Well now that most of the world has received their NEW Tyros 5 arranger KB's......please post your Reviews and your DEMOS for all to see & hear please,........I'm sure many people are on the fence, or just want to know, & are curious as to your first reviews.

Thought there would be more then this or is it too early?

Hi,

I'm guessing it's still too early. Mine is being delivered the day after Christmas but I'm sure it would take some time playing it to offer a good review. I'm sure everyone who got theirs before Christmas has played them but it's probably hectic finding extra time to spend with it considering a busy holiday anyway. I am really looking forward to more reviews from the people we know here. -charley

I have mine since mid November and I love the T5.
To be honest this forum is not the place for me (anymore) to put my reviews/experiences in, because the 'mine is better than yours culture' and Yammie slamming posts.
I prefer a forum that is not dominated by 4-5 superposters that keep asking questions all the time, posts URL's and hardly/never show themselves.
Just my opinion and I know a couple of buddies share it.

All Tyros 5 Users are invited to join CssSongS... and share their songs... Novice, Professional, young, old, tall or short, All are welcome

www.csssongs.com

My Tyros 5-76 arrived at 10AM this morning. It was out of the box, hooked up to my sound system, firmware updated and playing within 15 minutes. I played it for 5 straight hours even eating my lunch beside it. My Tyros 5 stays at home and is hooked up to an Onkyo 150 watt 2 channel receiver powering 2 KLH 15" tower speakers. I have had this setup since my PSR 3000 and it still sounds great. My first general impression of Tyros 5's sound was that the highs shriek a bit to much for my liking. The midrange seems more pronounced and the bass is definitely punchier. I haven't changed any of the settings on the receiver as I wanted to notice what was initially different on the Tyros 5. I haven't played with any of Tyros 5's settings yet either.

When choosing styles the first thing I noticed were the audio styles all are listed first. There are 2 tempos shown, the first being the default, and I'm guessing the second is the highest suggested tempo for the style. I need to look this up. They have come a long way with time stretching. I was very pleased to hear nothing sounding funny or un-natural going thru the tempo range live. Just for fun I reduced the tempos to ridiculous levels and was presented with very unusual results. DJ's might like this discovery ad many of the drum parts repeat in an unusual matter. Many have said that the audio styles are song specific but I found that by changing tempos on the same style the whole style seemed to be more appropriate for a different song. I found these audio styles perfect for my adlib playing. I make my own melodies following a style and like the creativity aspect. I haven't loaded the MFD yet so don't even know what songs these styles are for. In the past I seldom liked the results the Music Finder gave especially when using it backwards as the Repertoire feature does. I would never have made my edited styles so unique if I didn't find creative ways to match styles to songs.

Something I should have mentioned earlier........I bought the 76 key model because people here have been asking for one for years. I thought I would like the extra keys. It never occurred to me to check what the left most key was. 61 key Tyros's start at C1 while the 76 key starts at E0. I assumed it would start a whole octave lower at C0. For me playing full or AI chords with my left hand these extra keys on the low end mean nothing. And that doesn't give me the extra keys I thought I would have at the higher end. I thought I could split the lower keyboard exactly 1 octave lower giving me the same lower key span to play chords as I always have thus giving me another octave of keys for the right hand. Unless I use different chord inversions than I'm used too I really can't change the split point to get more right hand keys. I wish the keys started at C. Knowing this now I could have saved $200 and bought the 61 key T5. The 76 keys do look impressive though.........

On with my review..................

All the styles and voices seem to sound better on T5 probably because it has a better sound engine. I love the additional voices especially in the strings, organs, and guitar sections. I like how the acoustic and electric guitars now have their own category. The string voices have a lot more choices with tighter instrument selections as opposed to general strings sections. The addition of first real and classic violins are what I mean. Using 3 right hand voices to create a string section can sometimes sound more realistic than using 1 general strings voice.

