Quote by rikkisbears, the originator of this thread: “we seem to have gotten a bit off the track heehee. In my original posting I was trying to ask if( maybe I didn't word it too well) anyone knew, whether or not , potential new KN2600& Kn2400 owners were going to have access to the previous model kn styles. We kn7 owners had these styles made available to us on the kn7 website as .cst's and ast's which load into the custom memory of the kn7 keyboard. Just wondering if they were available anywhere as normal kn styles which should be able to be used in the 2 new kn keyboards.
best wishes
Rikki”.

tracknet, it seems the starter of this thread seems to think we have gotten off track as well as I do. In another of Rikki’s comments there is an attempt to explain to you the workings of the SD card. Far better and faster than floppies. You state you know nothing about the workings of the KN boards so Rikki is trying to enlighten your ignorance. Being ignorant of the technics operating system you claim to love the technics keyboard. Love the technics if it would work like the Yamaha in your estimation. If technics worked like a Yamaha they would have to take three giant steps backward into the world of dying technology. You say you love technics keyboards? How can you say that when you state to us you have no knowledge of how they work and then with great authority claim the KN’s have a great deficiency. I have a choice word for that but will not spell it out. Because you will not post on your profile the kind of instrument you play, if any, or what your interests may be I can only assume by your postings on this and the general forum that your interest is in comparing brands of keyboards and becoming an expert on the deficiencies of same.

tracknet, asking how many styles can be loaded into the keyboard is a legitimate question. Without any knowledge of (by your own admission) and then assuming none or not many can be loaded is illogical thinking. To extend that into making a determination that technics is therefore deficient is stupidity. Taking it to your ultimate deficiency by comparing it to Yamaha’s primitive floppy technology and determining it is better, without understanding or knowledge of the KN’s system, is the height of nonsense and shows where your coming from. What is your fault, you say? I’ll bet you still can’t figure it out!

tracknet, Quote: “sorry that was not my intention”. What was your intention? Quote: “To tell us you don't understand the way to play external styles, nor how many styles may load into the keyboard”? You seem to know that KN’s don’t play styles directly from a floppy. At least you know something. In light of this one fact of knowledge what seems to be your intention? To tell us because of this one fact our keyboard’s are thus deficient? Or maybe technics is second rate because they don’t follow the Yamaha way of doing things. Could be you enjoy and work for consumer reports and are in the business of product comparison and evaluation. However it seems they would require someone with a little understanding of the product they are evaluating. Never the less, I’m also sorry if my words are offensive to you but when your intent is to tell us our KN’s are inferior to Yamaha’s floppy’s compared to the KN’s SD cards, with no knowledge or understanding (according to your words), that is pure rubbish. Sorry! Rubbish is rubbish. Cow paddies are cow paddies. Evaluating something without understanding is evaluating something without understanding. Stupidity is still stupidity no matter what is the intention. If you have played and understood the operating system of both Yamaha and Technics and then choose the Yamaha floppy system in favor of the SD system that would be a genuine opinion of preference and you would have every right to express yourself. No fault except for the fact that it has nothing to do with the question at hand. However if you give an opinion without any understanding of the product, as you state, your opinion now becomes an uninformed opinion of preference with no credence. A statement of pure bias, sticking out like a sore thumb. As the old saying goes: Put your brain in gear before you turn on your tongue. As Jimmy (James) once said, the tongue seems hard to control. Then again I remember somebody of importance once said, remove the board out of your own eye before you try to remove the splinter out of someone else’s. Whoops! Think it’s time for me to shut up.

Grandpa Doug

Well, Douglas Dean, I think you are growing flat a nonsense globe.

I am not a stupid man, nor a yamaha agent or something like this, as you seem to think. I know perfectly SD CARD technology is far better than old floppies. And, from my experience and knowing, I think KN (and Roland) keyboards are, in a lot of aspects, far better than Yamahas. So, I don't know where does it comes from your intriguing suspects about me or my hidden intentions. It is only your mind.

I have a Roland kb, played some KN, Yamaha and Roland keyboards. Perhaps this year I will buy a new one, probably KN (or a new Roland if there is one this year, I will see), but not Yamaha (although Yamaha plays styles directly from floppy), I played Yamahas and don't like, listen Douglas, I don't like Yamahas, ok?

