Hi!

Just to let you know that there is a new software called vArranger² that will allow you to play realtime music like on any professionnal arranger keyboard with a PC.

This software has been designed to control 100% of the specs of the Ketron SD2 module.

You can play natively any Ketron styles.

So : Ketron Styles + Ketron SD2 + vArranger² = amazing arranger.

Some musicians uses it as a backup arranger system.

Others uses it as a lightweight arranger solution when they are playing worldwide...

Feel free to ask any question about the software.
http://www.varranger.fr

Dan

i know about that software for a long time, but this software http://www.live-styler.de/home

is better and the price is lower to. your can buy the gold version and play not only ketron styles but other brands to.

CLICK HERE for anyone wanting to read the website translated into English though Google.


First impressions, this looks very professional, extremely well designed layout too. The approach to integrate it with the SD2 is also very good as it would mean it's a plug and play system optimised to sound good straight out of the box. Sounds great too in the demo.

Seriously well done.

What I find hard to swallow though is the price. If I understand this correctly, it's 350 Euro for the program and it does not have a sound engine. You have to turn around and then spend another 350 Euro on a KETRON SD2.

That's 700 Euro just to use the program as it was intended to be used. That's an awful lot of money. If the developers could only include their own sound engine they would have an instant success on their hands here.

Regards
James

you can buy livestyler plus 11 for roland-korg-wersi-yamaha.........styles

link:
https://secure.shareit.com/shareit/checkout.html?PRODUCT[300268572]=1&backlink=http%3A%2F%2F%0Awww.Live-Styler.de

price EUR 107.10 on a USB Stick and it support KETRON SD2 verry good
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5vl6t_lsketronsd2_music

Care to tell us why you think livestyler plays the Ketron styles better then Vranger?

I know livestyler plays all the styles, as long as you have the right soundsources. But you stated that livestyler is specifically better at playing Ketron styles then this solution..

Another question to you about livestyler, do you have any good sources covering the other brands sounds... Yamaha, Roland, WErsi and Korg? Just being able to use the styles is one, but having a selection of the right sounds is worth much much more...

Its hard and tedious to allways find the right sounds with every style you play, still not entirely happy with my Yamaha set-up and not even tried Korg or Roland except for some tweaked styles.
Its what makes the SD2 styles rock, because the module is so cheap and you get a great soundsource for those styles.

i said live styler is better becouse:

1-the price
2-live styler gold support more then one brand.
3-it wil support ketron audya verry soon
4-you get free update

but for arranger i love qranger, why:

1-midi+audio tracks
2-only audio track if you like it
3- 32 pattern in one style(8 intro+8 variation+8 fill+8 endings)
4-for every pattern you can create BPM and beat/bar like for example one variation in 3/6 120 BPM and the second one on 4/4 160 BPM
5-you can record 32 chords separately if you like.
6-you can conect VST
and..................

[This message has been edited by AFG Music (edited 02-21-2010).]

That's a much better price but what's the USB Stick for ?.
I'm big time against any software that uses Dongles. It's also nowhere near as pretty looking as the vArranger progarm above.

The user interface on vArranger is totally transparent. You could navigate that instantly without asking a single questions where Live Styler is a little all over the place and not as well labelled.

Regards
James

about usb stick i do not think is Dongles,
it is a bootable usb i think.

about interface you are right, live styler most have a better interface.

but one option more for livestyler is soundfont gm bank support, and the creator is now on linuxampler forum, so i think soon it wil work with linuxsampler to for giga sounds on windows


[This message has been edited by AFG Music (edited 02-21-2010).]

here one more demo of live styler plus with ketron sd2
http://www.live-styler.de/home/?Live-Styler_and%0AKetron_SD2

listen to mp3 on buttom of the page

It's not very clear though. It could very well be a dongle.



Sounds good to me. Crying shame it's user interface is nothing at all like V Arranger though.

James

about dongle maybe nobert can answer this.

about interface becouse create a new interface is easier then programing, maybe can nobert do this in one or two weeks if users ask for, becouse most users do not like the interface to i think.


[This message has been edited by AFG Music (edited 02-21-2010).]

That would be great if he did because it is pretty awful looking to be honest.

When you see vArranger on the other hand it just look fantastic. Everything is so fresh and clearly ladled. A person who never saw the program before would be able to operate it straight away.

