'80% of the 76 market is nothing to dismiss so lightly. But Yamaha ARE. No other company makes 76's as a loss leader for their other arrangers. ALL of them make a profit. Why Yamaha doesn't want a piece of this (the larger piece, from these figures!) is one of life's great mysteries.'

You cant be serious Diki !! Did you just extrapolate 80% of the 76key arranger market would by a 76 key yamaha from a poll of maybe 10 people who said they would buy a 76 key yamaha on this forum ?

If you made that as a serious statement then your credibility in terms of your business acumen is shot to hell. You can critiscise yamaha's business strategies all you want but you cant convince anyone with half a brain with figures like that. If yamaha made their business decisions based on the logic you just demonstrated they would be bust in a week.

Don't be absurd! If eight out of ten people on ANY thread said they preferred Yamaha 61's to any other brand's 61's, the same Yamaha fanboys that want to shoot this idea down would be touting it as incontrovertible proof of how good Yamaha's are!

And if eight out of ten people on any open keyboard thread went in favor of it, you too would be using it as 'evidence' of the validity of your point.

Of COURSE it's not scientific proof. Neither are exit polls, or Gallup Polls used to 'prove' all KINDS of idiotic things about politics. But it's all we got, here. And, sorry, old boy, but if the figures were reversed, and 8 out of 10 people said they WOULDN'T be interested in a Yamaha 76, you would be all over that as 'proof' of whatever YOU feel, too!

When 'there's no demand for them' is the #1 hoary chestnut dribbled out every time this idea comes up, one would at least expect that figures here would reflect figures in general. After all, take a poll, probably there are more Yamaha players on this forum than any other brand. Apparently, that DOESN'T at least give a good indication that Yamaha are the best selling arrangers. No numbers here proves ANYTHING, apparently...

Here's the ridiculous part... If no numbers here account for anything, then those of us that think there IS a demand for them are EXACTLY as right as those that don't think there is!

I made the point that, ON THIS THREAD ALONE, those were the numbers. If you bother to go and look at the vast majority of threads where this topic is discussed, you generally only see a majority of 61 players against the idea. If you look at the responses of ONLY 76 users, the figures go up DRASTICALLY.

This topic has a very 'en point' title. and a fair percentage of those of us here that DO play 76's chimed in. Sorry the results weren't what you wanted..

Why don't YOU start a thread to disprove it? We've done our bit. At least to dispel the myths. If Yamaha want something more scientific, they could perhaps pay the idiots they have currently doing 'market research' to ask someone OTHER than Yamaha playing 61 users... I don't know about you, but if I wanted to know something about a market I didn't currently operate in, I wouldn't ask my existing customers! I'd ask my competitors' customers...

But hey, what do I know?

Which is why I have always said the issue is not whether 76 key players would buy a good Yamaha 76 key arranger (even Yamaha knows the answer to that) but the real issue for Yamaha is whether a 76 key would stop their existing customers (61 key players) from buying Yamaha.




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TTG

Well, we do know this about you.

You believe that Yamaha can't/won't make a 76'er because their corporate structure won't allow it.

Then in the next breath, you ask them to make something you just finished saying they couldn't make. Duh?

You got a Teflon brain son...nothing seems to stick.

Then you assume that a company would change it's corporate structure just because of a dozen or so posts on this forum...most of which are filled with your assumptions.

Spalding is correct...you have no business sense.

So, what do you know?

Zilch!

Ian

Diki believes that Yamaha's corporate structure is too inflexible to allow them to make a 76'er.

So, in effect, he is saying he believes they can't make one.

Then, he asks Yamaha to make what he just said they can't make.

Now, let's pretend he is right.

Do you think Yamaha will restructure their corporation because of the posts here on SZ?

We have no real data to show how many actually want one, other than the poorly done poll and a few posts by people who wouldn't buy a Yamaha no matter how many keys it had.

Now, let's say that the reason is what was stated by the reps...one speaking to Diki and one to KingFrog...that reason being the market isn't big enough/important enough to warrant a 76'er.

Do you think Yamaha will set up production of a 76'er because of the posts here on SZ, most of which were made by people who stated on other threads, that they wouldn't buy a Yamaha no matter how many keys it had.

No matter what we choose to believe, the end result will be the same.

Only real way to solve the issue...Spalding's suggestion is the best so far.

Since Diki has spearheaded this campaign, he should do the survey....Yamaha has already done theirs.

Ian

“the market isn't big enough/important enough to warrant a 76'er.”

Really? So why did Yamaha make a PSR 9000 pro?
And, the devil is in the detail.

If you are talking a Yamaha making a 76 key keyboard like the G70 and E80, PA1x (the 61 key version), then Yamaha is correct. A heavy and bulky keyboard would not help Yamaha.


But, if Yamaha makes the nest PSR in only a 76 keys and not heavy, no more expensive than the current PSR but give it some styles sounds and features of the T4, the person who would ordinarily buy the PSR will still buy the new PSR and Yamaha will get the additional market of those who want a good 76 key Yamaha arranger. It is not rocket science people.




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TTG

It seems Mr.Diki doesn't agree with you.



I agree...giving up one of the best selling 61's would be idiotic.

No reflection on you, Genny.

Ian





[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 10-19-2010).]

For once & for all...SOME of YOU PEOPLE DON'T GET IT!
Some of us love the Yamaha sound, and style availability, but we want 76 keys...why should we have to buy another brand to get 76 keys, just because Yamaha is so stubborn..??

That's the REAL issue here. If we (76'ers)all wanted another brand that has 76 we would not be bitching! We would just buy it and be happy.

Do you think we are hitting on this just to be troublesome, no!

Something to add...in watching some of the Yamaha PRO's demos..they RUN OUT OF KEYS!
I bet you a deluxe taco that they would love to have 76 keys!
Lee S.

Sounds akin to BP and how it delt with it's oil spill..Ian..did you & Tony Hayward both get schooled at same business? ..all those people affected by the oil spill should of just got off their soapboxes what with all their attention grabbing ego's..
See both really are like an oil spill,both kind of a disaster,one enviromentally,one public diservice.

Now come on now...I'm not as dumb as you look.

I'm about as interested in politics as you are in good manners.

Ian