And so, I like to know more and compare. What a sin!! I read some forum writings referring no user area in kn2600/2400, and someone said me that KNs do not play styles directly from flopy or sd card. Because of that, I asked for a specific question about modern KNs, that is, managing external styles. And gave an opinion, a simple personal opinion: There is an advantage if an arranger keyboard may play external styles directly, from floppy or sd card, without to have loading them before.

You put in my mouth words I never said. You said my intention was “To tell you your keyboard’s are thus deficient, or maybe technics is second rate because they don’t follow the Yamaha way of doing things”. Nobody spoke about “deficiency”, only you. I never “claim with great authority the KN’s have a great deficiency” as you say. You said my intent was“to tell us our KN’s are inferior to Yamaha’s floppy’s compared to the KN’s SD cards” It is not true, of course, nobody compare floppys with sd cards; afterwards KN2400 have not sd card, only floppy, and someone said that time for loading a style from KN2400 floppy is 15 sec. I only said KNs have a disadvantage in the specific aspect to not playing styles directly from floppy (or sd card). And this statement has been said also to me for a friend and KN player. Technics are better than Yamaha in much other areas. What’ s the problem? Nobody compare Technics and Yamaha at all, only at a specific aspect. Nobody said Technics is deficient: to tell me stupid because to have said something I haven’t said is a stupidity so.

Your words, and your words “that will not spell it out” are a few offensive, honestly. I gave an opinion (perhaps wrong) about an aspect of a keyboard; you give an aggresive opinion, and not only about another opinion, but about a person, me. Great difference! Really, it is you wich seem to be a Technics agent, and not me a Yamaha or other agent. You (or Technics and you, it seems to be the same) feel be attacked by me, and I never had that intention at all. Why do you feel yourself attacked? That would be a good question.

Best wishes




[This message has been edited by tracknet (edited 07-01-2003).]

Hi Guys,
PLEASE , I didn't mean to start an argument.
I think there's a bit of confusion about Custom Styles and what I tried to say. (Hopefully I don't make it worse.)

There are 2 styles areas in the KN7.

The Custom Style area where you can load up to 20 of the individual .cst files ( styles)
(or as a group of up to 20 of these which called is .ast file) This is the styles area that the kn26&kn24 DOESN'T have.
(The kn custom style feature is similar to the flash style feature on a psr.

The other styles area is the composer style area. This is where you load and play your normal kn styles. In this area you can create & save new styles, edit existing styles etc. Load 3rd party styles. You can have up to 3 styles loaded ready for play in this area.
This is the area the KN7,KN2600 Kn2400 uses for external styles.

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by rikkisbears:
[B]Hi,
just wondering what extra styles are available for the KN2600& KN2400 Keyboards.
When we bought our KN7's , we were able to download custom styles (.cst's & .ast's) from previous model kn keyboards ( KN2 through to KN6's) via the kn7 website.

OK, OK tracknet I’m sorry and peace between us. Guess I got a little carried away. Think I get a little, maybe a lot, touchy on this subject because of past encounters on this subject of which and why my love, the KN keyboard, has a great disadvantage over the PSR Yamaha keyboards. Sorry I used the word deficiency instead of disadvantage. You are quite right. Guess I thought when something was at a disadvantage it was because of some deficiency in the product. Sorry.

The subject matter of rikkisbears had nothing to do with the comparing of other makes of keyboards or their methods but rather wondering what extra styles are available for the KN2600& KN2400 Keyboards and if and how they could handle them seeing the new boards have no custom styles area. You confirmed this from what you read and wondered also. Fine. OK. I suppose when you got into the area of comparing Yamaha keyboards and judging the KN as having a great disadvantage, (sorry about saying deficiency), that is where we got off subject and got feathers flying. Please accept my apologies and I now understand your position better. Thanks for expressing it more clearly. Awhile back there was a lot of negative talk about the KN keyboards and derogatory biased comments on this forum. This had a very negative effect on this Technics discussion forum as it did also on another technics forum. That forum is now closed. Hope it does not happen here. Because of this, as you all know, I am a little touchy on certain things. Sorry about that but that is the way old Grandpa is.

