Hi Fran,
The reason I am sticking with this is I feel I owe it to those who have read my posts here and on the Roland forum about my experiences. I don't want to come across as just an unhappy owner with buyer's remorse. The module is a good product for those who need what it will do and will never miss those things it can not do for them. Probably I will have it for sale in the very near future - but this is only my experience and will not be the same for all owners. Seems to me the module is really meant for instruments other than keyboards. Anyway, I'll give the multiple user programs per song a try and see how practical it is for me to use in live gigging.

I did not have the module connected to my Tyros 4 long enough to really tell if the voices sounded better. I'll try it again the next day or so and see.

Gosh, I could have bought another E50 for half the price this thing cost.

Deane

That just doesn't sound right to me, that the controller could have any influence in the way the sounds are produced, other than issues with touch sensitivity or after touch. There may be, and almost certainly are, velocity curves than can be set on the controller. That could have an effect, but other than that, the controller merely sends a message to the module to make the sound. No way it can change it or color it that I can see.
Hope to get my module back from Roland soon.
I'm thinking that the Roland guy has no experience with modules and controllers.
Don't give up yet Deane.
DonM

I just hooked up the BK-7m to my Tyros 4 and you wouldn't believe the difference in the sound output of the voices!. I have tried a lot of the styles with the OTS settings I didn't like. Some I still don't like - but there are many that sound a lot better using my Tyros 4 as the controller rather than the A-800. Now I need to learn how to program the darn controller to get rid of all the weird sounds it must be producing - or maybe just junk it and look at other options.

I'am working on a way to do some recordings of all of this but I only have a Canon 60D camera to do that with. I want to record the sound coming out of my Bose speakers and not the recorded sounds of the BK-7M so you can hear what I am hearing in real time.

More later,
Deane

Deane,
Get you one of these:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/757065-REG/Tascam_DR_05_DR_05_Portable_Handheld_Digital.html

... before they are gone. It's a great recorder for small change. You might even find a better price somewhere.
DonM

Deane, your controller must be sending some commands that are changing the effects or e.q. on the module voices. You mentioned that when you pushed buttons on it, the module was affected in various ways, so it has to be something like that.
My controller, which is similar to yours, works fine.
I'll trade you if you like!
DonM

Some sounds are brighter at a higher velocity level, and the Yamaha keys are lighter than other controllers, so maybe the same sound appears to have more "color" when played by the Tyros because it's triggering at a higher level with the same finger pressure. I had that issue years ago with the DX7 .... the same piano tone sounded different from other controllers.

The original DX-7 did not produce the 0-128 level of velocity, so when triggered by another keyboard, it's sounds tended to sound brighter (actually, a bit too bright).

The Tyros (all models) sends the full 0-128 levels of velocity.

Ian

I understand that the DX was a prehistoric beast in the field of midi, but my point is that a sound created for a Yamaha instrument would have been played on a Yamaha keybed and tweaked to sound as they wanted. Perhaps velocity #111 is a "favorite" place on a T4, but not so much on a different controller. The playing surface is huge in sound perception, as is key feel. It all plays a part in how the sound engine is ultimately accessed. Two players on the same instrument produce different results too... that's why there is so much debate on key feel around here.
Man, I remember when that first DX7 hit the stages though .... it was all over the radio in pop tunes, and evryone started dumping their Rhodes .... silly, silly people.!

Dave,

From what I understand, what the Tyros4 transmits in terms of velocity through MIDI has nothing to do with how the internal sounds of the instrument itself respond to the keybed.

As long as it is transmitting the full range (0-128), which it does, the instrument on the receiving end shouldn't have any issues.

It's internal sounds may interpret velocity in various ways (especially SA/SA2/Mega) but what it transmits via the MIDI OUT will still be in a window of 0-128....the key feel/response of the Tyros4's FSX keyboard, whether being used to trigger internal sounds, or a MIDI module, is considered one of the very best being made today.

I think Hammer's A-800 controller may be set up wrong...or, the BK-7m is set to receiving only a certain range of velocity value.

I didn't like the DX-7 very much, although I had to have one for doing Top 40 back in the day, especially for it's electric piano and bass sounds. The rest of the sounds were too thin and sterile for my tastes...the strings were awful. I was glad to sell it. I didn't like the DX7II much better, although you could at least stack voices to thicken the sound. Mine also had the E! mod, and made a great controller, and the action was pretty good as well, but it still didn't have the warmth I wanted.

I preferred the Roland Jupiter 8 for synth work...I still have it, although it never leaves the studio. I'd never sell it.

Ian

Dave,

Just in case I misinterpreted your post, the Tyros4 does not have an adjustable velocity curve when transmitting MIDI to another instrument, as you would have on, let's say, a dedicated MIDI controller like Hammer's A-800.

It does have an adjustable touch response for the keyboard (Soft2, Soft1, Normal, Hard1, Hard2) but whether this affects the MIDI output (it might), I do not know.

I don't use the Tyros4 as a controller.

Ian