According to this this shop in England the estimated selling price of the 61 keys version of the PA3X will be 2900 pounds that's 3500 Euro.

No change in the world I will pay that amount of money for an arranger. If it will really cost that much Korg can stick the PA3X in their ... well you know what I mean.

Typical TOTL arranger prices in the UK

Tyros 4 £3217

PA2x £2150 – 2500

Audya £3999

So if the price of the PA3x is correct, it’s about par for the course. (And let’s face it, Yamaha are selling T4s as fast as they can make them)

Bill

If its true then the PA3X 61 keys will cost 1500 Euro more then the PA800. That's ridiculous. The list price of the PA800 is 2300 Euro and you can buy him at the moment for 1800 Euro.

I dont think the Pa3x (61) is a direct replacement for the PA800. It is a replacement for the PA2x but just a 61 key version.

I predict a PA800 replacement will come out with built in speakers / only 3 sliders (not 9) etc and it will keep the same price that the PA800 was when it came out.

Nick

Spot on NIck

The PA800 is discontinued.

The new arranger series is JUST the PA3. It comes in either a 61 note or 76 note version. That's it!!!

Whether Korg decide to release a cheaper downmarket version "similar" to the PA500, is yet to be determined.

Although one thing, I WISH they would put the keybed from the 73 note Kronos in instead... Imagine having those beautiful fully weighted keys to play mmmmmmm

Not so good for more Synth players who need the fast action keybed

Dennis

I thought I had read somewhere that the PA3X 61 was the replacement of the PA800 but I could be wrong.

Anyway if these prices are correct then the Kronos with 61 keys is almost 1000 Euro cheaper then the PA3x with 61 keys.

I agree it sucks - the Motif XF61 is about $1500-$2000 AUD cheaper than the Tyros 4

Yes if these prices are right my choice is made and that's a Roland BK-7M for 850 Euro at woodbrass and keep my PA500.

Sorry Korg

Don't forget the optional $600.00 speaker attachment.

Ha ha good one Dnj. $600 is about 400 Euro plus 3500 is 3900 Euro is a new car almost.

The Pa3 would make a great keyboard for a new Korg user, or one with a PA500, or a PA1X...Not really for PA2x owners I don't think..

Got to lay out too much cash. The going second hand price for a PA2x (76) in Oz at the moment is from $2400 to $2800 (and they have to be in excellent condition as well)...So with those prices PA2x owners will need to stump up some serious $'s

For me, the Kronos + Roland MK7 module, or the MO XS/XF + Roland Module, or even the Groove XR + vArranger software and a 76 piano are looking more attractive, AND much cheaper

Dennis

I'd really wait till you actually hear the styles on the new Roland Module before you jump the gun..if they are not up to par with teh TOTl arrangers on the market today whats the sense?

With these prices also not for a PA500 owner Dennis

Yes Donny I will wait to hear some demo's, styles and sounds before I decide.

Korg should really release the actual prices of the PA3X and release some demo's by now. I really don't know why they are waiting so long.

I have

You have hear the BK 7m Dennis?

I just have visit sweetwater.com and they sell the PA3x 61 for $3699 that is in Euros 2675. That sound more believable and for that price I will buy one.

Amazed, no utterly dumbfounded I am by all that has been said about the new Korg so far.
If you were to read the comments on the German Korg forum by co-programmer Jurgen Satorius you should know by now that all is pretty much conjecture, both about the capabilities of the new Korg as well as about the pricing. The presentation at NAMM was a laugh and a big mistake....

I have followed Korg's progress in arranger keyboard land since the introduction of the renowned i3 way back when, and I think it would be silly to expect Korg to come up with a PA-3X with only marginal improvements on its predecessor. But as pointed out on the German site there will NOT be any worthwile quality demos, details etc.etc. until Frankfurt, early April.

As far as pricing is concerned, the latest quote from Frans which he obtained from the Sweetwater site is a lot nearer the mark in my view. I would venture to predict that the officical prices for the the two models and the amp system will be approx.
3500, 3000, 500 euros. (I am not talking about streetprices mind you). But again, it is only my opinion for what it is worth......

greetings,
John Smies
Holland

they are all great instruments, but they are all ridicolously expensive.

