SHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

If there is any one player here who would be welcome on my bandstand, it would be my friend Don.

He'd not miss a beat. Good looking, talented and humble, too!

It'd be like Mutt and Jeff in a duo (LOL).

Good guy on ALL levels!

Russ

I have always made a point of playing with the very best players I could convince to play with me. One reason was to learn from them, but the other more dominant reason was to 'ride their coattails', to use THEIR superior talents to cover up my own musical deficiencies. So, in that regard, I am doing exactly the same thing as many arranger players. One difference, though, is that you have to bring enough to the table to get them to perform with you whereas an arranger KB is much more tolerant about who can play with it. You need only shell out a few grand to Guitar Center, sneak it past the wife, plug it in, select 'one-finger mode', and voilà', you're off to the races, baby; an instant 'pro'.

As far as Arrangers and Jazz, strange as it seems, I think 'Big Band Jazz' is one of the things Arrangers do best (in Style mode). The problem, though, is how many Big Band type numbers can you do before they all start sounding the same. Of course you can then switch to other (less effective) styles but by then the bloom is off the rose. Exceptional vocals, however, can make most of these negatives go away but how many exceptional vocalist do we have here playing arranger KB? I count maybe 5-6 here on SZ, speaking of which, hope Joe Ayala is recuperating well; he's one of the best.

Now as far as DonM driving to Atlanta to hear me play, I would definitely advise him to donate that gas money to charity (preferably Vets); Lexington, yes; Atlanta, no.

Happy holidays, everyone. Drive safely going back and forth to those holiday gigs. Remember, the life you save could be MINE.



chas

Chas, Veterans, St. Jude Hospital and the Shriners are the ONLY charities I support anymore! You and Russ probably spend more for lunch than I make in a week! I do appreciate the contributions and help you both give to so many!
My drive to work is 20 miles, but it's not like driving 20 miles in Atlanta!
Merry Christmas! I figure that even if you don't believe in God, you believe in Santa Claus!!

I LOVE Santa Claus. He'll bring you anything your credit card will cover and you don't even have to be good .

chas

"As far as Arrangers and Jazz, strange as it seems, I think 'Big Band Jazz' is one of the things Arrangers do best (in Style mode). The problem, though, is how many Big Band type numbers can you do before they all start sounding the same. Of course you can then switch to other (less effective) styles but by then the bloom is off the rose. "

You do exactly the same as any other creative musician would do Chas .You start to play different chord substitutions and progressions to take the same song and make it more interesting. How many times have you heard "autumn leaves" but each year some creative type takes the same song and twists it ever so slightly so it does not sound the same each time it played .

Most owners of these keyboards (arranger keyboards ) don't even realise that the style will change according to the chord substitutions they use ,so the same style can have multiple colours in terms of bass lines guitar riffs etc just by playing more exotic chords than just major or minor ones . And if you ever get tired of expanding your chording skills You can change some of the instrumentation, change the drum kit or the bass or rhythm guitar , and when you get tired of that you can start to copy and paste elements of other styles into the old style . Our friend Ian calls the "Frankenstyles " !

You can create many interesting and actually great styles within the same genre by mixing and matching styles . And when you get tired of that you might actually want to try to reprogram bits of the style maybe starting on the bass and drums , and when you get tired of that.........

Learn a new song ! Had my keyboard 10 years and the rose is still blooming and I have not purchased a new style yet from the thousands out there ignoring the thousands of free ones available .

Tomorrow I am taking part in a carol service ,the same service I have been doing for the last 5 years and pretty much the same carols but each year they are done differently . Some times with a full live band , sometimes myself with singers and guitarist , sometimes just my arranger and choir .

It's only our creativity that might be limited . You said correct at the top of this post . It's not the keyboard it's definitely the musician .

In my experience, quite often, very accomplished players of the more traditional keyboard instruments like Acoustic Piano, Rhodes and Organ, buy (or try out) an Arranger Keyboard and have a difficult time adjusting to the different set of skills (especially left hand/chording) required to play an Arranger Keyboard in style play.

Often these accomplished players want to play the arranger, in style play, at or near the same level of proficiency as they already have on their traditional keyboard, or at least at the level of some of the more advanced arranger players here on SZ, but, for some reason, maybe something as simple as being set in their ways, they just don't get around to investing the time and effort needed to acquire these skills.

For some reason, organ players have an easier time adapting, probably due the similarity in the way left hand chords are played...many piano players have a real hard time keeping that left hand from jumping around too much and triggering too many notes, thus confusing the Style Engine.

There is a reason the average Arranger Keyboard has 300-500 styles and several chord recognition modes, as well as buttons to vary the style patterns being played...the instrument's main intended use is style play, whether it be for "live" play, or recording projects, although the instrument's sequencer and sound editing features allow it to play the role of a Workstation Keyboard as well.

So, unless the accomplished player (but novice to Arranger Keyboards) learns these skills, the instrument gets returned, is stuck away in a corner, or, at the very most, is used as an extra keyboard/drum machine/MIDI file player...hardly exploiting its full potential, and becoming more than a bit of a disappointment to the player.

So, as Spalding says above, it's not the keyboard, it's definitely the musician.

And, as far as the alleged "stigma" attached to the Arranger Keyboard...well, all I can say is that it's pretty bad if one would allow the opinions of other people (musicians or otherwise) to dictate what musical instrument they should or should not play.

Ian