Why was it necessary to post this link twice? You already posted it here:
http://www.synthzone.com/forum/ubbthread..._KOR#Post318724

It's nice that it has drawbars vs Nords button system...
I think the Roland has a nice look...don't you? Now to find one in a store to play.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnzyV8YHV2w&feature=related

Dennis,

I think Donny just wanted to start a new topic on the Roland organ, as it was kind of getting in the way of the other thread about Fran's PA-800 experience.

This organ is going to appeal to the arranger player...the Nord does not!

This organ has real drawbars...the Nord does not.

Keyboards are smaller (shorter) than the Nord's two 61-note manuals, but, I think it's a great design.

I'm looking forward to trying this one out for sure.

Ian

Yes you are 100% correct Ian, my bad...Sorry Donny

And yes it is a mean looking beasty alright, LOOKS like it offers more bang for $ than the Nord for sure...

As for a Piano based arranger along similar lines (you mentioned this in another thread), I don't think so. Not according to my "research".

The BK7M was released to ADD arranger functionality to the entire piano range. There are no plans for an integrated arranger, vis-a-vis the Korg PA588...

But that could change

Dennis

I did notice the last while back that Roland was adding arranger-type features to some of their "combo" pianos..."Session Partner" being a basic auto-accompaniment system.

Certainly makes sense, at least to us arranger players.

I honestly can't see a G-70/E-80 type replacement.

Ian

Ditto

Sorry, but it weighs 54 lbs without legs. And no offense, but did you LISTEN to it? Garbage, compared to the Nord. And a street price of $5,500 or so

Even I am not appealed to by this, and I am one of the VERY few willing to lug a 45 lb arranger around!

I could be wrong, but as far as I can tell, it breaks down into two parts, besides the legs, so that would make transporting much easier.

I think it sounds pretty darn good...of course, I like the VK-7/8 as well.

Sounds very much like the G-70's organ to me, only better options, like the real drawbars, and two manuals.

Probably more of an "organ" action as well.

I'm looking forward to playing one.

The Nord has no arranger functions whatsoever, and isn't even a good controller for using a BK7M, for example.

It's fine if all you want/need is a dual manual organ...I like having the accompaniments, myself.

Ian

Now if Roland can get Tony Monaco to demo it (slim chance) they might sell a few

BK-7m doesn't NEED a fancy controller. You read the manual yet? There's a mode where it only needs to see ONE MIDI channel to get all the Parts, splits, layers, you name it.

And yes, you are wrong (it happens!). It only breaks down into the top section (at 54 lbs) and the legs.

I have friends with the VK8, and others with Electro's (which aren't even as good as the C1) and the difference is night and day. You know how big a Roland fan I am, but when they get it wrong, I am not going to stand by and let it slide! Plus, a VK8 is MUCH better than the G70's VK section. They got a couple of essential things really wrong, like distortion being ONLY after the final volume fader, so no way in hell to get a heavy grind without heavy volume as well, and a pre-Leslie reverb send, so no way to put reverb on the Leslie! Oh, and no way to route it to the separate outs, to run into a real Leslie if you have one (or a Motion Sound, which I do). It might be one of the better drawbar sims in an arranger, but that's not saying a lot, compared to dedicated clones like these!

Plus, a C1 is lighter AND narrower than a T4, even, let alone this monster. And please, just go to the C1 demo page, then the VK8 or Atelier demo page. If the Roland was better (or even close) I would say it, but this doesn't cut it, IMO.

I would take a C1 and a BK-7m over this any day of the week and twice on Sundays..!

Thanks Diki.

It's certainly not like I'm going out and buy one of these things.

I do like the VK-8 organ a lot...I play one from time to time, and the sound is rich and warm...I like the Leslie sim too, but the Hammond XK1 is much better.

I played the C1 quite a bit...it's "not bad" at all, but I didn't care for the action, nor do I like the draw-buttons at all.

My next choice from the real B-3 would be a Hammond XK3c system, and then, the XK1, although the latter's action isn't nearly as good, it's still a far site better, in my opinion, than the Nord...plus, the two Nord C1 used for rental, both developed awfully noisy keys...harder than normal use? Maybe, but still something to consider, if you have to turn up the Leslie to mask the clicking of the action...unless you can make it into a percussion track?

If you like the Nord sound, it's a nice rig...I couldn't warm up to it, but that's what makes us individuals.

Ian

BTW, doesn't this thing CRY out for a beefy lid and handles on the side? That's how it used to be done back in the day... A case for this is going to weigh 30 lbs+!

Plus, where are the pitch bend and mod wheels? I know a C1 doesn't have them either, but it isn't even TRYING to be anything else!

Doh!

You seen the PRICE for a two manual XK-3c system?

That's the thing about the C1. Maybe not perfect (but you CAN get used to the buttons... you did with the Tyros until they put sliders on!), but it's the only thing that doesn't cost a FORTUNE and weigh a TON.

And if there's anything I've learned here, it's that those two trump most everything else!

I thought the absence of the pitch/mod wheels/lever a big dumb mistake.

I also play an old Roland VK-1000 organ on occasions...it's actually a pretty decent instrument, with plenty of options regarding phasers, flangers and the like...the keyboard isn't the best for the piano/electric tones it can do, but it's "not bad" for organ.

Even back then, the bender lever can be used like the half moon Leslie switch on the B-3...very cool.

Very heavy instrument...best left in a studio...that's where this one sits.

Ian

Sad story... I've had a friend tell me for about a year about a Hammond sitting unused in a church for decades, that they wanted to sell for maybe a grand or more. Nothing more than that description. No Leslie, no nothing.

So, I take a pass. I've seen altogether too many ratty L100's and beat up T-series with next to nothing working in old churches to want to take this seriously (plus a grand is a grand!).

But last week, my friend says he needs help moving it, he's going to buy it and fix it up. So we borrow some Hammond dollies from the local dealer, and take a truck and go get it. Imagine my horror when we get there, and it's a pristine B3 (a late model with the plastic drawbar end caps) with full pedalboard, a Leslie 122, fully working except the Leslie won't go to slow (it's stuck on fast) and slightly noisy drawbars...

My friend talks them down from the grand because of the stuck Leslie, and we roll it out of there for $800US.

I nearly died! I guess, a lesson learned. Never assume that an unused old Hammond is going to be a dog EVERY time.

Shoot me now... put me out of my misery..!

The B-3 I play at the jam sessions has had the honor of holding up my Tyros4.

The guys are simply astonished at the sound of the Tyros4...and these guys are hard to impress.

Notable sounds...the piano (Live!Grand Piano), the SA Finger Amp and SA Rock Hero guitars, the SA2 Jazz Sax and SA2 Breathy Sax...the SA2 Harmonica, the Cool Suitcase EP.

Even the SA Organs like Whiter Bars, and All Bars Out were raved about, and this is in a room with a real B-3 and Leslie sitting in it!

Yamaha hit this one right out of the park!

Ian

It's hard to tell from any on-line music posting, but, like Diki, I think the Roland falls way short of the C-1 and even further from either the original B-3 or even the older Suzuki/Hammond single boards (XB-2) for example.

Gotta love that Hammond and, with adjustments for no real drawbars and a compact size and 33lb. weight, the funky little C-1.


Russ

Still waiting to hear Tonewheeldude's take on the Studiologic Numa KeyB derivative...

Got to admit, that KeyB kinda does it for me (the original, anyway). Shame they are so expensive, but wow!