A new PA800 is £ 1600....that's what I would expect to pay for a new top of the line arranger. A bit more if it has semiweighted keys, no more than £ 250 more. Hey they can be bought for £ 200, why don't arranger manufacturers buy M-audio semiweighted keyboards and slap them on their arrangeres).

But paying £ 3999 ? 3500 ? 2900 ? get out of here...

2900 would be reasonable for an arranger that's seriously upgradable with REASONABLY CHEAP upgrades, none of that £ 200 to expand the video out stuff ! That's ridicolous....

In Oz, the best advertised price for a Tyros 4 is around $5299 without wheeling and dealing, plus around $299.99 for the 1GB of flash ROM, that I can find. I doubt the initial pricing on the Korg will be any better. More likely to be higher, and on top of that you have the speaker system (if you want that) - it sucks!

Either way, no one knows for sure, as it is all conjecture and guessing what the price will be; especially for me , as I need to upgrade big time.



Allan

US prices seem well established between $3699 to 3999. Shipping dates are quoted as March 14, although I thought I saw one as March 4th.

If Sweetwater says $3,699...it can be bought for much less...I know that for sure.
Take about $400 - $600 off that price. At least!

T4 advertised price $4,999 at Sweetwater..I know where you can get one for $3,450. That's $1,500 LESS!
Why would it be any different for Korg products?

You have to shop around.

Check this thread :

http://www.synthzone.com/forum/ubbthread..._and#Post317363

Hi Dennis,

I would hope that the prices you mention on the other thread are meant for the year 2020 !!!
Joking apart, I think they are really steep, I would not mind a bet that the ones I mentioned will be nearer the mark. And as far as "street prices " are concerned, we all know how much lower they can go from the R.R.P.........
So..........are we on ?
best wishes,
John Smies

Hi John, nah m8, they are fair dink...It is why I am now looking at other possibilities. Even though I can get them for substantially less

I had told my dealer earlier to automatically order one for me and charge a deposit, but I have since retracted that.

The Kronos and a Roalnd MK7 is looking MIGHTY tasty...

Then again I might just keep the PA2X...it is like Diki and his G70, it's doing the job for me nicely...the PA3 is an incremental development at best, so not really worth the upgrade change-over.

Finally, are we "on" for what???

Dennis

Hi Dennis,

I can well understand being hesistant, you and all of those owning a PA-2X already. Of course for Frans and me it's another kettle of fish, only having the PA-500 at our disposal for the time being. Personally I am growing hesistant as to picking up the PA-3X or simply updating to a PA-800/PA-2X which would leave me with almost 2000 dollars to spare !! So, like you ,but from a different perspective I will be very critical about the forthcoming model.
Are we on ? I was only referring to your estimate of the official prices and my estimate which I consider nearer the mark. All conjecture all the same I admit !!!!!

As to the Roland arranger module, it may have the sounds but it seems mighty clumsly to operate and change things on the fly. Mind you I am not speaking from personal experience that much may be clear.

Actually John they are NOT estimates of the official prices in Australia they ARE the official prices.

The only thing that will change them is if there is a substantial change in the Australian-v-US dollar exchange rate. Ours is current listed at a little above parity at the moment.

Dennis

Why doesn't anyone just think of the research & development and expense to design these wonderful instruments in ratio to the price...
The time and effort alone is worth many times the selling value. Then because some people want them but can't afford them they complain about the price. The technology involved in making these units is incredible compared to just a few years ago. Not to mention the enjoyment they bring to the player & audiences. In my opinion we're getting an amazing bargain.

No offence, but what a load of old tosh!!

I think Dennis has posted about how expensive keyboards are in Oz... Did you ever find whether it was a tax issue that makes them so high, or do your dealers just manage a higher margin?

Got to admit, I always feel a bit guilty whenever I see you posting about those keyboard prices, but then, every trip to the hospital, I think that high keyboard prices aren't so bad after all!

BTW, takle a look at the BK-7m manual... it seems that remote operation and selection of UPG's seems a bit better than older Roland's, as you would expect from a module. For a grand, it still seems like a LOT of bang for the buck.