The electric guitars are some of my favorite voices. Just playing with them today I have never heard guitars more realistic.........especially with my playing skills. I never sounded so "polished" on Tyros 3 or 4. They always sounded like a keyboard imitating a guitar. I could close my eyes while I played today and I sounded like I was a guitar player. WAY COOL!!

Clearly for me my 2 favorite things about Tyros 5 are the Ensemble section and Organ World. I definitely need to delve into the mechanics more on how to best play the ensemble stuff. I immediately became frustrated trying to play the sting ensembles like I saw them played in some demos. My 2 hand 4 note technique seems to be missing something. So I took the easy way out today, turned on the harmony, and chose some free play styles. I performed some of the prettiest classical music I ever have. Absolutely beautiful. Definitely want to master this section. Hope to see some better tutorials on it than I've already seen.

I've saved the best for last and I can't help but get all emotional about it. Organ World is the best I have ever heard. I have a musical organ background, As a kid we had a Lowrey console in the living room. My mom had a piano background, took the free organ lessons that came with the organ, and then taught me a few things. My Dad has had no formal musical training but has always had the musical gift to teach himself. He's great on a guitar and taught himself the organ and plays his own creations beautifully. Mom can't play anything without sheet music and Dad can't read it. I am a product of both of them and share their skills. I can read music if I have to but usually perform without it. I can play copyrighted songs by ear but usually go off on a tangent playing adlib original stuff.

Enter Organ World.............I've got tons of computer software and huge libraries of organ samples. I converted an old Conn Theatrette organ that got destroyed in 2004 during Hurricane Charley. It was refitted with three m-audio 49 note midi controllers and a 25 note midi converted pedalboard and plays a Wurlitzer Theatre virtual program called MiditZer. Today Tyros 5's Organ World blew them all away. The theater and concert organs are the best I have ever heard. I played some simple hymns and classical stuff using an ethereal free play style and the concert organ. As I progressed from the quieter organ settings to the mighty tutti while moving up thru the style variations I felt a musical rush thru me that was awesome. I was glued to the keys and had tears running down my face as the music filled the virtual cathedral I was performing in............................I need a tissue. These are incredible voices!!!

The theater organ was next. There's a new style in the ballroom section among the theater style that is freestyle. I used it with the theater presets and was very impressed. The other theater organ styles like the march and quickstep were fun too.

It would be great if a group of us could edit organ world sounds, modify and create new ones, and share them with all of us organ lovers here. For me there never was a question of whether to upgrade to Tyros 5 from Tyros 4. I've upgraded since Tyros 2 thru the models and never have been disappointed. I like having the latest technology in the latest model. I've watched keyboards thru the years go from very cheesy sounding to so realistic it doesn't sound like a keyboard. My old Tyros 4 belongs to a new owner and is still a wonderful keyboard. It doesn't sound any worse but Tyros 5 really shines better in a few areas. I don't know if audiences will hear all the differences but as a player I can and appreciate them. I know I am gonna LOVE this board!!!!! -charley

Charlie, I was confident you would love what you would hear.

All the best,

Gary

Congrats Charley enjoy your new KB.....dont worry you will get used to the E0 in time......great for left handed bass.. enjoy.

Well Charley, you sound very pleased. Congratulations on your new Tyros5.

Ian

I agree that the Ensemble Voices take some getting used to. I hope that Yamaha people explain how to use the voices and perhaps come up with an expansion program based on the Ensembly
Voices. Heidrun Dolde has a video on UTube showing how to use
the Ensemble voices but it's in German with English printed
beneath the video. Worth watching. Lloyd

This remark kind of worries me, especially because is in agreement with something that Ian posted a few days ago (about the Tyros 4 having a "sweeter" sound, compared with the Tyros 5).

