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#377158 - 12/05/13 02:01 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Right on, Russ!
Whenever I visit a photography forum (my other hobby) I am amazed at the number of threads where people spend hours analyzing the sharpness of a lens or the amount of megapixels of a sensor and they buy these (very expensive) cameras or lenses to shoot awful pictures of their dogs or their sons blowing birthday candles.
Unfortunately some arranger keyboards players are not different: I have known personally at least two of them whose houses looked like a music store showroom and yet could not play a three notes chord.
Makes one think.
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#377171 - 12/05/13 07:30 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15573
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
Andrea, I didn't know you were also into photography. What seemed like another lifetime ago I was a full time, freelance, outdoor writer and wrote outdoor columns for 25 publications, many of which, unfortunately are now gone. As such, I had to provide my publishers with photos for each article. Much of what I learned was from good friend and mentor Lefty Kreh, whom I consider among the world's greatest photographers. Lefty Kreh

Just as with the keyboard, it's the person behind the lens that makes the difference. I believe you do yourself an injustice when it comes to music - IMO you ARE a great player, and your technical expertise is second to none.

Cheers,

Gary cool
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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#377175 - 12/05/13 08:01 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: travlin'easy]
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Originally Posted By: travlin'easy
Andrea, I didn't know you were also into photography. What seemed like another lifetime ago I was a full time, freelance, outdoor writer and wrote outdoor columns for 25 publications, many of which, unfortunately are now gone. As such, I had to provide my publishers with photos for each article. Much of what I learned was from good friend and mentor Lefty Kreh, whom I consider among the world's greatest photographers. Lefty Kreh

Just as with the keyboard, it's the person behind the lens that makes the difference. I believe you do yourself an injustice when it comes to music - IMO you ARE a great player, and your technical expertise is second to none.

Cheers,

Gary cool


Gary, what can I reply to words like these? blush

Like you, I have always liked to travel and my cameras were the tools I relied on to collect my memories; on my website there is a collection of pictures taken through the years ( here and here and here, if you are curious) and now that things have changed I look at them and am happy that at least have places like those to remember.
I have seen on Wikipedia that your friend Lefty Kreh is considered THE authority on fly fishing: how cool is that? cool

And you are really too kind; I, on the other hand, tend always to see what I could do to improve myself, in every possible way. I would really love to record a new song to share with you and all the other Synthzone friends. I hope to do that during the Christmas Holidays.
All the best

Andrea
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#377203 - 12/05/13 09:49 PM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Thanx for the shout, Russ ... I admit, I used to be WAY more into "stuff", but these past few years, since I started teaching ... I have shifted more thana few priorities. The thing I miss most about my old life was the extra hours I had to enjoy hanging out with my posse (Fran and Donny) - breakfast, road-trips, retail therapy sessions .... we had a great time. Now my days are filled with wide eyed (on a GOOD day) teens who eat up my every word as we share the "sound of music" together. (BTW - the Live TV broadcast tonight with Carrie Underwood was an embarrassment. She's terrible .... sang in bad keys, tried to "fluff up some runs", bad acting, terrible diction. She's a novice on a real stage. Next to Audra McDonald, she looked like a "Doe, a deer" in the headlights, but I digest ...)

I've never been a clinician, or a "player's" player, but I do pride myself on having the right "feel" for what I try to sell. I treat my voice as the main ingredient, then bass, piano (usually Rhodes) and drums next ... in THAT order. I can play all night long with those three elements under my lead vox and not get bored. I certainly love all the bells and whistles that the newer gear packs, and I USE alot of it, but my staple, bread & butter sound has been, and always will be:
Voice, Rhodes, bass, and drums.

Arrangers, MP3's sequences ... all icing on my musical cake. Maybe someday, I'll learn a few of those prettier chords that Russ and Boo like to use - you know, the ones that AREN'T really in the songs ... (smile), but for now, it simply is a poor use of my time to invest any more "tech time" into my rig or my act. I know hundreds (thousands, maybe) of tunes, I adapt quickly, get loads of referral business, and manage to enjoy myself in the process. Win/win, right?