I agree. Prices are becoming ridiculously prohibitive for high-end arrangers. For instance, my Tyros1 was half the price of a Tyros3 or Tyros4. And that's just in a few short year(s) time span we're talking about. But Yammie, Korg and Ketron are able to get away with charging these ridiculous amounts because far too many consumers seem willing to oblige manufacturers and keep forking over wads of money every three or four years i.e. every arranger "cycle" when each successive product comes out and will likely upgrade to the next supposedly latest greatest arranger product. You have to remember most arranger players are 'older' i.e. many of them are retirees with mountains of cash to "burn". >> You know, like DonM and Fran have. lol

If consumers banded together to withhold their enormous stashes of money manufacturers would be obligated to significantly reduce their ridiculous prices to more reasonable standards needless to say. If they didn't they would start to teeter on the edge of financial collapse and eventually go "belly up" if they refused to do an about face. Without "us" they are nothing needless to say. That is the reason they exist in the first place i.e. because a sufficient amount of consumers buy their products thus giving them a viable market to sell their product(s) in the marketplace. There would need to be a "revolt" among consumers essentially telling keyboard manufacturers we simply refuse to pay your ridiculously exorbitant prices for your high-end products any longer and it wouldn't be long before Yammie, Ketron, Korg (and others) would have to submit and comply to the will of their customer base and potential customer base and you would see their prices drop across the board as a result. Until that happens, Yammie, Korg, Ketron (and others) will be all too happy to keep charging "an arm & leg" for their products to naive consumers who seem oblivious to the "rip-off" that is dangled in front of them like a worm on a hook to a pack of otherwise hungry fish. Or in this particular scenario hungry consumers with many of them having 'mountains' of cash to burn and nowhere better to spend it apparently. Easy come, easy go, right?

Now before anyone gets riled up or feels offended I am a consumer, just like you - and I am only saying these things for consumer(s) benefit, not to denigrate people with mounds of cash to burn who buy prohibitively expensive high-end arranger products every two or three years - on a whim. To each his own. But prices will continue to "skyrocket" if enough consumers continue to fork over these ridiculous amounts of money for these bloody keyboards that still only have 128 note polyphony (except the Audya which has 197) and in Yammie's case - still only has 61 keys and still encased in a 'plastic' shell with minuscule amounts of internal memory coming as standard. And for that matter the Ketron as well has only minuscule amounts of internal memory. When will we wake up??

Diki, I really think it is the distributor who is doing the gouging...

Because in truth, apart from shipping costs (which by the way should ALSO be similar - Italy to USA or Italy to Australia), with the exchange rate at parity, they should be pretty much the same price here as there (USA).

There are no serious taxes involved, only 2.5% import duty. And a GST (VAT) of 10% which is, I believe 8% lower than yours..

So no, I am totally convinced it is the distributor (in this case Musiclink , now owned by Allens - one of the major chains here) that is gouging everyone!!

I totally agree on the BK7m. It is looking better and better all the time

Dennis

No offense taken ...I just feel people want everything for free with no regard for what goes into it to bring it to market. Also how many times more than the original purchase will they make in profit if you use it for professional purposes...to me its a very small investment for the return....no tosh mate..

Mike, curious how much you paid for your Tyros 1.
I got my Tyros 1 in Dec 2002 for around $2,800 US street price, and the Tyros 4 US street price is now 20% higher (more or less).
So to me, even at 23%, the increase seems in line considering 8+ years of inflation (2.855/year).

Market research testing determines these prices...
they know what they are doing as to make a profit which they are obviously doing worldwide. Just because a few people complain doest deter them worldwide. I love a Ferrari but I cant afford one ....But they are still selling them to who can. One can always wait also to buy a good used item also down the road too and save a few bucks.

I guess the point is Donny, that as our two countries have the same value currency (actually ours is a bit higher than yours at the moment), and shipping costs are very similar, and OUR taxes are way lower than your taxes, then ipso facto, the keyboards should be an equivalent value or maybe even a bit cheaper, yes?

At the very least, and all things being equal, we should get them here for what you pay there.

