Same thing here Gunnar, except we can be almost sure that it starts with government incompetence and not from government "niceness".

We also have this odd thing: Many Greeks were immigrating in the States or in Germany and Belgium to work, during the 50's and 60's. The same guys, now returned and want to throw out all immigrants out.

In the 10 years we have lived in our current house, we haven't had a break-in. We have a sophisticated alarm, stickers on the windows, a sign in the front yard and a 150 lb Great Pyranese in the back yard.

I have 4 rental houses and have about 4 break-ins a year. The neighborhoods are different and there aren't alarm systems.

At my warehouse, there have been many attempts at break-ins, but the alarm has motion sensors, sirens, etc. The only time there was a successful break-in, I was in the building at 6:30 AM one morning last year and didn't lock the door. I received damaging cuts on my left arm (severed tendons) that that have left we with mobility problems and numbness. I had a 5 shot 45 long colt Taurus in the drawer, loaded with 410 buckshot. I chose not to use it, but hurt the kid with a wooden club to the point where he spent several days in the hospital and, even though he was convicted of the criminal charges of breaking and entering and inflicting bodily harm, sued ME in civil court for injuries.

I'm still so very glad I didn't kill the kid, even though the injuries have permanently changed my life and music career.


R.


Russ

Russ ... I remember that incident ... how did his law suit turn out?
t.

Hi all, thanks for the replies! Gosh some of the stories here certainly give you food for thought and emphasises just how dangerous the situation can be.

I don't have any alarm systems or any extra form of deterrent installed on the house, I was always under the illusion (just as with a car) if someone want's to burgle it they will and nothing will stop them.

I am not sure but I've heard that a lot of burglaries are caused by people who you know or know of. A random burglary where someone just picks a house is probably a little more rare.

Danny

whatever the statistic (which are easily manipulate to reflect what ever you want the fact is when a burglar breaks into your house they have 100% choice as to whether they come in equiped to rob and kill if they feel necessary whether thats a knife , a gun, a hammer whatever and currently the law does not allow the householder in the UK any choice whatsover other than to use reasonable force to protect yourself. And then you have to work out what reasonable force is in a live situation and then still risk being sued or imprisoned yourself if your judgement is deemed wrong by a court.Much of the crime in this country is drug fueled and you have no idea if the burglar is high on drugs when they enter you home and the question of reasonable force gets really blurry. I have intercepted a robber not in my home but on the street and believe me when you hit someopne who is high they dont feel it like they would if they were dry ! My family is all that matters to me and my possesions are no where near as important however i am not willing to just let people walk in and walk out of my home with the things i worked hard for without some resistance .

I Know that i would rather have the same choice when it comes to equiping myself as burglar has.

The vast majority of normal human beings do not want intentionally to kill anyone (IMHO).

Just a thought...what about a weapon which will demobilise rather than kill?....Stun guns? anyone any take on this?

Eddie,

Depending upon where you reside, stun guns and Tasers, which can be quite effective, may not be legal. Some cities in the U.S. have taken steps to outlaw them because the thugs use them as well. When such ineffective laws such as those that outlaw guns go into effect the only people effected are honest, law-abiding citizens. The criminal element could care less--that's why they are criminals. There's an old saying in this part of the world "Never bring a knife to a gun fight1" Makes perfectly good sense to me.

Gary

I remember a 60 year old fellow at a nursing home with diabetes, chastising me about being vegetarian, saying that it was unhealthy.

That's like a gun slinging American who lives in the country with by far the highest crime rate in all the wealthy nations how to fight crime in the UK where there is a fraction of the crime.

From http://www.bradycampaign.org/facts/gunviolence/gunsinthehome/

DID YOU KNOW? Where there are more guns, there are more gun deaths.

Gun death rates are 7 times higher in the states with the highest compared with the lowest household gun ownership. (Harvard School of Public Health, Harvard Injury Control Research Center, 2009).
An estimated 41% of gun-related homicides and 94% of gun-related suicides would not occur under the same circumstances had no guns been present (Wiebe, p. 780).
DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of homicide.

States with the highest levels of gun ownership have 114 percent higher firearm homicide rates and 60 percent higher homicide rates than states with the lowest gun ownership (Miller, Hemenway, and Azrael, 2007, pp. 659, 660).
The risk of homicide is three times higher in homes with firearms (Kellermann, 1993, p. 1084).
Higher gun ownership puts both men and women at a higher risk for homicide, particularly gun homicide (Harvard School of Public Health, Harvard Injury Control Research Center, 2009).
DID YOU KNOW? Keeping a gun in the home raises the risk of suicide.

Keeping a firearm in the home increases the risk of suicide by a factor of 3 to 5 and increases the risk of suicide with a firearm by a factor of 17 (Kellermann, p. 467, p. Wiebe, p. 771).
The association between firearm ownership and increased risk of suicide cannot be explained by a higher risk of psychiatric disorders in homes with guns (Miller, p. 183).
DID YOU KNOW? A gun in the home is more likely to be used in a homicide, suicide, or unintentional shooting than to be used in self-defense.

Every time a gun injures or kills in self-defense, it is used:

11 times for completed and attempted suicides (Kellermann, 1998, p. 263).
7 times in criminal assaults and homicides, and
4 times in unintentional shooting deaths or injuries.
DID YOU KNOW? Many children and teens live in homes with firearms, including ones that are loaded and unlocked.