Roel,

I remember you from the time when you had an SD1, which you later dumped to buy one of the first G-70 (plagued with problems) and then a Tyros, so you can believe me if I say that I wish that you would contribute more here.
My experience is that each Internet Forum has its own "atmosphere", and this in turn is determined by its members.
It's impossible to like each and everyone of them and this applies to all the Fora, including those dedicated to specific brands of keyboards (hint, hint...)
Personally I think that a Forum where everybody agrees with all the others is kind of boring, and this applies also to the unwritten rule "You don't criticize my song and I won't criticize yours". The result is an atmosphere that reminds me of those places where everybody smiles and acts politely and you always wonder what they really think of you.
To give you an example, if I were to post a song and the only comments received would be stereotyped phrases like "Thank you for sharing" or maybe "A real foot-tapper", I would think that I have wasted my time and move away, to a place where people aren't afraid to speak their mind.
Of course I like a polite behavior, but cannot stand hypocrisy; I think that there is a fine line that divides one from the other and this line is what, in my opinion, we should aim to.

From some of the demos I've heard of the T5, I've also noticed the sounds appear thinner of even 'tinny' until you apply some tweaking. Although many people might be ok with doing the tweaking, I prefer the effects already applied to the sounds on my T4 ootb, I don't really want to waste time trying to create new registrations with hundreds of adjustments. I really like how both the T3 and T4 sounded by default. I'm sure that the T5 can be made to sound incredible but this requires the effort first whereas with the T4 it sounds fantastic as it is.

Charlie,
Great review of the new T5. I'm still sitting "on the fence" with my T4 wondering whether it is worth the move but you have definitely nudged me toward the T5.
Dick

The remark I made about the T5 sounding harsh was only my first impression. I only made that remark showing that connecting T5 to my existing unchanged sound system showed I thought T5's highs were harsher. I'm sure changing some settings will yield a much better sound to my ears. I'd be interested on some others posting any EQ or similar settings they changed. Whether it was T2, T3, or T4 I remember making adjustments to all of them. Perception of sound quality is such a personal matter. I doubt if one setting could satisfy everyone. Room acoustics, headphones or speakers, audio gear, perhaps age make us all have a different perception of sound quality. I wouldn't worry about it............. -charley

The T5 has lost most of the previous Yamaha CD like (Smooth) sound, and replaced it with a more live band feel, and this may be the reason you think it sounds bright and harsh. (Live bands don’t have round edges)

Hope this helps

Bill

This shrieking espescially is noticable when you play notes out of the natural instruments range... I dont really see this as a problem..

On top of that, the sweeter sounds can be created by adding more reverb... All that overdone reverb is what some people liked about the T4 sounds...

For me, I have a different view on what constitutes "live" sound and it has not as much to do with the actual (overall) sound of the arranger, as it does with how the arranger is being played.

There are players who play with every note exactly on the beat, use no passing or even slightly complex chords, use very few fills (or too many), who play guitar, sax, organ, strings etc. voices, in the same manner they play a piano...and, the overall sound produced (and performance) falls far short of what could have been achieved. In other words, the amount of "liveness" is created by the performer or player.

Maybe "realism" is a closer word than "liveness"?

I have heard recordings of people playing the Audya (which I consider to have the most realistic sounding rhythm section) sound much less like a live band than someone playing an entry level arranger, because the player's approach and performance on the former was wooden and bland.

I also concede that some arranger brand's drum kits have more "punch" than others, although more equality can be achieved with proper EQ'ing and kit choices.

To clear up the "sweetness" thing, I was referring to the "richness" and "warmth" I hear in the instrument's overall sound (played through the same speakers with the EQ set to flat). The Tyros2 and Tyros4 had a very similar overall tone, and the Tyros and Tyros3 had a strong sonic resemblance. This, of course, is my personal opinion. I have played all these instruments extensively during my work with Yamaha, and got to know each of them at a very deep level, and I spent many hours a day playing and listening through the same speaker system, and also through high quality headphones.

The Tyros3 (and Tyros) were less detailed; e.g. the separate instruments in the style blended together and were less distinct. I keep thinking of the word "blunt" but it's not quite that extreme. The Tyros2 and Tyros4 had more detail and crispness, and, overall were less fatiguing to my ears when used with headphones.