Where the complete opposite can be said about Live Styler. It's like something from the Windows 98 era and poorly designed at that. I'm sure it functions flawlessly, but there's nothing like fresh graphics and a clean interface to draw you into a program.

Regards
James

you are right it is dongle what i do not like to
http://www.live-styler.de/home/?Live-Styler_Plus

but i asked nobert on e-mail about plus version for lionstracs he said, he can do it!

Looks and sound nice. Come this software with styles?

Its not a dongle... Its the medium that the software comes on, so instead of a CD it comes on a USB stick..

Don't know if its bootable tough

Ouch... that's very bad news. Dongles suck...!!!!!
I wouldn't buy his software now even if it was 10 Euro for a copy.

Anti Piracy only effects honest paying customers because the hackers will bypass his security anyway.

Regards
James

Lol... whiplash. .. It is, it isn't.

If it's not a dongle then why on earth a USB stick and Snail Mail for something that could be downloaded in minute or two.

Hmmmm.... Curious

James

maybe you can ask nobert:

e-mail: Stellberg@Stellberg.de or Live-Styler@Live-Styler.de

i have used the first e-mail

[This message has been edited by AFG Music (edited 02-21-2010).]

Hi Bacus
If you open the settings dialogue in Livestyler, you will find a setting for the SD 2 module which sets up all the mapping; this means that when you load a Ketron style the correct voices are used.

Hi James
The livestyler is designed to be used on a typical keyboard touch screen, (8 – 12”) however if you tried to use the vArranger on this size screen everything would be too small, and difficult to use. (Use a larger screen (At least a 15”) or assign the controls to controller buttons however and you will be fine)

As to the Livestyler interface, this has been in production for a few years now, and I agree it does need redesigning.

Bill

it can be better, look this one for linux
http://gmorgan.sourceforge.net/gmo1.png
http://gmorgan.sourceforge.net

only you can not ad styeles and use VST

Hello,

Thank you for your encouragements.

I tried to create a new post to talk about the new software and it's possibilities.

I am a musician playing on my Ketron SD1 since many years, and a computer engeener too.

I searched many years for a such software, I bought all the softwares arrangers in the market and I was always not happy by the overall result for live usage.

OK softwares can do a lot of things, but when I play live I need something EASY, SIMPLE, GOOD LOOKING to find the infos directely, and very efficient, because we are musicians and we don't want to bother about computing while giging...

Every time I can make it Simpler, I do it.

Also, styles own a lot of SYS EX, NRPN and specials guitar noises and live drums, controllers....

And I took a lot of time to give you a FULL compatibility, so the styles are sounding EXACTLY like on the Ketron arranger keyboards.

If you are accomodate with a ketron keyboard, you will feel like you are playing a ketron instrument with vArranger and the SD2.

I am not here to talk about the other softwares, but more to give to the musicians more options for their setup. Some will love LiveStyler or other softwares, and some will love vArranger. Every one his tastes. Giving more choices can only improve the market, and I hope that my software will inspire new ideas to come.

For now 100% of my users are happy, I hope that It will continue on that way with a full personnal support and free updates for each user.

By the way , i really think that any SD2 owner would be amazed by the power of this little box powered by vArranger

Let me know if you need any informations.

Dan http://www.varranger.fr

Hi Dan
I liked your tact in not going head to head with "the other software". I am on the fence about that, but, fortunately, having an SD2 makes it more cost efficient for me.

I can attest to the marvelous sounds in the SD2, and congratulate you in unlocking it's power. Having used it with a controller was fine,as far as it went, but we all know we couldn't access the goodies very easily without some heavy midi controller knowledge that I do not possess.

I guess the main question for myself, is how much more cumbersome it is versus a good arranger. I guess you have one click saves for reg's, and a playlist feature is coming soon. I probably am missing something, but I can't see myslf fiddling with a mouse or poking a laptook screen too many times while I am performing.

I would love to be proven wrong, as it may be an answer to some of my Nursing home gigs.

Bernie

Hi Bernie,

All the features of vArranger can be assigned VERY easily to :

- any PC key
- any midi controller (buttons, knobs, sliders, pedals....coming from your MIDI equipment)

The assigning by midi learn is very EASY :

go on the controller page.

1) select the feature you want to assign
2) click on your controller button.

It's Done.