One third of all households with children younger than eighteen have a firearm (Johnson, 2004 p.179).
More than 40% of gun-owning households with children store their guns unlocked (Schuster, p. 590).
One fourth of homes with children and guns have a loaded firearm (Johnson, 2004 p.179).
Between 6% and 14% of firearm owning households with a child under 18 have an unlocked and loaded firearm. (Johnson, 2004, p.175)
DID YOU KNOW? Parents may underestimate their children’s access to guns in the home. Women may not know about guns in the home or be unable to assure safe storage, despite wanting it.

Among gun-owning parents who reported that their children had never handled their firearms at home, 22% of the children, questioned separately, said that they had (Baxley and Miller, p. 542).
For unmarried mothers, when an adolescent boy reports a handgun in the home, nearly three-fourths of the mothers say there is no handgun in the home (Sorenson, p. 15).
Of youths who committed suicide with firearms, 82% obtained the firearm from their home, usually a parent’s firearm (The National Violent Injury Statistics System, p. 2).
When storage status was noted, about two-thirds of the firearms had been stored unlocked (The National Violent Injury Statistics System, p. 2).
Among the remaining cases in which the firearms had been locked, the youth knew the combination or where the key was kept or broke into the cabinet (The National Violent Injury Statistics System, p. 2).
Among married women living in gun-owning households, 94 percent believed in safe gun-storage practices but 43% of those households stored their family’s gun unsafely (Johnson, 2007, pp. 5, 8).
Women are less likely than men to own the guns in their homes (Johnson, 2007 p. 4).
Women are less likely than men to report a gun’s presence in the home (Johnson, 2004 p. 180).
SOLUTION: Without stronger, sensible gun laws, thousands upon thousands of people will continue to die and be injured needlessly each year. The Brady Campaign fights for sensible gun laws to protect you, your family, and your community.

Sources

Baxley, Fances, MD, and Matthew Miller, MD, ScD. “Parental Misperceptions About Children and Firearms.” Archives of Pediatric Adolescent Medicine. 160 (2006): 542-47.

Cook, Philip J, and Susan B. Sorenson. “’We’ve Got a Gun?’: Comparing Reports of Adolescents and Their Parents About Household Firearms.” Journal of Community Psychology 36 (2008): 1-19.

Harvard School of Public Health: Harvard Injury Control Research Center. Homicide – Suicide – Accidents – Children and Women. Boston: Harvard School of Public Health, 2009. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/firearms-research/guns-and-death/index.html.

Johnson, Renee M., MPH, Tamera Coyne-Beasley, MD, MPH, and Carol W. Runyan, PhD. “Firearm Ownership and Storage Practices, U.S. Households, 1992-2002.” American Journal of Preventive Medicine 27 (2004): 173-82.

Johnson, R.M., et al. “Storage of Household Firearms: An Examination of the Attitudes and Beliefs of Married Women with Children.” Health Education Research Advance Access (2007): 1-11.

Kellermann, Arthur L. MD., MPH, et al. “Gun Ownership As a Risk Factor for Homicide in the Home.” New England Journal of Medicine 329 (1993) 1084-1119.

Kellermann, Arthur L.MD, MPH, et al. “Injuries and Deaths Due to Firearms in the Home.” Journal of Trauma, Injury, Infection, and Critical Care 45 (1998): 263-67.

Kellermann, Arthur L.MD, MPH, et al. “Suicide in the Home in Relation to Gun Ownership.” New England Journal of Medicine 327 (1992): 467-72.

Miller, M, et al, “Recent Psychopathology, Suicidal Thoughts and Suicide Attempts in Households With and Without Firearms: Findings from the National Comorbidity Study Replication,” Injury Prevention 15(2009): 183-187

Miller, Matthew, David Hemenway, and Deborah Azrael. “State-Level Homicide Victimization Rates in the US in Relation to Survey Measures of Household Firearm Ownership, 2001-2003.” Social Science and Medicine 64 (2007) 656-64.

Miller, Matthew, Deborah Azrael, and David Hemenway. “Household Firearm Ownership and Suicide Rates in the United States.” Epidemiology 13 (2002) 517-524. Originally accessed through Harvard School of Public Health: Means Matters. Source of Firearms in Youth Suicides. Boston: Harvard School of Public Health, 2009. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/youth-access/index.html.|

Schuster, Mark A., Franke, Todd M., Bastian, Amy M., Sor, Sinaroth, Halfon, Neal. "Firearm Storage Patterns in U.S. Homes With Children," American Journal of Public Health 90(4) (April 2000):588-594

Sorenson, Susan B., Cook, Philip J., "'We've Got a Gun?': Comparing Reports of Adolescents and Their Parents About Household Firearms," Journal of Community Psychology 36 (1) (2008):1-19

The National Violent Injury Statistics System. Youth Suicide: Findings from a pilot for the National Violent Death Reporting System. Boston: Harvard Injury Control Research Center: Harvard School of Public Health, 2009. http://www.sprc.org/library/YouthSuicideFactSheet.pdf. Originally accessed through Harvard School of Public Health: Means Matters. Source of Firearms in Youth Suicides. Boston: Harvard School of Public Health, 2009. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/youth-access/index.html.

Wiebe, Douglas J. PhD. “Homicide and Suicide Risks Associated With Firearms in the Home: A National Case-Control Study.” Annals of Emergency Medicine 41 (2003): 771-82.

Guess that's only natural, just as if there are less cars, would'nt it be less
car accidents who cause death or other damage/injury?

Cheers
GJ

see what i mean about statistics ? what link does suicide rates have to do with gun ownership ? nothing at all ! Your state of mind doesnt alter to self destruction just because you might own a gun . come on !!!