Getting the Tyros3 to nearly the same level of detail as the Tyros4 required a fair bit of work, whereas the latter sounded excellent right out of the box.

I don't want to form my impression of the Tyros5 solely based upon on-line demos, as that isn't fair in my opinion, but I should know more in a week or so, as I am doing a private clinic for a Tyros5-76 owner, who will be bringing the instrument to my apartment, and we will be using my Yamaha MS-60S for both, so a side to side comparison with my Tyros4 should be fairly accurate. He also had a Tyros3 from new, which was just sold to be replaced by Tyros5.

Ian

Ian,

We will be watching for your comparison remarks.

Considering your past association with Yamaha, I expect to get a realistic comparison by you.

Bill G

we are looking forward to your report...

Yes... and -if I may make a joke- this whole thing reminds me of that film with Dan Aykroyd and Eddie Murphy (Trading places) where Don Ameche and Ralph Bellamy were anxiously awaiting the predictions on the orange harvest to decide what to do in the stock market.

Bill,

I'll be as unbiased as possible, and try my best not to play favorites with my own Tyros4.

I have to do a new OS upgrade install on the Tyros5-76 first, I believe, and load in my own styles, as my buddy uses mostly ones that I've edited, which is kind of flattering since Johnny used to be Glen Campbell's on road piano player...hence the Tyros5-76.

He still has and uses a Yamaha 9000Pro, but wants something that can handle the newer styles (mega-voice etc.)

I really enjoy watching him play, especially the old Country tunes.

I'll probably have a good bit of time with it, and hope to explore the Ensemble feature and the Organ section as I have another buddy looking to see if a Tyros5 will work in a Worship/Choir situation.

Ian

Oh man, I wish i could be a fly on the wall while you two are at it.

My wife knew Glenn as a kid - he had it pretty rough back then, but he already had a great talent for the guitar.

Bill G

Perhaps if Yamaha people weren't 'mine is better than yours'-ing other brands, and slamming other brands as much as you feel Yamaha is getting slammed, you'd have a point.

Well put bill if you have played the T5 live and not just listened You tube demos, I played one of about 30 mins and I would buy one, I will certainly guarantee one thing, they will probably sell more T5 than T4 that's the way it is, Yamaha are doing something right and you can't deny that, and they will sell more T5 than all the other manufactures put together. They make what people want, simple.

Thats very true, Yamaha makes what people want... but sadly not what pro musicians want..

Not quite correct, but close...if you check around on the sites, there are quite a few pro musicians using Tyros2/3/4/5, including myself and several SZ members.

In fact, some pros and advanced players are using mid-line arrangers from various other brands as well as Yamaha.

Yes, Yamaha's sequencer and voice editing are not quite as extensive as some other brands, but many pros want something that not only sounds great out of the box, but has very strong factory and third party support.

Just because something is easy to use, and requires less fiddling with to make it sound great, doesn't automatically exclude it from being used by advanced and/or pro players.

The only area that Yamaha hadn't covered was the availability of a 76-note keyboard, and that has been corrected with the new Tyros5-76.

There was a time when professional players would turn their noses up at an arranger from any brand, but that has been changing quite a bit over the last decade or so.

Ian

Don't know if this was posted already or not, but regarding review of the tyros 5, I came across something that is recognizably improved from the s950.

And that is: Audio drums "fill-in". On the s950 if you did a fill-in on an audio drums style a little too early, or late; it would not play the fill in. Basically it would only play the fill-in if you hit it at exactly the right time. Anyone with a psr s950 knows what I mean.

Well, this problem is eliminated on the t5. You can hit the fill whenever you want and it will play normally like a regular style.
Thought i'd mention it.

What bothers me about Yamaha Tyros% etc is this:... how many people are interested in this Ensemble feature?.....or organ world? seems to me they could have utilized R&D features implemented in so many other ways to accommodate the players needs instead...or is targeting the old time wooden console organ players something to keep their pockets filled with profit.?