Let me know if you need any more informations

Dan

Dan,
I would like DETAILS on the completeness of the MIDI implemtaton. I have Live-Styler + and the MIDI is superb...many (almost all) functions can be controlled with MIDI messages.

Yes the screen could be cooler. but the size is just right for touch screen operation.

Lee S.

Does somebody know how much note polyphony the Ketron SD2 have. I can't find it anywhere.

[This message has been edited by FransN (edited 02-21-2010).]

I don't know about the SD2 polyphonie. But I feel like it is 64 notes

Dan, what is the best controller to use with this software. I mean to handle the fills and so. Yes I am new to software arrangers

Hi Frans,

Do you have any midi keyboard yet?

What size of keyboard do you like to play with?

I am still waiting for a compagny to sell a top quality keybed 76 keys + a lot of buttons on it and very lightweight But there isn't in the market! Am I the only one who want that?

There is many models for the 61 keys and less...

let me know

Dan

I have a Korg PA500. 61 keys is enough for me. I prefer light weighted.

Some of my user are using this models :
http://www.akaipro.com/mpk61
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Axiom61.html
http://www.novationmusic.com/products/midi_controller/sl_mkii

there is other options too...

If you have already a midi keyboard, you can add that:
http://www.novationmusic.com/products/midi_controller/launchpad

I personnally use
http://www.studiologic.net/vmk-88.html
+ http://www.apple.com/keyboard/

so I can change the sounds wireless.

I am also waiting for some tablets/slates PC who are coming soon. with a touch screen.

I think there is many options, depending on your taste.

I am also waiting for new products

Let me know

Dan

Check this one out ...

picture

http://www.cme-pro.com/products-list/product-vx.html

Its a little over 10 kg which is for me a lightweight solution, i have owned the 88 key version, and i liked the controllers a lot.

This software is certainly on my wishlist. I am looking for a second keyboard but this also look fun to play with. Let you know when I have more questions.

Frans

Now, don't get me wrong. I AM NOT advocating what I am about to say, simply offering an example of absurdity to provoke more thought about your actions. Please remember this...

But, why worry about what each style player software COSTS? Why not steal a copy from a friend, download it from a warez site, cracked and everything? I mean, you are about to steal the Ketron styles and their audio loops, why stop there?

Let's be honest, here. How many of you that are contemplating getting this software is actually going to go to Ketron and BUY all the styles you want? Before you dismiss copyright for styles, consider what it really means in the long term.

And now, in case anyone missed it... Once again, DO NOT take this seriously (at least the stealing the style player software part). All I am doing is trying to make you think about the consequences of your actions, and their logical (if morally abhorrent) conclusion. Ketron's audio styles cost them a FORTUNE to make. If you are willing to pay this man for his efforts, be willing to pay Ketron for theirs, too.

That is all...

Diki,

i own a Ketron XD3
what is wrong with having this varranger with MY Ketron XD3 styles as BACKUP?
or even as my main setup?

this varranger does not come with the Ketron styles
YOU have to have "bought" them

ALL i have to say is:
this software ROCKS !!!

Lee, I think you get my point. You HAVE bought your styles. Most EULA's for styles allows you to use them for your own purposes in any way you want.

But I have my doubts that most people getting this software are then promptly going to surf over to Ketron, and purchase a few hundred styles or more...

Up until this point, most Ketron audio styles could only REALLY be played on their own hardware (they didn't translate too well because the best part of the style was the loop), so Ketron was getting a return on their investment in making the styles (styles that good are not cheap - ask Nedim). But take away the need for the hardware, what's Ketron's advantage in making them now?

Please note that my software works with the Ketron SD2.

Many users of vArranger² bought to Ketron their SD2 because of my software.

also, in their website, there is a lot of styles for SD2 in midifile format.

It should be good if Ketron would sell the internal styles of their keyboards to the users.

It is the same story when the XD3 was out, a lot of SD1 users downloaded the XD3 new styles inside their SD1.

By the way, I really respect Ketron for their work, and I don't want to make them loose of money, but more a new product to go with their hardware miniature sound module.

I think when they conceived the SD2, they knew that it need a nice software to go with, because some of the Midi settings are hard to obtain. I just created this software.

And from a small sound selector, it became an arranger, then added midifile, karaoke, then mp3 and then (try to be) full management of what we need in live conditions.

