How is this for a display?
Deane

The only problem with the larger displays/monitors, is they tend to block the audience's view of the performer. And, they also believe you are doing nothing more than Karaoke.

Good luck,

Gary

They think karaoke anyway lol....especially when they hear all that music.

That's why I take the time to do a great demo of the keyboard. You would be amazed at the number of people that just say "WOW!" And, I do this demo a lot - too many KJs out there today.

Cheers,

Gary

they see you operating an automatic device and that's all they see and hear....and in their mind that relates to DJ....singing helps the realism vision.

No, for me, since I began doing the demo, there's no question in anyone's mind that it's me singing and me playing. Try it sometime, you'll be amazed at the results.

While I was in the Florida Keys a couple years ago, and playing at a Tiki Bar, a vacationing charter captain I knew came up to me and said, "Neat Karaoke machine, Gary." I found out that his charter fishing business, like all charter fishing businesses nationwide, was slowly falling apart. He started up a KJ business on the side, something he could pick up a few bucks on weekends doing if there were no charters booked.

I responded to his statement "No, it's not a KJ machine, it's me playing and me singing - no CDs, no anything other than me." Then, before things got out of hand, I said, "I'm going to take a short break, why don't you sit here and do a few numbers?" He sat down, took one look at the keyboard, I plugged in a handheld mic for him to use, and walked to the restroom on the other side of the pool. No sounds came out of the sound system. When I came back, he was sitting at a bar stool sipping on a beer. "I guess I was wrong." He said. I smiled, went back to work, and kept the place rocking till 10 O'clock that evening, packed up and went hitched a ride back to my boat for me and the gear.

Until I let him sit down behind the keyboard, you could have never convinced him that I was not using CDs or KJ files in the netbook and singing with them. He quickly found out that was not the case. If you don't provide an occasional demo to your audiences, you are doing a disservice to both the audiences and yourself. Of course, there will always be the lone skeptic that cannot be educated as to what you are actually doing, but the more I do the demos, the less of them that seem to be around.

Most of the time, the demo only consists of a single song, and the four variations associated with the style file. I usually begin by showing them the various components of the style file itself, turning on each segment one at a time, beginning with the drums. Then I demonstrate the various right hand instruments while the style file is playing, usually without changing the chord. Finally, I kick into a song that is associated with that particular style file, sing the song, play some instrumental runs, and hit an ending. This all takes just a few seconds longer than playing the song itself, and well worth the rewards of what it brings.

Now, if your audiences think you are a DJ or KJ, then maybe you are using too many MP3s or MIDI files during your performances. The only MP3s I use are during breaks, and during a 4-hour performance, I might use 2 or 3 MIDI files at most. I prefer not to use them at all. Once I learn a song, sometimes with the aid of a MIDI file, I then go about the task of trying to find a suitable style file, thereby eliminating the MIDI file entirely. Sometimes, finding that perfect style only takes a few minutes, but there are times, such as right now, that it could take days, and I still will have to modify the style somewhat to make it sound the way I wish. The song I'm working on right now is "With You I'M Born Again." And, I hope to record it with my daughter doing the female vocal parts. When it's done, I'll post it.

Like I said, give the demo a try - you'll me amazed at the results,

Gary

It can also be useful to play some pieces of dry piano in between, which shows that you play live. But a demo of some sounds is really a good idea, too.

Similar to Gary, I had a skeptic come up in a break and say, " Well, the machine does all the work for you." So I said, "Okay, then sit yourself down and play me something." And away he went, stage left, with a sheepish look on his face.

well in a way he is mostly right ....you are operating an automatic instrument with your chords and notes.....that is what an arranger KB is all about....

Gary I have no problem with my audiences enjoying all my shows as I give them 150% every time......
playing with Styles, Mp3's, Singing, Custom Backing tracks, I use it ALL to make them happy what's the difference they LOVE it baby!!.....I am not going to waste their precious time which they hired me for to explain what is going on.....in their minds they love it BIG Time and I want to give them every minute of the show they deserve.
I am not ashamed to be talented enough to do it all for them...after all that's what I do entertain people for almost 50 years.. & the phone never stops ringing year after year because of it. Don't give away your secrets on stage just do a great job for the audience.

carry on

I really don't see anything automatic when you are playing an arranger keyboard. It it was automatic, it wouldn't need those black and white keys. We essentially control every aspect of the arranger, we select the components of the style we wish to utilize, then we play those components in the chords we select, much the same way an organ, accordion, piano, etc... is played. the only real difference is the looping, which is looped at the tempo we select and control. The right hand comps and instrumental runs are obviously, not automatic. All of this relies on the skills of the person sitting behind the keys.