With the air cleared to some point, I have a possible solution to the original query of Rikki and you. All the styles are available in composer form or can be easily converted. If anyone does not have them I am sure there are more than one on this forum that will furnish them just for the asking. Such is this forum and the members thereof. If the new KN’s do not have a composer and a means to save these styles then I also will concede the KN’s are at a great disadvantage. (deficiency).

Grandpa Dougs final word.

P.S. tracknet, sorry about the misunderstanding and hope we will understand each other better in the future. I admire a man that will stand his ground and state his case with conviction. Always leads to better respect and friendship.

Ok, Douglas, peace between us.

I understand your feeling. There is a social presure to buy yamahas. A lot of store men say "better yamaha" (I have listened it), perhaps because a lot of store men don't have Tecnics at their store...? Why? I don't know.

When I asked for Technics, some honest but not good salesmen said to me: "Technics? I don't know Technics, sorry. I have only Yamahas".

And some not honest nor good salesmen said: "Oh, no, don't buy Technics; they aren't as good as Yamahas... (and I haven't Technics at my store, too)"

Only a honest and good salesman would say: "Technics? Yes, I have Technics. I will explain you the similarities and differences, pros and cons, of different arrangers. But you must play them, and decide yourself. I help you to decide only if you want".

Best wishes

Thanks

Grandpa Doug

Good work, gentleman.
That's the way disagreements are solved in an mature way.
Cees

Hi Douglas,

Last month I purchased a Kn 2400,(my 4th Technics board) & yes, it does have a composer feature....

I have been very interested in this thread of available styles for the 2400 as I have not been able to find very much info on this board...being new to this forum I would appreciate if you would please explain how I would go about collecting some extra styles...

I have downloaded some demo styles (just to see what models were compatible with my board) & it seems that styles for the 6000 & 6500 will play just fine....

Many Thanks,
FlutteringBy

Hi,
me again.
The reason I brought the subject up, is the fact that I'm an avid style collector. One of the main reasons that helped me to decide on the kn7 instead of other competion, is the fact that Tecnnics had made their earlier styles available to KN7 owners.

I've had kn's from the early kn800 all the way thru to the kn5000. I'd always saved the internal styles before replacing for the newer model. Back in 1998 I sold my kn5 and all my other gear, as I'd decided I'd give up my music hobby. ( I took up making teddy bears, much to my husbands delight, less strain on the bank book hee hee)
I stored all my style disks safely, just in case I decided to take music up again.
Well a couple of years ago, I decided to get another keyboard. To my horror, I discovered that most of my beloved style disks, had been corrupted during storage.

Well, I ended up getting a Yamaha instead of a KN6500 . I decided on the psr mainly because of the free style availability on an internet group

Last year new keyboards were due out again. I was either going to replace my psr or MAYBE check out the new kn. The desicion was made for me when I discovered I could get all my wonderful old styles back via the kn7 website.

Even though my technic/yamaha dealer, is an avid technics fan, he wasn't even aware or understood of all the kn7's wonderful features ie sd card functions, sd audio functions.
I didn't realize how great these features were till after I bought the kn7.
It was actually the sweetener of all the free styles that made me go for the kn again.

As for the KN styles from the kn7 website. Is it actually okay to share them??? I'm currently in the process of converting the .cst's into composer styles for my own purposes, but, I wasn't sure if we were allowed to share, and how to acually go about it. I didn't want to get myself into trouble.

best wishes
Rikki

I have not been able to find very much info on this board...being new to this forum I would appreciate if you would please explain how I would go about collecting some extra styles...


I have heard a great deal about getting styles. I realize that some are new to keyboard, and there are many who have collected hundreds of styles. I have not seen much on how to edit the exsisting style, or possibly creating a new one.

There many areas that can not be created without special talent, but to learn how to edit or adjust a small section of the style is not that difficult.

My vote is to start sharing the basics about style editing on this forum. Creating can be lot's of fun, and it is you that you listen to when you're done. Just a thought.

How blessed we are to be able to play, share and create music.

Wishing everybody has a great day, John C.