I did it first for my own personnal need and then, with the number of users growing, it became a fulltime work.

by the way, the inspiration came from the SynthZone community.

Thank you all

Dan

Dan,

Why don't you sell, or lease the idea to Ketron!?

You know what? If Korg, for instance, would provide a software arranger, similar to yours, containing pa800/pa2x/future arranger features, I'd buy it! Or Roland, or even Yamaha, for that matter.

I'll kive you another idea: why not make a big thing out of vArranger and create styles for it (actually, get some skilled people as partners in this) and sell it as a whole package.

Fact is, if you could present such a package, maybe togheter with an audiocard and midi controller included (or suggested), propose some interesting "styles modularity" as many people would like, add some recording abilities to your soft-arranger (some sequencer) and you'd be the first to take the cream from this. Maybe you followed the other discussions... The fisrt one to "transpose" the arrangers into software world would open the way to a revolution in this area.

Just my thoughts.

[This message has been edited by adimatis (edited 02-23-2010).]

Hi Adimatis,

You are 100% right on all points. I have all that is my head already...

I am happy to see that I am not the only one who this the idea of vArranger was great and follow a true need in the musical world.

Dan

TMS Branda http://www.tornado-music.de/ did this years ago with Livestyler, unfortunately with the death of its founder, no one appears to have carried it on.

Bill

oh yes, sorry I forgot to mention before: I DO LIKE how vArranger looks like. I like the sounds also, but credit goes to Ketron for that.

I'd love being able to use a VSTi with your software, something not too heavy but good sounding like Hypersonic2 would be very nice. And like I said, a basic midi sequencer would be nice too.

Goodluck with this project! I'd like seeing it along the years as a new era opener! I mean it!

Some panes are a bit small, but, in general, the program is quite readable on my 10" netbook. I have converted some Techics styles over to Ketron(so I wouldn't be stealing any Diki), and they sound great.

Since I am not a softsynth person, I am going slowly through the features the best I can, and am impressed.

Hi Dan,
software that would allow someone to edit/create ketron format styles would be incredibly useful.

For instance something similar to what korg has done for their styles. Maybe being able to save a style as a midifile, edit, and resave as a style.

Ok , I know you can use EMC XT style conversion, and do some very limited editing, but it's not perfect.
EMC removes multiple tempo changes in intro's/endings, which can sometimes make them sound off.
For some bizzare reason you also can't put an expression controller ( 11) on the first beat of a style part. Might not sound important, but I used to get large jumps in volume when I used to try & edit my sd1 styles in EMC.

Only reason I sold my sd1+ , was I gave up trying to edit styles for it.

best wishes
Rikki

Hi,
wondering what the difference is between Live Stylers version of playing Ketron styles, & Dan's version.

Dan's plays Ketron styles as is, for some reason I had it in the back of my mind that Live Stylers version CONVERTS the ketron style to Yamaha's style format , then plays it. Have I got it wrong??

best wishes
Rikki

If I also have to buy the styles this become all very expensive as a second keyboard. I need to buy the software, the Ketron SD2 a controller and the styles. I think for that money I could almost buy a SD5. No I think I will go for a Roland Prelude as I like the sound of the Roland more.

Hi Frans,
don't want to hijack Dan's post.
I think it's brilliant that he has come up with a soundmodule/software combination.
Unfortunately I damaged my SD2 & I have to wait till I can send it off & it comes back from repairs.

I used a software arranger (OMB) for a couple of years & thoroughly enjoyed it.
Only problem was we all used different soundsources, so we couldn't really share styles.
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/020871.html

best wishes
Rikki

Yes Rikky you are right, vArranger is playing NATIVELY the ketron styles and do not use any converter.

I also experimented not perfect results with converters, so I worked hard to not use any converters.

Also, note that the sounds you get with vArranger for the right part are better than just the SD2 sounds. because of up to 5 sounds layering.

Did you try some accordeons? Epiano, strings, organ...

look at the rights 1 to 4 sounds when you change the sound presets....

Also you can use thoses best sounds for right hand and for left hand...

So you can get a nice DXPIANO sound for left had (containing 3 layers) + a nice STRINGS sound for right sound (containing 4 layers)

All that with just 3 clik of buttons...

(to change the left hand sound, click on the LEFT track pane in the master section)

Dan

I updated the screenshot on the website http://www.varranger.fr

Click on the image.

A little face lift on the new version.

Dan