Surprisingly, he doesn't use one of the most obvious uses for this... the FM8 software that modeled the original DX-7!

So maybe to take a few steps forward we need to take a few steps backwards....take out the old DX7. Personally, I love the machine and what it could do.



Yes, the only shortcoming was the editing. But after I bought the software package to edit it on the screen you zipped right through making sounds. And you could modulate those sounds in so many ways. I have a hankering to pull it out and listen to it again.

But, getting back to the breath controller, I hear what you're saying....not practical on samples....great explanation.

But then.....even if it worked as well as on the DX7, the more I thought about it the more I reminded myself this is not the 70's anymore when a good OMB reigned supreme. Now no one really cares if you have a breath controller or a lollipop in your mouth.

It's a shame now that we have all this technology and pretty much nowhere to go with it.

There is a very interesting debate about the breath controller sampling vs. modeling argument here



And he attached a couple of impressive MP3s to his message.

It's interesting though, that he sticks to easier instruments to emulate than the saxophone...

As I mentioned earlier (with reference to the E. Piano smoothness), you start to use sampled libraries with dozens of samples per note, and much of the shortcomings of samples can be mitigated. But you are still faced, especially with the saxophone, which has probably the largest timbrel difference of any wind instrument for even one note, that simple blowing doesn't really begin to cut it. With reed instruments (and brass), there's a LOT you do to change the timbre by mouthpiece pressure, biting down a bit harder on the reed, changing the angle of the reed in your mouth, how hard or softly you tongue the note, how you shape your mouth, things like that. It doesn't boil down to such a simple thing as how hard you are blowing, which is all a MIDI mouthpiece tracks. Some of the dedicated sax controllers tracked more parameters, like bite strength, but that's not much use if you can't already play a reed instrument, and if you can, why use emulation in the first place?!

The combination of modeling AND samples seems to be currently the best way for sax emulation, but again, NONE of this is available in an arranger. SA2 seems to be King of the Hill so far in arrangers, but again, you have to play what the sample set does best, NOT necessarily what you want to do!

Eventually, we are likely to see arrangers based on something like the Kronos engine, which supports various synthesis options including samples AND modeling, and things may well improve. But until then, emulating saxophones remains an exercise in frustration, forcing you to play what the sample set does best rather than whatever you feel like..!

This guy is able to control his Samplemodeling sax with just a breath controller and mod wheel, he is simply amazing. The sax bit starts in the middle around 3:30

I don't gig anymore and I love the Yamaha Stand, LS7. It does not fold up so for gigging, it's not really suited. As far as
being sturdy, it's the best. I use the Yamaha Vol. pedal and a
piano style sustain pedal. Playing the organ for years I find
myself still "button pushing" for changing presets. Lloyd

I still have my Yamaha CS-01 mono analog synth, and it has the breath-controller feature. Very expressive on nearly every sound. It has two rotary dials to adjust how it affects the sound.

I run it through the Tyros4's Mic input.

Ian

Just using a breatcontroller..

mastering a breathcontroller takes months of dedicated training, atleast for me it did... Mastering a breathcontroller gives you so much power when playing virtuall acoustic instruments like trumpets, saxes and trombones.. but also flutes and more

real time controll is truely the weak points of arrangers...for real time controll you could use all sorts of things...

-pedals (switch-damper-volume)
-knobs
-sliders
-breathcontroller
-wheels
-dpad
-vector stick
-touch sensitive slider
-touchscreen interface
-D-beam

My set up has all of these, because i just enjoy havin gmeans to controll stuff in real time..


How many of these does your arranger have? And how many do you use?

The trouble with all this and traditional arranger play is, you HAVE to use pitch wheels and all those other controllers to get the fluid sound of the sax. Basically, a sax player bends, in a small or larger way, almost EVERY single note.

How are you going to play the arranger chords AND sit there with your hand glued to the bender, mod wheel, and all the SA switches and other input devices? This is why, to be perfectly frank, I don't honestly think I've ever heard a LIVE arranger sax solo that sounded even a fraction as good as the audio demos for the SA type sax sounds on the factory demos. These are all done with sequencers, and most likely a two handed first take, then a bunch of editing.

Be interested in hearing anything done live that equals those factory demos...

The guy in the video I posted seems to be improvising, without editing. Here's another one from him