..........."old time wooden console organ players"


Guilty as charged. -charley

maybe a Tyros PRO model is in the works for the future?

Mind you, we are using those things because there's nothing BETTER currently offered... But it isn't always a perfect fit. A pro is probably a bit more concerned with size and weight than most home players, and is usually a bit more concerned with in depth editing than most home players. On the whole, I'd say that only Korg offer a REAL 'pro' keyboard arranger, with virtually as much editing capabilities as a WS (the usual tool of choice for most pro players).

But there's still a boatload of stuff the pro player gets with a WS that's missing from most arrangers, including arpeggiators and multitrack audio recording, full synth capabilities with a ton of knobs, loopers and the like.

The two ARE converging, to a degree, but not fast enough for me..!

They will never merge fully as that is suicide for profits....
more choices = more profits

The pro can afford more than the home user (often!)...

I see no reason why something at the top end of the price spectrum can't give us what we want. That shouldn't scavenge sales at the lower end.

In the meantime, I think we need more and better tabletop arranger modules. Most WS's are sophisticated enough to be able to task their buttons and knobs/sliders to control a really good arranger module. I really like my BK-7m, but would go ape for a BK-9m! Run that from a Kronos or a MotifXF, wow! What a combo!

More than a couple KLA4

That would not fit the strategy of Yamaha... If you are a pro, and need pro features, go MOTIF..

But then, the MOTIF hasnt had a real update in almost 6 years

What happened ...before people got their new T5 kbs thats all you heard, now since many revived them, these people have disappeared from the forum lately ...is it that they are overwhelmed with excitement? or?...I for one want to hear first thoughts pro/con & demos from new T5 users.
Over 1800 views & 36 posts???

Diki,

Funny but I agree with your post about merging the WS with the Arranger - I doubt it would hurt any sales at all - just the opposite in fact.

And - that just may be what Korg has in mind for their next big reveal.

Bill G

That's may be so although I doubt it ......for it to be any success at a merger players of all levels need to be TAUGHT how to OPERATE a Arranger/WS hybrid, ...either with online instructional tutorials on every feature or DVD's etc, ......difficulties many times turns perspective buyers off.

I agree Donny keep it simple for simple folks

Tony it just makes sense these KB's are loaded with so many features many don't even indulge in or use because they have no idea what to do with them...how many times have you heard someone say "Really,..I didn't even know that was in there" ? lol..
I could never understand why manufacturers wont take the effort in teaching the buyer How To Use The Product IN DEPTH....I'm sure people would buy instruction if needed at all levels......it makes for a more enjoyable experience as NO ONE knows it all right?

Hey guys make up your own mind, but just listen to that crappy Korg Church organ.

I have a T5. 76 and I really like it. Over all the sound it very good I have been using it at home my case has not been delivered maybe in the next few days.

I want to say one big important thing is that it has been designed to cut in a live situation I used it yesterday in a rehusal for New Years and it really cuts thru all the others a big difference you can hear all the parts very clear that is very important for the live guy it has a very live sound much improved over T4 in this area. Vintage organ very good still working trying to dial it in I will use it on Tuesday night for first time I will post more after that.

Ron

Ron, can you do some live recordings while on the job using the onboard recorder? I think that would be nice to post and I, for one, would be interested in hearing them. Just might get a T5, or whatever is out at the time, when I decide to retire.

Gary

Don't feel bad about agreeing with me, Bill! I get it right every now and again... even a stopped clock is right twice a day!

Don't forget, guys... the Arranger/WS hybrid is being talked about in the context of what PROS need. Most arrangers are already simple enough (in fact, most of them are far more complicated than most home or amateur users will ever need or use!).

But amateur or pro, nobody ever says a WS needs to be simpler... I'm not sure why the arranger market needs such dumbed down products. All the arranger needs is an OS with the hard stuff buried in sub menus, and the easy stuff at the top level.

Win/win...