Donny, I give them 150 percent every time I get on stage - it's what we do. The difference is in how we provide that entertainment and the tools we utilize. I just found the style I wish to use for the song I'm working on. Now I'm in the process of modifying the OTS settings, tempo, and other style components to make it sound the way I want it to sound. Another couple hours and I'll have it ready to use. Or, I guess I could spend $5 and download a midi file from Hittracs or some other site and not play the keyboard at all. NAH! I'll keep doing it the hard way.

Gary

Gary.....honestly you select a style.....and thru your chord changes the AUTOMATIC accompaniment plays the style which in reality is a midi file .....in no way are you playing the base line, or any other parts in the style manually the computer inside the unit is driving it under your control no more no less..I repeat the PARTS ACCOMPANIMENT being played are AUTOMATICALLY playing because of the chords it recognizes....I would give more credit to someone who multi-tracks a sequence SMF tracks by track vs playing a premade style.
They all sound good .....just a different way of operating the finished result, now the right hand is a different story.....I like them all and use them to their fullest on stage.
And sing also.

Donny, you know as well as I do that most people that use MIDI files don't make them themselves - they either pirate them off one or more of the sites on the Internet, or they buy them with embedded lyrics from one or more of the many pro midi sites online for under $5 a pop. The vast majority of the players wouldn't take the time to create their own MIDI files. If you do, more power to you my friend - but most folks do not!

Gary

Gary I know many many top pro players who use their own custom made midi files songs and let me tell you they sound amazing on stage ....but that's a whole other can of beans....there are many ways to make music....
don't go thru life as a musician with BLINDERS on...explore, experience, & enjoy!!

I much prefer styles as opposed to SMF because I get to choose the chords (and re-harmonize if I so wish; very difficult on a SMF unless you strip it down to only bass and drums) and also I can change styles in the middle (or any point) of a tune at will and completely change the character of the tune.

Plus, it's extremely easy to extend the length of a song literally on the fly...putting markers in SMF works okay, but most people don't bother to learn how.

Like Gary, it has been my experience that nearly everyone who use SMF are using commercial files and it's extremely rare to find anyone who makes all their own SMF from scratch. In fact, very few do any editing of the files at all, as the majority available (especially the commercial ones) are already very good to excellent.

I don't really care one way or the other how other players use their arranger...I just know that using styles has always worked a treat for me.

As far as the visual aspect from the audience...I don't kid myself that they think I'm playing all the parts, but they can see me doing lots of left hand chording and plenty of right hand work including using pitch and mod wheels. I don't sing so there is no voice covering the melody, so I have to work especially hard with proper sound/style choices to keep things interesting.

I've always worked steady and often at great paying gigs so I must have been doing something right. Even after retirement, I still get the occasional call, but unless it's extremely lucrative, or something for a close friend, I usually turn it down.

Plus, I'd rather voluntarily put myself out to pasture, than die snortin', kickin', and twitchin' with my nose in the mud on the track. I'm not ready to exchange my Arranger for a Harp.

I still play everyday, either for my own fun, or with some friends/neighbors as audience.

I still feel the Arranger is the veritable Swiss Army Knife of keyboards....a little bit Preset (with some decent editing functions) synthesizer, a little bit Workstation...they've come a seriously long way from the boom-ticky-tacky 16 rhythms and 32 sound portables of not all that long ago.

I'm still on the honeymoon with my Tyros4 even after over two years of owning it, and it might possibly be my last major arranger purchase, as it covers my needs so perfectly.

Ian

So Donny, do you make your own SMF's from scratch?

I have in the past made my own smf its easy....but when needed I record custom backing tracks Mp3 play them off my laptop and play on top...

