lot of other interesting stuff, as well.

chas
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"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#275174 - 11/06/09 04:52 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Big difference in left hand technique when playing an arranger in it's most natural away, with chords left, melody right.

That's why a lot of piano players have a tough time playing it that way, and why many of them elect to play arranger using both hands over a midi file.

It is in the latter method that you run into what Oscar related about not being able to, more or less, spontaneously try something that enters your mind whilst in the confines of the group.

Using the arranger in chord mode, lets you try these ideas out as they happen, not later on as you edit your midi file...hopefully remembering that cool little chord substitution, or style change.

Of course, using a style can be confining as well, and some players get around this by playing the accompaniment in "piano mode"....Bill from Dayton comes to mind; I believe he uses that method.

That mode can also be limiting, depending on how well your arranger handles full chords, and soloing over them.


I continue to play solo piano, although now, it's mainly at home, just to keep up that skill, and also because I love the sense of control it gives, and how it makes me think differently about chords and chord voicing.

But, I still love selecting a style on my arranger, and conducting the band in real time.

I've decided not to do any personal gigging this winter...I'm going to take it off....just do a few Yamaha clinics (the CVP-5-series will be out soon), and spend more time working on style making, recording, and just playing for my own pleasure.

To me, a portable arranger (with built-in speakers), should not weigh much more than a solid body electric guitar in it's case.

And weight does matter a lot to some people, otherwise, friend Chas would be using a vintage Hammond B-3 with two Leslie 147, and a full pedal-board, instead of the Nord C1...right Chas?

[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 11-06-2009).]
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#275175 - 11/06/09 05:10 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Quote:
Originally posted by ianmcnll:

And weight does matter a lot to some people, otherwise, friend Chas would be using a vintage Hammond B-3 with two Leslie 147, and a full pedal-board, instead of the Nord C1...right Chas?



Right on.

chas
_________________________
"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#275176 - 11/06/09 06:03 AM Re: Hmmmmm?....very interesting read.....
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by cgiles:
Right on.

chas



Chas,

How come you don't have vintage B-3 at home (or do you)?

It would be great for jam sessions at your place...that is, if you have them there.

Even an M-3 in good condition, can be a lot of fun...ahhh, but then again, you do lose that AGO pedal-board (and the 61 note manuals). They do sound like a B-3 just the same.

Whilst I'd never have an acoustic piano (or a Wurly) any more, because they go out of tune and require a fair amount of maintenance (that I'm just too lazy to keep up), a tone-wheel Hammond is basically maintenance-free.

On new instruments, "maintenance-free" often means: When it breaks, it can't be fixed...

A buddy of mine still uses an M-3 and a Leslie 122...the M was chopped (he still has the original cabinet), and is still pretty heavy, but he manages...of course, he isn't playing solo either.

It's too bad Diki and Donny couldn't have settled their differences...I miss them around this place...heck, I miss Fran too.

We all have our quirks (except me and you) and it's those idiosyncrasies (as opposed to "idiotsyncrasies") that make SZ so interesting.

It's the very first stop for me in the morning, and the last place I check in on before I go to bed.

Sheesh...I just looked outside...and it's snowing!

Now I'm glad I cancelled my winter gigs.

Ian

[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 11-06-2009).]
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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