So, thanx, Russ ... nice to be thought of from time to time. Love to come visit again real soon ... if you ever get a real coffee shop out there in horsey-town.
smile
Don - you're right ... there are not too many major brands that I haven't tried. Wersi and Tyros are the only two big-boys that I never wanted. Chocolate and Vanilla, I guess.
Peace, all.
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No longer monitoring this forum. Please visit www.daveboydmusic.com for contact info

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#377234 - 12/06/13 07:06 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: Ensnareyou]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2444
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Ensnareyou

You got it. today if anyone can half a** carry a tune, even in a bucket, they're out there doing there thing with canned backing. Very little dedication to learning a craft or talent involved. Actually an easier gig then being a good DJ.
Your also correct in that the really great ones have some sort of innate talent that no amount of practice can equal. IE: one of my favorites Erroll Gardner. Couldn't read a note. How about Art Tatum, where did all that come from ? LOL 1 The list goes on.
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#377235 - 12/06/13 07:45 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: Bill Lewis]
Stephenm52 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/13/05
Posts: 5126
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Bill Lewis
Ensnareyou


Your also correct in that the really great ones have some sort of innate talent that no amount of practice can equal. IE: one of my favorites Erroll Gardner. Couldn't read a note. How about Art Tatum, where did all that come from ? LOL 1 The list goes on.


+ 1

I studied piano for quite a number of years and once upon a time I had pretty fair sight reading skills............but the bottom line no matter how much I practice(d) always considered myself a "Frustrated" musician. I've had my share of success in life ..........but the one thing has evaded me is real success in the music world I guess it's the same reason I chose a different career path many years ago. When I hear some of those here who earn their living playing music I think why do I even bother...........but I know I enjoy playing even if I only play a couple gigs a month.

Musician or technical expertise? Neither.

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#377238 - 12/06/13 07:52 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
I could have made a lot more money in another field. (In fact I did on a couple of occasions.) However there's something about succeeding, at least at some level, at what you love doing that's really satisfying.
Most people who try to make it as an entertainer don't really treat it as a job. You have to take care of business, in addition to being at least a passable musician or singer.
I learned to read music as a trumpet player, and that skill helped me in learning to play keyboard, but it's not the way I play now. Just learn the chord structure and play the melody and/or fills around that. Sounds simple now.
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DonM

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#377250 - 12/06/13 08:16 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
Dreamer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/23/01
Posts: 3849
Loc: Rome - Italy
Errol Garner couldn't read a note... but he happened to have perfect pitch, which means that you hear a note and can instantly name it (C, Eb, Bb, etc) or even correctly identify all the notes within a chord. Pretty useful when you are trying to learn a song and don't have a music sheet or maybe want to transcribe a solo.
I haven't had such a luck and so, when I started playing the guitar (around 15 years), spent hours with my ear glued to the gramophone to understand what the guy was playing exactly; I even slowed down the speed from 33 to 16 rpm, but of course the pitch went down as well...
Today we have transcriptions and all kind of pitch-shifting devices, but I still get frustrated when I am playing a song and then try a little improvisation but soon run out of ideas or my fingers refuse to play what I hear in my brain, and then I regret not having had a proper education in music, so I could at least play all those scales up and down the keyboard.
But here again technology helps: I can record a track at a time, correct my mistakes redoing small bits instead of the whole song and finally come to a result that leaves me somehow satisfied.
The most difficult part has been stopping regretting not to be a better player and instead accepting my own limits: within those limits music has given me a lot of pleasure and, when I am deep immersed in the arranging process, often come up with musical ideas that really surprise myself.
I consider this a gift from the Heavens and can only guess what kind of elation must give composing a whole song, especially one of those timeless classics that we still enjoy to play.
_________________________
Korg Kronos 61 and PA3X-Pro76, Roland G-70, BK7-m and Integra 7, Casio PX-5S, Fender Stratocaster with Fralin pickups, Fender Stratocaster with Kinman pickups, vintage Gibson SG standard.

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#377252 - 12/06/13 08:20 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
Love your attitude Doc! We all can learn from it!
I do envy those with perfect pitch. I have a friend who is blind and can tell you instantly any or all notes in a chord, or even a just a fistful of random notes. He said he can best define the gift as seeing the notes as we see colors. Every one has a unique identity and doesn't sound like any of the others. Right!
He also told me that it is sort of a curse as well, because if there is an off note anywhere it jumps out at him like a snake.
_________________________
DonM

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#377255 - 12/06/13 08:43 AM Re: Technical expertise or musicianship? [Re: captain Russ]
124 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/01/09
Posts: 2195
I'm a bit similar, Don. I tried music lessons a long time ago but quit early on - kept getting ahead of myself. Fast ears an' all that. While I don't have perfect pitch, I'm strong on relative pitch, which I think is the nub of being able to play, not virtuoso in the grand sense, but for everyday, all-purpose gigging it works just fine. And I sing well and on pitch. That's pitch relativity kicking in again. For who knows what reason, I was just born with this stuff and I think I've used the gift well.

Think of all the pleasure you've brought to people over the years. That's a nice contribution to have made to the world. And let's hope we can continue to do that for as long as possible.

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