That's cool. I'm not sure I'd attempt at making them from scratch. I think they'd stick out like a sore thumb from the onboard styles.

124 ... I've made a number of backing tracks (SMF) using the on-board styles, changing drum kits, bass instruments, accomp voices, tempos ... etc. on both the kn6000 and the Pa900 ... on the Pa900, I've also recorded a vocal backing as an mp3 and played/sung over that ...

I wouldn't try to make one from 'scratch' either - wouldn't know where to start

being styles are a main feature using an arranger kb......and they all have the ability and tools to edit and create custom styles from scratch....and you need the talent as a player to be able to play well enough to create them properly.....manufacturers should start developing tutorial DVDS for beginner, intermediate, & advanced players so they can learn how to create styles for them selves......this would eliminate so many of the repetitious ones we already have which work well BUT sometimes you want to make the song parts your own with horn stabs, bass lines, specific string passages etc, etc, ...this is what making music is all about....
doing it YOUR WAY not having some company do it for you. don't doubt your abilities I know you can do it also...

Cheers, guys. Like yourselves, I don't lack for musical ability, playing or vocally, and I've made all kinds of tweaks - continually at it, in fact. I really should make more effort at this 'customising' game, though.

Making them from scratch can be a bit tedious, and at one time, that was the only way.

The player would need at least a basic set of arranging/playing skills (i.e. be able to play the bass lines, guitar parts, pads etc.), and a good sequencer program that allows easy editing.

For me, it sometimes becomes a combination of using a style for the basics, and then overdubbing the other parts to flesh it out, but more often than not, I can do the whole SMF with just a style only.

Ian

BTW...check your Private Messages.

Hi ... interesting topic ... like Gary, I also do a "demonstration" at some point during many gigs. I did a gig yesterday; it was at a place I hadn't played in ~6 months, and I could see plenty of "new" faces (as well as people I remembered). So, about halfway thru the gig, I told them a bit about the keyboard, played some quick lines on single sounds (piano, sax, clarinet, trumpet, organ, etc.) then quickly showed how I play/control a style (showing them that I use a foot-pedal to add drum fills), then showed them a quick song where I first showed that I had guitar in the left hand, piano layered with strings in the right, and a solo trumpet up on my 2nd little keyboard. I could tell some of them seemed fascinated with how it all works ... (esp.
based on the comments and questions after the gig).

I like the idea (can't remember who mentioned it) of playing an occasional piano-only piece; I do that, and sometimes play a classical medley that uses no styles (just piano, strings, an oboe, stuff like that) ... helps remind people that it's being done live etc.

-Jim

Cheers, Ian. Check your PM.

Try your PM again, 124...sorry about any mixup.

Ian

Getting back to the original post of the video monitor.
Unless you either enlarge the score to cover the screen or have something else there - like maybe 2 pages - that size screen seems like overkill. And, as Gary originally said, it blocks the audience's view of the performer. But then again, some of us should be hidden from view - lol.

The point has been entirely missed! The gentleman that uses this setup is a very accomplished player who has vision only in one eye. The scores and/or leadsheets can be enlarged to fill the entire screen if needed. He sets up sideways to the audience and it works very well for him. Where is it written that a keyboard player must face the audience???? His other option is to give it all up.
Deane

Dean, while it's not a hard, fast, written rule that you MUST face your audiences, I consider eye contact with my audiences a very important aspect of any performance. Without it, they may as well be listening to a radio.

Gary

Thanks for the photo. I was very interested in the display, and was trying to make out the name of the display. I was also surprised how quickly your post went south, missing the whole point of the information you were trying to share. Any info on the display used? Looks like IPS ??

The venue seems to be at a work shop of some sort, since there is another keyboard player along side with headphones. I doubt they were was an audience.

Regards,

Jerryghr

Right! The audacity of blind performers! Or do they think that musicianship and talent is all that matters?

On the other hand, Gary, who is self admittedly, half deaf, would require a "super" speaker system...ideally, one that would not block his eye contact with the audience.

Hey...wait a minute...he already has one...the Bose! That skinny old stick of a speaker wouldn't hide anyone as thin as...as...ah, well, you get the idea.

Way to go, Gary!

'Nuff said.

Ian