All I want is a fair go from the distributors here, NOT the retailers, who for the most part do a great job with dwindling margins set by??? You guessed it..the DISTRIBUTORS (or wholesalers if you prefer)... who are just greedy bastards, and for whom enough money, is never enough!!

Dennis

Dennis....my thoughts are for the "USA prices" vs the technology.....
But, I can understand your frustration & concern being you live in another country far away from here.

Yes, you should be able to get them for basically the same price as we do here in Canada. That is a very unfair situation you are in.

Dennis, if you bought a PA3X(pro?) and sold your PA2Xpro, what would the difference be, roughly?

Also, what I'm getting at as well, are second hand instruments expensive?

This is all within Australia, let's say.

Ian

Hey Ian,

S/H instruments are not that expensive really. But on the whole, I would rate them as more expensive than the US, but ONLY because of the much bigger market available there.

As a rule of thumb, most keyboards listed on Ebay here for example usually achieve approx 30% higher prices than the equivalent keyboard on US Ebay. Of course you get the odd bargain, but for the most part this is fairly accurate.

On the listed retail I would have to stump up approx $4k, AFTER selling the PA2xPro...They are selling for around the $2800 mark at the moment, although with such high retail pricing, I have a feeling that will stay the benchmark, even after the release of the PA3.

I cannot give you my actual change-over (after my buy price) as that is sorta hush-hush with my dealer so I hope the change-over based on retail will suffice

Dennis

PA3X??????

Why thats a Casio WK-7500!!!!!!!


OHMIGOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You write copy for Charlie Sheen..?

DonM

Just got word from a local dealer that the delivery of the very first PA-3X models has been postponed. ETA is now JUNE......
(???)

John

Long wait

Wow now June? or later?......wonder what changes they are NOW making sine their impromptu release at NAMM?....hope it's all for the good...I also wouldn't be surprised if they redesigned the optional speaker system also.....maybe the whole pre release demo thing at NAMM was planned that way (BAD) to create a stir and then they make the necessary changes based on feedback and blow our minds when it is officially released?

John,
Is that for your country only or is ALL shipments delayed??

Oh I am sure the PA3x will blow our minds.

Of course the PA3X is expensive...isn't it true that "you get what you pay for."

Ian

There is a difference between expensive and too expensive.

But the price mentioned was wrong. The PA3x 61 will proberly cost only 2700 Euro in the Netherlands and that is a good price.

Lee,

I don't know about that , all I know is the email I got from a dealer in the region. Knowing they are among the first to have them I would assume it goes for all shipments, but that's only guessing. I agree with Frans that presumably the streetprice of the 61 version will be approx. 2700/2800 euros. And of course the Germans are still programming day and night on their Musikant version in order to get it ready for Frankfurt............
Ah well, something to look forward to I guess, and Patience being the mother of all virtues.....(at times)

John

Too long a wait? Anyone forgotten about the Audya..?



(I love this emoticon. Anyone know how I can make an animated version of it my Avatar? )

I said long wait not too long wait.

I believe the substantially higher price of arrangers vs workstions has everything to do with far fewer arranger units produced and sold than workstations. If arrangers became more popular than workstations, arranger prices would drop below workstations. On the otherhand, If manufacterers decide to integrate comprehensive arranger features into their workstations, they'd want to jack up their workstation prices, which would piss off the larger workstation crowd who don't give a hoot about auto accomp features. Is there anything that will keep everyone happy? hmm.

Er, lower prices for arrangers? Maybe the kids would give them a second chance if not absurdly overpriced compared to WS's?

You mean like my avatar now

Doh!

Another brilliant idea stolen...

Yes, SZ might not be for the "faint of heart"...Ha ha...especially when the "what's NEXT" is a "brilliant idea" instantly pilfered!

There oughta be a law...

I got sued by stealing someone else idea so I change my Avatar

Poor Diki, the Salieri of SZ!!

LOL... FransN, I was just kidding... Not even SURE I want to go that route. Just a momentary lapse of reason!

Mind you, how did you do it? (just in case I have another one)

Yes I know you were kidding, so was I



Just move your mouse over the picture and right click your mouse. Then choose save picture as and saved it to your desktop. Then you can upload the pic to your SZ profile.

Thanks