Thing is afaiacs, a lot of so called improv is merely the recital of scales.

In a lot of stuff there is no alternate melodies being played over an existing chordal movement, just a bunch of full or part jazz scales. TBH, it all gets rather boring listening to it. I can play scales, at quite a fast tempo as well, but I tend to try and re-create my own melodies over the chords as an improv, not just play a scale or two and call it original. I will even on occasion change the chordal structure, most of the time it is rather subtle.

Further, I think on this forum a lot of support or kudos tends to go only to those that are "liked" or are well known, and it is strongly objectified on many occasions. There are several little "cliques" on this forum that at times make it an unpleasant place to hang out at.

Lots of pretenders, not many princes.

Anyhow, good luck with your "COMPETITION" is anyone running a book?

I will be posting a few more tunes to my SC site, but I won't be advertising it here I can tell you, not that I am seeking or even need any comments from members here (my own enjoyment of playing the tunes is enough for me) , but it is simply not worth the grief and aggravation that many of these pissing contests here seem to engender in many members.

I do hope that the OP can remove his blinkers for long enough to realise there is more to jazz, improv and interpretation than simply playing a sh@#load of notes with no real theme, very quickly.

That's me done.
Cheers

I played trombone on Bourbon St. back in the 70's
I was very good. I got that way by turning on the jazz radio station and jamming with it every night from 12 yrs through 17 yrs old. After that I was working 3 to 5 nights a week. New Orleans didn't check ID's back then. I got good by playing all the time. The herbs worked for me and Mr Armstrong although I never found herbs as good as Mr Armstrong!!!
I read part one book on playing Jazz by Jerry Coker. When I read the line that said "If people can figure out what you are going to play next most of the time they will get bored. If people can never figure out what you are going to play next they will lose interest" I got it and pitched the book.
With that line from the book, years of playing with the radio and a few herbs I was the real deal.
I no longer play the horn or puff herbs. Music is a hobby that I am a bit of a dud at but it's better than watching TV!

Hey Brooster..! I didn't get to Bourbon St. to play until the very late 90's. Wish I could have been there in my teens! It has gone so far downhill with respect to jazz, I rarely go there anymore. The good stuff is all out towards Frenchman and the Faubourg Marigny.

Trombone was my major through college, but by the time I got to Bourbon, I was doing keyboards and LH bass (in a 9 piece, no less!) and they already had a t'bone player (and a good one at that) so I rarely got to play it.

The Big Easy must have been such a blast back then!

I also agree with your 'jam along to the radio' approach. No matter what form of music you are trying to get down, jamming with the best is the way to do it, and seeing as it's hard to get on stage with them while you are learning, sneaking up on them while they play on the radio works great!

And if you were playing 3-5 nights a week in NOLA, don't put yourself down. You aren't a dud (unless you are comparing yourself to Watrous!), and the horn awaits...

And Denniss... yes, up to a certain point, a lot of the high tempo stuff is scales, modes, arepeggio's. But the greats go beyond it. And move the harmonic structure behind what they are doing their thing on so much, it's hard to figure out WHAT pins it down inside their head while they do the scales.

I agree with you that, at least for me, MY solo improv style is to simply come up with an alternate melody, hopefully as strong as the main melody, and decorate around that a bit. Particularly coming from the 'bone (not as agile as most horns, unless you are Carl Fontana!) this being forced into a slower style allows my little guy inside my head to sing, and all I do is play what he sings. And the singing voice is nowhere near as agile as a sax!

In fact, what little teaching I do about improv mostly revolves around trying to get the student to link their voice with their instrument. Most of us can scat a reasonable decent solo on our voices. No instrument to get in the way, no fingering, no nothing but our minds and our voice (the most connected instrument to your brain you'll ever have). So, if you can scat a decent solo, just learn to play what you can scat! Easy..!

So I get them to do simple exercises, sing a bar, play the same thing you just sang. Sing two bars, play what you sang. Sing eight bars, sing sixteen... Pretty soon the connection between what you hear in your head and what you play is made. Your instrument now BECOMES your voice! And that's when the magic starts to happen.

Don't worry about anyone else's approach, whether confrontational or not. Let it go. Be confident in your own system, let the results do the talking!

Thanks Diki...fwiw your teaching method is EXACTLY how I do it.

I sing as well (and not just a total improv like the one on NYSOM on SC), and it is how I get improv melodies. As I am playing I am sorta kinda "singing" the notes in my head fractionally before I play them, . Weird huh!!

Cheers m8,

Dennis

I'm pretty sure I could improvise very well on jazz. Just a matter of learning the chord changes. My hands do what they feel like doing and it usually sounds pretty good to me, although my standards may be low. I just tried it using Bebop style on the PA3X with That Old Black Magic and Route 66, probably not true jazz songs, but I know them at least.
I just play the notes that sound right and skip the ones that don't.
DonM

Listen to Oscar Peterson, Denniss... you can hear him 'grunting' what he is playing quite a lot of the time!

Often, when I use jazz studio piano players (one in particular...he easily plays me under the table)onm sessions, the hardest thing is to get him NOT to grunt. The sound is picked up by the instrument mics...not a pretty sound!


Russ

If he plays as good as Oscar, it's worth it!

WHO plays as good as OSCAR ... other than Oscar ???